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Why the low UT3 adoption?

Discussion in 'Unreal Tournament 3' started by TehLlama, Aug 12, 2009.

  1. Hideinlight

    Hideinlight Member

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    If you want to see some good netcode, check out HoN...
    Still have no idea how they do it. With 400 ping I'm able to throw a javelin with minimal delay.
    With 250 it feels like you playing on a LAN
     
  2. DarkSonny

    DarkSonny Beware!

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    Homepage please?
     
  3. Hideinlight

    Hideinlight Member

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    http://heroesofnewerth.com/
    Still in beta though and not quite a fps, but it's by far the most responsive game I've played online to date.

    When there is lag, it feels like if the game is skipping frames. That might give some clues.
     
  4. Alhanalem

    Alhanalem Teammember on UT3JB Bangaa Bishop

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    I play that as well. If you're interested in checking it out, give me an email and I'll send you a beta invite.

    And he's right, their netcode must have gained some kind of lag compensation since Savage 2 (same engine, click link in sig for info, fun game) because no matter your ping, the gameplay is smooth and responsive.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2009
  5. DannyMeister

    DannyMeister UT3 Jailbreak Coder

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    I've been pretty pleased with HoN, but seriously, it is much easier to deal with lag in an RTS type of game than in an FPS. For the most part aiming has nothing to do with it. You click on a spell, then click on an enemy, and he's hit. When you are looking down at units, lag isn't as noticeable as when your point of view is changing with your character. In HoN when things get laggy, game play gets choppy like you have an extremely low framerate. Just think about that if you were in first person view... your position jumping along every quarter second would look horrible! UT3's guesses at object location on client side and occasional corrections from the server is better. I for one find UT3's experience online better than TF2 though it seems not everyone agrees. Under even slight lag i can't hit anything with the sniper in TF2.
     
  6. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    Plus in an isometric game it's just easier to fake. Since every hit is a "guarantee" (or a static calculation perhaps based on random rules) you can easily do it on the client side in many cases with no ill effects or desyncing with the server (which would explain the appearance of dropped frames).
     
  7. Alhanalem

    Alhanalem Teammember on UT3JB Bangaa Bishop

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    Some things in HoN do need to be aimed, though the level of precision required isn't anywhere near what you need to aim a gun in an FPS
     
  8. rhirud

    rhirud Fast learning novice

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    Why low uptake?

    Because Deathmatch is too difficult for novice players, CTF was full of aimbots and there was no cheat protection or way to ban antisocial or lame players, leaving War as the only way to get the game established.

    War failed because all the maps are chokepoints - so if there are players that are too good for you, in ut2004, you could go to another bit of the map. In ut3, you will get fragged over and over, for this round, and the next map, and the next map after that since the teams are not balanced or randomised either.

    In a nutshell, Epic thought they knew best, ignored everything that the commnity had done to improve ut2004 (team balancing, very big ONS maps, team randomisation) and dumbed it down. They thought their niche was people who want in your face gore.

    The actual ut2004 players were fans of an an in depth, intelligent, high learning curve difficult game that takes a lot of practice and mastery.

    They made the same difficult high learning curve game but with no tutorial, and gave it an in your face, gansta front end. It is that essential incongruity that broke the game, and all the sub decisions that derived from that initial and wrong creative direction.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2009
  9. Alhanalem

    Alhanalem Teammember on UT3JB Bangaa Bishop

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    UT3 doesn't have a high learning curve, and the first few missions of the campaign serve as a tutorial.
     
  10. JohnDoe641

    JohnDoe641 Killer Fools Pro Staff Member

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    Yes it does.

    Even I had to do some rather serious adjusting to UT3 before I got to a level I felt I could be of use to my team. People who are just jumping into the game get completely blown away by me or anyone else who've already adapted to it and know how to play it.

    The campaign my help a bit, but it still doesn't prepare players for online matches.
     
  11. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    I think he must have meant compared to UT2004, since UT2004 was "newbs get 0 kills" whereas UT3 is "newbs get 2 kills".

    Plus, I think just learning the overall game mechanics is easier in UT3 because you don't have to deal with people that can avoid every single shot you take at them.
     
  12. JohnDoe641

    JohnDoe641 Killer Fools Pro Staff Member

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    True. I just see it from a different perspective since I play rather competitively.

    neo-cons
     
  13. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    pull up, hop out all in one motion, dance on the hood while the car's still rollin
     
  14. Benfica

    Benfica European Redneck

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    They prefer UT2004 because they survive longer
     
  15. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    If you're talking about new players, you are 100% wrong. You think a huge influx of new players are coming to any UT game? No.
     
  16. Northrawn

    Northrawn New Member

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    I still remember my 1st online match for UT3.

    I bought it the first morning it was out in Germany and went online around 11AM, because I thought those other players online must be the hardcore players. I was wrong.

    There were 5 players on Deck and the leading player had 18 or 19 frags (goalscore was 25). I won and within these 2 minutes 3 of the lower scoring players left.

    And no, I am not that good of a player... ...so much for longer surviving in UT3 when you are new.


    The long surviving in UT2k4 fits gametypes like TAM and FREON* and is IMHO better for gametypes like ONS/WAR.

    BUt EPIC already showed they don't know much about the UT franchise's gameplay anymore when they released the ECE.



    *) One reason the became so popular in UT2k4.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
  17. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    I always forget that the game came out in Germany a week earlier than everywhere else. WTF was the point of that?
     
  18. Wormbo

    Wormbo Administrator Staff Member

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    German version = green blood etc. Maybe they speculated on disappointed customers buying the international version without giving back the German version, i.e. double profit.
     
  19. DarkSonny

    DarkSonny Beware!

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    thanks hideinlight
     
  20. Bishop F Gantry

    Bishop F Gantry New Member

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    With Epics talk about classes and customizable character I had hoped for something like.

    Light class ut2k3 mobility but carries less ammo and armor
    Medium class UT mobility default ammo and armor
    Heavy class UT3 mobility extra ammo, health and armor

    Custom character, ability to fine tune character to your own personal playing style.

    And default symetric pickups for the pro gamers.
     

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