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unrealistic loadout => less points for kills/objectives ...

Discussion in 'New Version Suggestions' started by JaFO, Sep 30, 2001.

  1. LoTekK

    LoTekK Peon

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    just to give him time to piss in his pants and subsequently repent... :D after which we execute him anyway... :D
     
  2. The_Fur

    The_Fur Back in black

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  3. TitanBlue

    TitanBlue KATSU AKIGATA WA NAN DESUKA

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    execution? I could offer my hand, so he can strangle himself *hehe*

    TitanBlue
     
  4. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    There is no need for an execution :
    let him carry those weapons in real life and then if he suddenly happens to trip over something I think he's in for a very painful (and quite possibly deadly ;) ) experience ...
     
  5. LoTekK

    LoTekK Peon

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    hmm... that sooo reminds me of that scene towards the end of that great blaxploitation spoof "I'm Gonna Git You Sucka" where the big dude's loaded up with about half a dozen or more different weapons (including a shotgun and m-60 :D), and he steps on a shell casing, falls on his back, and has every single gun on him go off (and we're talking full magazine for each! :D)
    absolutely hilarious... :D
     
  6. MadWoffen

    MadWoffen Soon! ©

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    Your idea is not bad Jafo but perhaps we are now a bit limited because of the weapon choice.
    My main loadout is a P90, 3 clips +beretta, 1 clip and 2 nades.

    On large sniping maps, I'll get the robar, 2 clips and the P90, 2 clips + 1 nade (no pistol).

    I know it isn't realist but the bulk is not so affected. Beside this, if they implement a Dragunov and/or an Uzi, I'll be the first one to use them. I know Robar is not a truely anti-personal sniper rifle but I use it like that until they get me a true sniper rifle that I can afford with a small SMG.
    There is also the question of playability. If I have a sniper rifle only, I can only camp basically (I move but only to camp to another spot). If I'm the last of my team and want to hunt the ennemy (also camping), I could face some big problems in CQB in houses with a RC50 only (don't tell me the pistol could do the trick against SMG, ppl who wanted to prove me that where chainsawed by my P90)...

    My 2 cents is to wait for more weapons to be implemented or apply these rules in official clan matches only but not in public servers.


    /me joins others at the execution of darth_armz. :D
     
  7. poaw

    poaw You used to sleep easy at night.

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    Do you realize you can switch loadouts in-game?
    I don't enjoy being penalized for being shot, but I don't go around asking them to remove it.

    Wise man sez: "Simple problem have simple solution."
    Simply set the base value at 15 bulk. That way carrying anything less won't net you any gain.

    For a limiting someone carrying that many weapons Infiltration doesn't need "Extreme realism". Even TFC limits you to a specific selection of weapons when you play. There is nothing "Extreme" about basic restrictions

    The name of the mod is irrelevent. Infiltration's was carried over from a gametype invovling Infiltrating the other team's base and recovering a CD.

    Running around rocket jumping and setting enemies on fire with an incedinary sniper laser is also fun. But it doesn't belong in Infiltration. The same goes for 3 SMGs and a backup AR loadouts.
     
  8. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    // minimum bulk = 15
    That could solve the 'pistol can be useful too' situations a bit better. Altough once armor is introduced that will mean you need to factor in the bulk of the armor somehow (probably by excluding that from the 'loadout' just for the purpose of this scoresystem.

    // TFC or UnF:
    that's exaclty the kind of game that teaches you to rely on 'minimalist' loadout. Altough most classes have more than one weapon, by the time you reach for your 'secondary' weapon you're either 'dead' or you need to resupply anyway.

    Altough even there you'll find ppl that want to be able to kill at any range as a sniper/marksman :rolleyes:
     
  9. Excelsiore

    Excelsiore Binary Liberation Front

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    I'm all for realistic loadouts but ummmm

    "But what if using an "unrealistic" loadout meant that you scored less 'points' ?"

    Excuse me for saying so but you don't score points in real life so having a realistic loadout in this context is totally illogical.

    Since when do we score points at all anymore anyway? Are they changing the the scoreboard again?

    Basically anybody should be able to carry anything and everything they want to but be penalized realistically through bulk, stamina, etc.

    This seems like a very CS like fix to me :=(
     
  10. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    For TDM there are no 'points' to score, just kills.
    CTF has flagcaptures. Both of these have no 'scores' to tweak, altough you could see a personal 'teamscore' as such.

    But how would you determine the winner in an (E)AS- or DOM-game ?
     
  11. MadWoffen

    MadWoffen Soon! ©

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    Read me well Jafo. I'm ready to go with a sniper rifle only as long as someone is ready to give me a backup for close encounters. I can manage to spread havoc on the other team, even with the RA mutator and being drunk (ask Yurch for details :D ). But is a team mate ready to stand in a position for 10 minutes without moving ? In a public server, I say big NO...
    And it wil also means that this backup will not score or will have a small score for being "inactive". This is a game to have fun!
    When I change my position, I'll do it with a SMG.


    P.S.: I just realized that the debate is not to impeach to someone to have unrealist loadouts but to lower the score. It is ok for me then because I don't care about my personal score as long as my team win!:p

    P.P.S.: In the Hunt the Sniper Mutator, weapons restrictions applies. For those who are upset by ACOG/M203 combo, isn't possible to do something ?

    YURCH!
     
  12. MadWoffen

    MadWoffen Soon! ©

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    In EAS, you win if you achieve your goals, otherwise, the defender win.

    In DOM, what about the team with the most survivor or the best ratio survivors/kills (if teams are uneven) ? AFA2 server was using that some days ago...
     
  13. R-Force

    R-Force (IF)

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    If i remember right, the INF team plan to fix the loadout problem with removing the psg then reduce the amount of cash we can use... That way carrying an armory would be impossible (unless you pick up stuff along the way)... But still some stuff should be made mutually exclusive (no 2 ARs, no 2 Pistols, no AR + smg etc...)...
     
  14. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    I've yet to see a public game last more than a few minutes (not just because I tend to die in the first seconds of a round ;) )
    Besides it's difficult to do with 99% of your teammates rushing like fools instead of taking it 'slow' and 'stealthy' like me ...

    If those voice-commands weren't so useless it'd be a bit easier to ask/tell someone. At least I can't seem to find the "I've got your back"-command and by the time I've managed to type they're attacking the 'enemy' ... :(

    As for 'score' or 'fun': survival is reward enough.
    I'm used to playing 'defense' instead of 'offence/assault' in UnF/TFC-games (that meant having low score unless the enemy were idiots ;)), I play Inf in almost the same way ...

    // ---
    yes, I'm thinking that too now.
    Even without a 'score' there probably is nothing that can be done against the multi-weapon loadout, unless bulk and weaponswitch-times make such loadouts impossible to use.
    Score definitely won't affect such a person. :(

    I was thinking of using the basics of such a system as a 'loadout-reality'-check in my bot-editor. That way there'd be a simple way to 'teach' players what is a 'realistic' loadout.
     
  15. MadWoffen

    MadWoffen Soon! ©

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    You should wait the full armory for this, I guess. But the idea is valid for clan matches where everyone has his role and function.


    P.S.: for longer matches, go to the AFA2 server. Big maps and RA running on it!;)
     
  16. JamesT

    JamesT sniper apprentice

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    In real life, accomplish the mission = success, even if you have a so-called "unrealistic loadout."

    The real thing is that a so-called "unrealistic loadout" will bring you difficulties when you are doing your job. But if you still can make your job done, it's done.

    Therefore, we should have the same thing in game. Penalties/difficulties should be applied to a player with "unrealistic" loadouts. That's all.

    [edit] I would like to say that I oppose this suggestion due to a fact that it is not realistic at all.
     
  17. darth_armz

    darth_armz -=Rogue 5=-

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    Gee I post something and everyone starts ignoring the main subject and talks about my post...maybe I should do this more often ;)

    Also I talked about my loadout and why I chose it let's all cry about it boo-hoo. I talked about it so that just MAYBE i could have a reason for why I don't support this penalty system. I also explained why I have two SMGs.

    Hold on...did anyone say anything about bragging? see above for why I mentioned my loadout.

    this ******* and others wants to execute me? ok first of all: real offensive. Not just to me but to everyone who is on the receiving end. Second-I have 2 SMGs and an AR...Just try to do it you fool. You're lucky i didn't include the HK69 in my loadout. Same goes out to everyone who liked the execution idea. What are you gonna do, have me join an online game and stand against a wall?

    (he's talking about the # of guns in my loadout)
    looks like someone has the wrong idea of what overkill really is. Here is an example: You shoot someone to death, desecrate his body and then blow up all the remains with the HK69. Overkill is not having a lot of weapons. Did it ever occur to anyone that just MAYBE I liked those weapons and did not want to choose between them? Sometimes I get rid of my FAMAS after I start (wow ain't that amazing).

    Another misinterpretation...sigh. Whether or not it is a team game does not matter if you are challenging yourself to see how many people you can kill with just the knife. Again this goes back to why the penalty system should not be added to INF. Having too little weaponry shouldn't be something to get worked up about. And yes, it is a team game. So take your knife and go see how many frags you can get (fragging the other team of course). Hmm..maybe there should be a system to reward players who can do this...

    Just clearing up some matters and beefs I had.
     
  18. yurch

    yurch Swinging the clue-by-four

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    This is a realism game. That is a unrealistic loadout. Thats the beef we have. Don't pick apart our quotes until you know what we are talking about.
     
  19. GrayFox$M.Inc.$

    GrayFox$M.Inc.$ Don't bother running, you'll only die tired

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    Damn Newbs......

    Alright buddy, the reason these guys are complaining about your specific loadout is that 1) It is highly unrealistic 2) Do real soldiers do this? To answer your question, no they do not. They either carry their primary rifle or their SMG. In real life, people are not walking armories. Lets repeat that, PEOPLE ARE NOT WALKING ARMORIES. Good.

    Most of these people on this board are former/current military or people with just common sense that they know you can not do this in RL. When I started palying INF, the MOD's focus was to be realistic, not CS with a new engine. Now do you see why people are complaining to your loadout? I for one agree with there view. It complety defeats the whole purpose of what this MOD is aiming for. For people that do the kind of stuff you do, it just makes it worse day by day. So why not get off the bandwagon and play the way it was meant to be played.
     
  20. Kuroshio Apocal

    Kuroshio Apocal Sucka Free

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    Just one question...

    darth, why do you play Infiltration? Seriously.

    Most of the INF players chose INF because it is the most realistic simulation of infantry combat we see. Real soldiers in combat rarely carry anything more than a handful of grenades and their standard assault rifle. Even SOF usually carry only one weapon. Why carry three different weapons, three different sets of ammo, and practice marksmanship and weapon handling only a third as well, when you could carry one weapon, one caliber of ammo, and be three times as good with a weapon?

    You are opposed to the penalty system because it will hurt you? Why are we not surprised? Would it really kill you to pick just one primary weapon and stick with it? Think about it real quick. Which weapon are you best with? How do rounds normally play out for you?

    My 'official' loadout includes just one primary. One. No attachments, no backup, just an M16A2, three mags, and two frags. Even my 'for shits and giggles' loadout only has two longarms.
     

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