disturbingly differing dynamic displacement damage system of differentiatable doom
- Thread starter yurch
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I agree the new hit system is a great addition to INF and should be on all servers, it forces people to actually aim and no longer are you killed by having a bigtoe hit!!!
Long live the YURCH!
But seriously the hopping is an exploit on some level, I would try anything not to be killed but jumping around violently is a stretch IMHO, after one ot maybe two jumps you had better be looking to get the BFE outta there and not start straffing and hopping. Like I said I can live with it cause "I LOVE THIS SH*T"!
But if a penalty could be applied i.e. instant stamina drain, accuracy reduction, probability of shooting oneself or even as extreme as Streaks suggests would be good.
Long live the YURCH!
But seriously the hopping is an exploit on some level, I would try anything not to be killed but jumping around violently is a stretch IMHO, after one ot maybe two jumps you had better be looking to get the BFE outta there and not start straffing and hopping. Like I said I can live with it cause "I LOVE THIS SH*T"!
But if a penalty could be applied i.e. instant stamina drain, accuracy reduction, probability of shooting oneself or even as extreme as Streaks suggests would be good.
I do not find it that unbeleivable that someone out in the open would be jumping for their lives if being shot at. The only thing I would really like to see, once yurch is done with this mutie, is him or someone else use the data from his mutator to make a mutie that hurts movement or aim depending on where you are hit. I am not a military guy, but I assume a good hit in the leg when a guy is running (or jumping) would send him to the ground. I can live with it the way it is...we can only get so close to real life before playing gets too tedious to be fun for most.
Beppo
Infiltration Lead-Programmer
You would try to stay as low as possible and remain as fast as possible. Every little brick, plant, tiny hole or whatever object/place would be the thing you are searching. You would never jump... only for taking cover.
A jump gets you out 'of control'. You cannot react anymore while in the air. If being hit, you would not have a firm stand or something alike that could work against the momentum that the hit might result in. Chances to fall cause you were hit during the jump are pretty high. Something that is not that high while keeping both feet on the ground. Even if you are hit in the leg you can move on 'better' as if you would need to 'land' first after a jump.
Problem with games in general is that people do things to gain an advantage that they would never try in real life. Noone would try to circle-strafe or bunny-hop around while taking fire and an enemy as close as some meters cause it would never give him any kind of advantage normally. In games you gain advantages by behaving unrealisticly unfortunately. So, the only thing would be to restrict your movement abilities within the game. But this needs to be balanced cause else even realistic behaviour would be impossible... like jumping up a knee high obstacle that is not possible in some games. In real life you would simply make a 'higher' step, or jump up a little during your movement. Something that is more or less impossible to simulate within a game.
You would need different jump heights or better a jump height that is fully in control of the player and not a full jump all the time. A 'hold key/button' that 'charges' to make a larger jump would be ok I guess and would limit the bunny hopping drastically.
Maybe something a mutator can do simulate. 'Should' be possible.
A jump gets you out 'of control'. You cannot react anymore while in the air. If being hit, you would not have a firm stand or something alike that could work against the momentum that the hit might result in. Chances to fall cause you were hit during the jump are pretty high. Something that is not that high while keeping both feet on the ground. Even if you are hit in the leg you can move on 'better' as if you would need to 'land' first after a jump.
Problem with games in general is that people do things to gain an advantage that they would never try in real life. Noone would try to circle-strafe or bunny-hop around while taking fire and an enemy as close as some meters cause it would never give him any kind of advantage normally. In games you gain advantages by behaving unrealisticly unfortunately. So, the only thing would be to restrict your movement abilities within the game. But this needs to be balanced cause else even realistic behaviour would be impossible... like jumping up a knee high obstacle that is not possible in some games. In real life you would simply make a 'higher' step, or jump up a little during your movement. Something that is more or less impossible to simulate within a game.
You would need different jump heights or better a jump height that is fully in control of the player and not a full jump all the time. A 'hold key/button' that 'charges' to make a larger jump would be ok I guess and would limit the bunny hopping drastically.
Maybe something a mutator can do simulate. 'Should' be possible.
shan said:
Grrrrrrrrrr.
OK here is the low down on being shot at and being shot....again.
First off moving my JUMPING is very inefficient. If you receive effective fire (that's having rounds hit you or close to you for the non-military amongst you) you RUN for cover or drop to the ground.... Dash, Down, Crawl, Observe. It's all basic battle drills and you do it without even thinging about it. With the amount of equipment I had to carry in the field the last thing you wanted to do was jump even if you had to.....as to doing an impression of a stoned bunny on a hot plate..........
Being shot is different each time and for each person. Someone running may be hit in the leg, not realise it (or just be so motivated - read terrified) that they just don't stop. Having said that someone may have a round pass through their equipment or clothing without actually injuring them and they fall like a poleaxed horse. Equally being shot in the foot can make aiming and firing your weapon difficult...while being shot in the arm can make moving hard.
Yes the idea of a charged jump key would seem to address alot of the hopping action, since yes wearing a sh*tload of gear does prohibit this behavior. I would suggest those who have not had the luxury of having the Armed Forces provide you with this fun filled experience, load up a pack with about forty pounds and go out and bunny hop!
So for those of you that are awesome code writers is what Beppo suggests possible? If so I have some bride money stashed away!
So for those of you that are awesome code writers is what Beppo suggests possible? If so I have some bride money stashed away!
geogob
Koohii o nomimasu ka?
Perhaps when you jump more than once in a given ammount of time, you are flagged as being in "bunny" mode and as a result of your excessive hopping....one of your frags pulls free of its pin
Put it this way....when playing wack-a-mole...you don't try to hit the ones still in the holes
Put it this way....when playing wack-a-mole...you don't try to hit the ones still in the holes
I am not here to defend bunny hopping. I think it's just as ridiculous as the next fanatic. However, I do do it in times of need. The only problem with RL military techniques that Tiffy described is that it's suicide in INF, generally. The problem is that in INF maps, I generally spot an enemy at longer ranges (ie. not covering half your screen) by "hm, that graphic doesn't belong there in this map." Someone prone on the deck is, for me, a sitting duck. I guess you could point towards the maps not having enough soft cover, or something, but I just don't think RL can carry over with our current maps (yes, there are SOME exceptions).
Come to think of it, this isn't really an argument, but rather more of a justification for why -I- do it. Many city maps (read: maps with concrete beneath your feet) generally won't give you any mercy with the "drop to the deck" technique, especially since INF engagements tend to happen on the same plane. Thus, I tend to bound around towards the nearest cover, praying that people don't hit me.
Also, I thought Rogue Spear (I'm unsure of other R6 games) had a pretty decent system of climbing/big steps.
Come to think of it, this isn't really an argument, but rather more of a justification for why -I- do it. Many city maps (read: maps with concrete beneath your feet) generally won't give you any mercy with the "drop to the deck" technique, especially since INF engagements tend to happen on the same plane. Thus, I tend to bound around towards the nearest cover, praying that people don't hit me.
Also, I thought Rogue Spear (I'm unsure of other R6 games) had a pretty decent system of climbing/big steps.
What makes this problem worse is the height the INF soldier jumps and aircontrol. The INF soldier can jump about 5 ft from a standing jump! with a pack on! NOBODY in the world has a standing vertical leap of 60 inches with a pack on... nobody. The other problem is aircontrol, an artifact of UT's run and jump gameplay, it allows the INF soldier to change speed and direction in mid-air (turn on low grav to see it well).
--These are problems, and I think taking care of them as well as turning jumping into something that has a small "charge up" time would help.
I do however see the necessity of these problems as of now. Without a rediculously high jump and aircontrol, it would be impossible to "climb" piles of boxes or crates.
--Lastly, I agree with taque's point that dropping to the deck when getting shot at will get you dead very fast in most INF situations.
Here is a picture of an INF soldier jumping to give you an idea of how rediculously high he can jump.
--These are problems, and I think taking care of them as well as turning jumping into something that has a small "charge up" time would help.
I do however see the necessity of these problems as of now. Without a rediculously high jump and aircontrol, it would be impossible to "climb" piles of boxes or crates.
--Lastly, I agree with taque's point that dropping to the deck when getting shot at will get you dead very fast in most INF situations.
Here is a picture of an INF soldier jumping to give you an idea of how rediculously high he can jump.
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Climbing should be put in, but jumping should be kept in in a heavily modified form IMO.
Most instances of proper "jumping" in RL (like over a shallow ditch or trench) are actually just a lengthened stride that's slightly higher than a person's normal stride. I think that jumping should be changed to that, and to prevent people from using it as a Superman-esque form of running away, it could only be performed near obstrucles (like ditches and trenches) that the mapper sets and nowhere else.
Alternatively, you could put in penalties for "jumping" more than a few times in a row, but the former solution would be better I think. Feedback?
Most instances of proper "jumping" in RL (like over a shallow ditch or trench) are actually just a lengthened stride that's slightly higher than a person's normal stride. I think that jumping should be changed to that, and to prevent people from using it as a Superman-esque form of running away, it could only be performed near obstrucles (like ditches and trenches) that the mapper sets and nowhere else.
Alternatively, you could put in penalties for "jumping" more than a few times in a row, but the former solution would be better I think. Feedback?
maybe no restrictions, but jumping should definately be turned to a large stride, only doable with a run-up.
geogob
Koohii o nomimasu ka?
keihaswarrior said:
*cough* *cough* *ra286* *cough*
no seriously, ra286 had a nice fix... jump hight was reduced and climbing was implemented. Then again, it had a major drawback... people could now go almost anywhere, on any roofs, on most maps. Then again, you could do it in real life too. If you would want to do it in RL, that's another question.
If it can be done Yurch, we will do it.
Nice to see you here Tiffy...even if it was to growl at me.
So I guess the milspec guys have spoken. Jumping is not smart in RL. I still don't have a huge problem with it in game. As for diving for cover, maybe Yurch's new mutator will make that OK, since prone are now realistically harder to hit.
Nice to see you here Tiffy...even if it was to growl at me.
So I guess the milspec guys have spoken. Jumping is not smart in RL. I still don't have a huge problem with it in game. As for diving for cover, maybe Yurch's new mutator will make that OK, since prone are now realistically harder to hit.
Sorry Yurch it is all my fault!
It just became much more apparent after your mutator became more wide spread on servers, so thus the connection of ballistics and jumping.
But can it be done Yurch?
It just became much more apparent after your mutator became more wide spread on servers, so thus the connection of ballistics and jumping.
But can it be done Yurch?