UT3 Postmortem

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MonsOlympus

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May 27, 2004
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Oh, how childish of you.

Im childish cause youre a dickhead who doesnt have anything decent to say? Okay then give me a reason not to ignore you and I might think about taking you off permanently. Big dragon certainly proved he's not as dumb as he acts!
 
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Spank$hot_BT

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Feb 11, 2008
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a 'dickhead'!?? nice, good attitude.

I have absolutely no idea where this unprovoked antipathy came from. If you tell me what exactly i've done to earn the moniker of 'dickhead' then i might be able to help you out. Do i not have anything decent to say? Or just nothing to say that you agree with? If i don't agree with someone or believe they're talking BS i don't ignore them, nor do i abuse them.

Obviously if you think someones attitude, ettiquette or point of view is misguided then there are better ways of dealing with it than snubbing, ignoring, joking about ignoring and then abusing them.

Ignore me or not. If this is your attitude, i don't really care.
 

Anuban

Your reward is that you are still alive
Apr 4, 2005
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And yet UT3 is the fastest selling UT if you combine all platforms. The PS3 version waas #1 in the UK for it's launch week for instance. You guys are really freaking out over nothing :).

These numbers do not lie though and so I can't agree with you on this being over nothing (we are PC users here primarily) ... I'm happy for PS3 users (I'm one of them) but that doesn't have any relevance to what I am pointing out here. I am talking about us PC gamers and why is it that Epic, the once proud spokesman for PC gaming, has NO games on that list ... that is an issue for me ... not a major one but one I felt compelled to bring up so that I could get some other viewpoints on this matter. I would hope that it is Epic's goal to make the top 10 but see I'm not getting that feeling that Epic's philosophy at this point. It's just confusing for long time fans to see this Jeff, that is all it boils down to. I thought for sure (before UT3 came out) it would dominate PC gaming sales for at least 3-4 months .. competing favorably against CoD4 and Crysis, and I definitely thought Gears on the PC would make more of an impact. What these numbers show is that is simply not the case. Shocking for a long time follower of Epic games like myself.
 

MonsOlympus

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May 27, 2004
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a 'dickhead'!?? nice, good attitude.

I have absolutely no idea where this unprovoked antipathy came from. If you tell me what exactly i've done to earn the moniker of 'dickhead' then i might be able to help you out. Do i not have anything decent to say? Or just nothing to say that you agree with? If i don't agree with someone or believe they're talking BS i don't ignore them, nor do i abuse them.

Obviously if you think someones attitude, ettiquette or point of view is misguided then there are better ways of dealing with it than snubbing, ignoring, joking about ignoring and then abusing them.

Ignore me or not. If this is your attitude, i don't really care.

Now I have to go all the threads youve posted in to find the exact one which offended me, thank you for nothing! I could care less if we disagree or not but obviously something you said was either dumb or offensive enough to warrant an ignore.

Infact if you got an ignore its probably because you abused someone yourself. Let me check through your posts and find the one, if I dont find anything I'll surely apologize cause you might have just got mixed in there for nothing. Until then how about you watch your attitude!

I wasnt joking about ignoring btw, I honestly did not see your post because you were ignored and I thanked crotale for correcting you for me.

Anyways be prepared for an edit with a quote from you!

Edit: okay oh wow, perhaps your not a dickhead! I apologize, yeah I just didnt like hearing the **** you were dribbling it seems so yups sorry dude but you just happen to be posting your opinions on the wrong day of the week and got caught in the cross fire.

Title of this thread: UT 3.5 (no trolls allowed)
http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=174632&page=2
Don't call it 3.5 call it 2009 a different UT using same engine so those few that enjoy UT3 still can and the rest of us can have what was always meant to be. A new game. More dollar for Epic and the game the fans really wanted. Everybodies happy.

Like cod 4 was to cod 2, like TF2 was to TF, Like Crysis was to Farcry. I want them to build on what they had. Rather than strip it all out for some casual gamers to play, in exactly the same fashion they would of done if it had all still been there!

The casualisation/consolization of this game hasn't worked, the online player counts reflect this. Noobs get fragged senseless by pro players in all games. Also there are better casual games out there. UT IS HARDCORE and should be sold and marketed on these past strengths. Instead of nerfing it, aiming it at casual gamers THEN marketing it as hardcore. WTF?

which brings me to my actual wishlist

- I want the natural progression from 2k4 rather than its retarded younger brother. I want more advancement movement and gameplay features instead of much less.

- Hitscan not flakspam! There was enough rox nubs in 2k4, now its even worse.

- Less tight, winding, gameplayless DM maps which promote spam. oc this would need to be in conjunction with fundamental gameplay changes to work.

- Options to nerf gameplay should be available as a mutator NOT be the standard.

- TAM/Freon game types as standard.

and if i could absolutely have whatever i want - cleaner, crisper game gfx that are more conducive to online FPS gaming. UT is gameplay NOT super high tech gfx!!! but i suppose UT is always going to be the tech demo for unreal engine.:(

- if they really want to cater for casual/noob player then separate noob servers with nerfed game settings.

- and all the other stuff thats been mentioned a million times but isn't really the key issue imo - like menus/browser.


Ok, in that case I DO want a more console focused game! ;):D 2k4 was the sweet spot and while UT3 is quite good, it falls way short of 2K4 imo. More advanced movement, crisper feel and cleaner gfx ftw! UT3 feels too rubbery and plays too spammy.

I notice Epic staff are starting to be a little more vocal of late (too late?), which is a good thing. As a great many of their once loyal PC fan base seem to be deserting them and online numbers keep falling. That does have the knock on effect of leaving you with the much more easily satiated/docile PS3 fan base, so maybe this was a deliberate tactic?

Since you raised the point regarding low PC sales numbers, i have to ask why you built the game from the top down. ie: runs properly only on very high end PCs. Why didn't you try to take advantage of the far greater proportion of PC users and build the game around their systems and make it upwardly scalable from their. I'm sure Valve (with their greater PC sales) do this and it would make the game available to a far greater proportion of the PC userbase which would significantly eat into this 1/10 figure you mention. My own view is because the console market (shallower, gfx obsessed gamers) was the Priority and that UT3 also served as another tech demo of your unreal engine technology, which i believe is your primary business!?

You clearly now have 2 very different UT games (UT3/99 and the 2KX games). Other developers build on the base of their tried and tested gameplay formula, while Epic are all over the place. These games have clearly divided the community and surely a major source of your ongoing problems with your fans. So why not make 2 UT games utilising the same engine/assets? If the modders have the fundamental aspects of a game they like then i'm sure they'd do the rest.

Anyways I'll leave you unignored but be careful! Its called Unreal championship 2 its on xbox and its the successor to UT2k4! Unreal championship 1 becoming UT2k3 and going on to UT2k4. UT3 was developed side by side for PC and PS3 not for console then ported!

I could go into depth how much the walldodge has evolved over the sequels but Im not gonna bother after all that!
 
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Anuban

Your reward is that you are still alive
Apr 4, 2005
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^^^ Mons you are better than this ... come on ... enough of the public bickering and OT stuff on this thread. You should pm him that if its really worth all the hassle. And its not ... both of you are cool people so just drop it.
 

MonsOlympus

Active Member
May 27, 2004
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I think I made my point though, he might be kewl but he has to give me a reason to listen and get to know that :cool:
 

elmuerte

Master of Science
Jan 25, 2000
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elmuerte.com
oh, boy... this thread has gone bad... gone bad I say (*)

there is only 1 solution
istockphoto_1173184_pink_pony.jpg



*) props to Yahtzee: every time you can enter a name in a (text heavy) RPG/Adventure game (like Zelda) use the name "I say" and get a foghorn leghorn experience.
 
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Spank$hot_BT

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Feb 11, 2008
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Edit: okay oh wow, perhaps your not a dickhead!
lol, perhaps ;)

and thanks for the apology.:)

Feel sorry for you going through my old posts. Wouldn't wish that on anybody. The posts you flagged up were probably two of my worst - very dribbly ;). I'm sure others are ignoring me thanks to these posts, but we all have our off days and i apologize if you found them offensive. I'll try to moderate my more dribbly posts a little better in the future, but i will always voice my opinion if i feel it's reasonable.

I have respected Epics/WTs wishes and kept any negative sentiments i have away from the Epic boards. Which is why its even more important that we can all be comfortable to make our thoughts known here on BU. This place is much more representative of a cross section of the UT community so long as it isn't censored/ignored no matter how much we disagree.

Me and UT, quick summary >>> I still play and love 2K4, i want to like ut3, do like unrealED, I think Epic are confused and i'm still hoping for the best for the franchises future. I generally only ever try to represent my perspective and not force others to share it. I even keep booting up UT3 every so often just to see if my perspective has changed (and its quite good fun).

Edit:Its called Unreal championship 2 its on xbox and its the successor to UT2k4! Unreal championship 1 becoming UT2k3 and going on to UT2k4. UT3 was developed side by side for PC and PS3 not for console then ported!
I understand the accepted timeline and development of the UT series, i've just been trying to understand the thought processes behind the design decisions. Its the side by side development that i felt has prevented it from realising its full potential on PC. Where would UT3 on PC be now if cross platform play had been removed from the start rather than at the 11th hour?

Regarding the 'ignore' feature, probably one of the worst features on any forum and completely goes against the spirit of what a forum is imo, isn't there enough draconian censorship on the epic boards without having any here? :(

Anyway, bygones be bygones monsolympus :). I will respect your opinion and try not to get upset if you decide to ignore mine.;)
 
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MonsOlympus

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May 27, 2004
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Well my opinion of UT3! Its ****en brilliant!

Not only does it take the best from UT games in the past, it takes the first person camera a step further than I have seen with any title. It has made me realize going back to play 2k4, q4 and infact every FP game Ive played before how they were just filler.

I just feel like a bad mofo in big armour ready to take on **** in UT3, in 2k4 I feel like a ballerina on ice with a magic umbrella to block me from harm. Carnage is where its at and the impact hammer is so visceral, I can almost taste the blood on my tongue after that effect hits the screen and it makes me grin evily every time.

Keeping with the hammer the alternate fire makes for some wicked swap overs in fearless and other maps. Its just like ooops sorry now I have the powerup which makes it actually more competitive I thought, cause while in 1on1s powerups might not be so good since theres only 2 people. In FFA it gives people a chance to pinch it on the sly, but hey is there many FFA competitions? what scared :lol:

Hoarding rules are spot on per gametype although the omission of weapon throwing is alittle annoying weapon stay on is the standard it seems for a TDM server. This is one area UT3 shines I rekon, TDM is certainly the best its ever been, the maps just seem well suited to this but I guess some people look more at FFA or 1on1.

CTF I thought also was a shining example of how its done especially with the new translocator, one issue I see with this is the vCTF and CTF gametypes should have been joined. Theres not enough maps per for them to be seperate and Epic IMO made a big mistake listening to the community on this! Most of the servers are the new "vehikal" modes so no one gets to play what I rekon could be the best CTF mode UT has seen ever.

Now sure there are things missing I would have liked, hell Im not happy with the vehicle handling and warfare, I still play them. I think UT3 is a solid example of a hardcore FPS, it takes nothing from any other genre and keeps it pure! All the platformer movement and melee swords/shields etc can stay in UC I rekon, thats where it was done best anyways, save the tournament for PC!
 
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Anuban

Your reward is that you are still alive
Apr 4, 2005
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^^^ Well I sure like seeing grown people acting maturely ... if you two can get past your past squabbles then I can be a better more mature person as well. So anyone I have had issues with I apologize and let's just start over and try and be respectful of eachother's opinions even when they are very different ... so yeah I am officially getting rid of my ignore list. No need to be childish on a forum as long as others don't start thinking they know it all (Something I seem to be often accused of doing myself :lol: ) and just discount what I have to say, I have no problem with people not agreeing with me and I have better over time at displaying that ... not that I don't still have to work on it from time to time but I am no where near as argumentative as I used to be. :)
 

Crotale

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Jan 20, 2008
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Hi Crotale. No plans at the moment, though never say never :)!
Darn, now I am disappointed. I was so looking forward to a FanSite Kit. Perhaps I should boycott Epic Games and plaster tons of hate spam all over every single UT fan forum in the world. Or not.
 

Guyver1

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Sep 13, 2000
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And yet UT3 is the fastest selling UT if you combine all platforms. The PS3 version waas #1 in the UK for it's launch week for instance. You guys are really freaking out over nothing :).

perhaps you've missed the point here Jeff, but we dont give a t0$$ about combined sales (sorry i mean shipped figures). We care about the PC platform.

How about some PC only figures for us (actual sales not shipped units)? Or would that paint UT3 in a not very pretty colour for your guys?
 

Crotale

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Jan 20, 2008
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Why does WT need to post PC numbers? In a recent interview, MR admitted that PC sales of UT3 has not been where Epic wants it to be.

You'd have to live under a rock not to know that sales has been disappointing.
_____________________________________

Why does everyone have to keep rubbing Epic's noses in it? I'm not sucking up; I'm just a bit sick and tired of all the bashing. Sure, we all have things about UT3 we don't like or feel that we got short-changed on (those of us who actually BOUGHT the f*cking game). Yes, there are features that have been left out, others that weren't implemented very well, but it is still a good game. Epic is working on making it an even better game. Which is why I don't get all the hatred.

To be perfectly honest, all this hatred is about to make me turn on the community. I realize that it is actually a small percentage of the whole community doing all the hate-mongering and whining, but it does get old, because it ends up spamming virtually every thread. If and when I feel I've had enough and I walk away, it will NOT be due to any perceived failures by Epic or with UT3, but because of you guys who just don't know when enough is enough.
 

WarTourist

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Jan 22, 2008
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You'd have to live under a rock not to know that sales has been disappointing.

Sorry, but can't agree with you there. We're happy with the game's sales on ALL platforms. We'd have loved them to be higher, but it's hard to get down on the numbers when we're on our way to having the best selling UT title of all time :).
 

Crotale

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Jan 20, 2008
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Sorry, but can't agree with you there. We're happy with the game's sales on ALL platforms. We'd have loved them to be higher, but it's hard to get down on the numbers when we're on our way to having the best selling UT title of all time :).
In this case, I like being disagreed with.
 

ShredPrince

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Sep 14, 2005
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CTF-Omicron BONG
Sorry, but can't agree with you there. We're happy with the game's sales on ALL platforms. We'd have loved them to be higher, but it's hard to get down on the numbers when we're on our way to having the best selling UT title of all time :).

How do UT3 PC sales stack up against UT2004's sales?

That's the kicker. Tell me UT3's blowing it out of the water, and I'll call it a success. That would be great, cause we can be assured that since it's such a success within the series, then we are sure to get a sequal.

I have no doubts the PS3 version moves units, the PC version however, I do, mostly cause of hardware issues etc etc.

BTW War, nice form my good man, this is more like what I precieved to be the "old" you:)
 
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Unknown Target

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Jan 22, 2008
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He just said that it was the fastest selling UT of all time. Doesn't that let you know that it's selling faster than 2k4 and will be on it's way to catch up to it soon? :p
 

MonsOlympus

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May 27, 2004
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Also something you could probably never get accurate stats on is how many of those people bought 2k4 but bought UT3 for PS3 instead of PC because they didnt need the editor. You know cause they can still get a few mods in stuff on that platform anyways.