StarCraft II
- Thread starter Kantham
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From what I've read, they're trying to keep the active player number at 10.000 (globally? usa/europe?). At least, 10.000 somewhere.
So, assuming newbs that got in through friends invites are about done being stomped now, I'm pretty sure everyone interested will get in at one point or another.
So, assuming newbs that got in through friends invites are about done being stomped now, I'm pretty sure everyone interested will get in at one point or another.
I have a feeling I'm getting some horrible habits because of this fail Starcrack AI. So much so that if I used these habits on real players I would get owned because of them.
Has anyone even been able to beat the hard version of 7.0 AI? I don't even see how it's physically possible. Play Protoss against Zerg and even with seemingly great or perfect starting macro they still come in and rape whatever zealots I've been able to make and then game over. So freaking stupid. I've even tried attacking first with like 4 zealots and they still take me out with a load of lings.
Edit: I just now started a round that I was able to observe between Protoss and Zerg AI. First thing I notice is that they get 10 minerals for every 5 that they mine. Wtf is that bull****? The god damn zerg was able to go insta pool within the first 5 to 10 seconds of the game. No wonder I get owned, they are able to start massing units way before me and mass way more at that. Plus they get 8 gas for every 3 they mine and their APM is around 1500. What the hell?
I don't understand how it would be physically possible to beat that, but according to the official forums, a lot of people find it easy. I find that hard to believe.
Has anyone even been able to beat the hard version of 7.0 AI? I don't even see how it's physically possible. Play Protoss against Zerg and even with seemingly great or perfect starting macro they still come in and rape whatever zealots I've been able to make and then game over. So freaking stupid. I've even tried attacking first with like 4 zealots and they still take me out with a load of lings.
Edit: I just now started a round that I was able to observe between Protoss and Zerg AI. First thing I notice is that they get 10 minerals for every 5 that they mine. Wtf is that bull****? The god damn zerg was able to go insta pool within the first 5 to 10 seconds of the game. No wonder I get owned, they are able to start massing units way before me and mass way more at that. Plus they get 8 gas for every 3 they mine and their APM is around 1500. What the hell?
I don't understand how it would be physically possible to beat that, but according to the official forums, a lot of people find it easy. I find that hard to believe.
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Meh, at least you'll have picked up some defensive builds and learned not to get lost in micro while your economy tanks.
I must say the last AI I played against was 6.1 hard, but I'd imagine it is possible to hold off any rush (assuming the new AI doesn't cheat, of course).
For zerglingrushes, all it takes is proper building placement and one zealot (with another one on the way) or one sentry while zealots are building. You'll have quite a bit of work to do if the bot does nothing else than keep throwing zerglings at you as fast as they can, but it's possible to survive until you get colossi and then it's game over for Zerg.
Keep in mind that in order to zergling rush, the Zerg bot is sacrificing his early economy. So even if you pull all of your probes to help in the fight and you lose some, if his rush fails to take you out there and then, you will be back on equal footing. Only when the rush manages to destroy one of your structures or keep the probes off mining for so long that it offsets his 3 lost drones and early spawning pool do you really suffer from zergling rushes. Knowing this, chrono boost the appropriate buildings to either get more probes faster or get your defensive units out asap and steadily tech up to colossi or other applicable counters to what Zerg is throwing at you.
Sounds a lot easier on paper/screen than it is in practice, but my point is that as long as the bots cannot cheat, they cannot perform builds that platinum level players haven't done yet.
I must say the last AI I played against was 6.1 hard, but I'd imagine it is possible to hold off any rush (assuming the new AI doesn't cheat, of course).
For zerglingrushes, all it takes is proper building placement and one zealot (with another one on the way) or one sentry while zealots are building. You'll have quite a bit of work to do if the bot does nothing else than keep throwing zerglings at you as fast as they can, but it's possible to survive until you get colossi and then it's game over for Zerg.
Keep in mind that in order to zergling rush, the Zerg bot is sacrificing his early economy. So even if you pull all of your probes to help in the fight and you lose some, if his rush fails to take you out there and then, you will be back on equal footing. Only when the rush manages to destroy one of your structures or keep the probes off mining for so long that it offsets his 3 lost drones and early spawning pool do you really suffer from zergling rushes. Knowing this, chrono boost the appropriate buildings to either get more probes faster or get your defensive units out asap and steadily tech up to colossi or other applicable counters to what Zerg is throwing at you.
Sounds a lot easier on paper/screen than it is in practice, but my point is that as long as the bots cannot cheat, they cannot perform builds that platinum level players haven't done yet.
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Starcraft 1 AI worked the same way - Double or more resources per miner that a human would get. It's like playing against the world's stupidest player with a money cheat and occasionally the ability to pause the game to issue orders (Ghost armies that can lock down 15+ units in a second, for example).
I would be really surprised if even pro Korean players could consistently beat double money AI (It only seems realistic on levels where your base is easily defended and superior micro can outdo cheat-macro). The point, and it's a valid point, is that for a bot who gets double resources early rushes don't hurt them at all - They already start out with double your mining capacity and can amass way more units than is feasible for a human player in the same amount of time. Against any good player, literally double mining would be an almost unbeatable advantage - More units, better tech, faster expanding. The only reason it's not for the computer is that they basically have no strategy at all.
I would be really surprised if even pro Korean players could consistently beat double money AI (It only seems realistic on levels where your base is easily defended and superior micro can outdo cheat-macro). The point, and it's a valid point, is that for a bot who gets double resources early rushes don't hurt them at all - They already start out with double your mining capacity and can amass way more units than is feasible for a human player in the same amount of time. Against any good player, literally double mining would be an almost unbeatable advantage - More units, better tech, faster expanding. The only reason it's not for the computer is that they basically have no strategy at all.
Okay... I'm really not good at StarCraft in general but I managed to beat the Official StarCrak AI 7.0 with the difficulty set in the AI.galaxy file at 0 (Supposedly the hardest difficulty according to the comments in that file.)
It was relatively easy too.
Soooooo I'm really confused honestly I do believe I'm not playing against the hardest AI then because I find that to be highly unlikely... If it turns out I am, maybe I'm just really lucky? That or Photon Cannons are great scary buildings for the AI (I make lots of them on the borders of the bases)
For info I use this launcher but set it to "No mod" so that it uses the 7.0 files instead of the 5.5 included ones...
It was relatively easy too.
Soooooo I'm really confused honestly
I do believe I'm not playing against the hardest AI then because I find that to be highly unlikely... If it turns out I am, maybe I'm just really lucky? That or Photon Cannons are great scary buildings for the AI (I make lots of them on the borders of the bases)For info I use this launcher but set it to "No mod" so that it uses the 7.0 files instead of the 5.5 included ones...
Okay... I'm really not good at StarCraft in general but I managed to beat the Official StarCrak AI 7.0 with the difficulty set in the AI.galaxy file at 0 (Supposedly the hardest difficulty according to the comments in that file.)
It was relatively easy too.
Soooooo I'm really confused honestly
For info I use this launcher but set it to "No mod" so that it uses the 7.0 files instead of the 5.5 included ones...
That's mostly what WoS detailed in his above post: obligatory gameplay against AI is defensive turtling into mass tech rush.
Building lots of cannons is a perfectly good plan vs AI, while regular agressive builds are slaughtered by AI. However, with cannons costing 150 minerals a piece, planting only three for defence could already have been an expansion or 4 zealots instead. Not having either is a free pass for a human opponent to expand.
I suggest using the Starcrack AI only for practicing macro mechanics and trying out the different units. As for actual strategy, any match against bots is in no way representative of actual gameplay.
Yes yes of course, I don't plan on building Photon Cannon walls unless the adversary demands so D Kantham )
However it's good practise for the start of the game still (early build order, which I still haven't perfected regarding the timing), and how fast you can tech to a certain level and unit.
D Kantham )However it's good practise for the start of the game still (early build order, which I still haven't perfected regarding the timing), and how fast you can tech to a certain level and unit.
Yeah, which is amazingly annoying. Sadly the 7.0 doesn't play tactically, he's just doing the same builds over and over again. Last night I won 2 games in a row using mutalisks - he just kept his Zealots underneath them rather than sending them right at my base and end it, or at least turn the tide a bit. Then next games he totally destroyed me with base units because i tried to play differently. You need to turtle or mutalisk rush or something to win against it.
I'm fairly sure to buy SC2 and play it online, that's really where it's all at, unless blizzard really codes an impressive AI and the online turns to be crap.
I assume that Battle.net gathers your APM and W/L ratio to determine how good you are at the game and rank you with that, rather than progressively ranking you up like BC2/MW2/MMO's which is stupid for RTS's considering LOTS of players are good at the game.
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Yeah like I said they're doing the same builds all over again. The AI has Terran I have Toss, I turtle with 4 canons and increase my Collosus count, upgrade their range and the shield+ground attacks, they won't learn to counter that and stick with Marines/Marauders. In case some of you didn't knew, the collosus is a marine killer, big time.
He had Vikings, instead of attacking my collosus whilst in the air, he landed them for insta death. I had lost 0 units in this game, he had lost for at least 30 marines and about 6-7 tanks + a couple vikings.
This clearly proves that tactics is the way to win a battle. I hope the Blizzard AI is much better.
BTW, what do you guys think of this build..
-3 Thors
-25 + Marines (stimpacks)
-6 + Medivacs
Both Medivacs and Marines are base units that can be built 2 at a time so the count is only depending on the player resources than it is really about production time. Never seen buildings go down faster so far.
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Okay... I'm really not good at StarCraft in general but I managed to beat the Official StarCrak AI 7.0 with the difficulty set in the AI.galaxy file at 0 (Supposedly the hardest difficulty according to the comments in that file.)
It was relatively easy too.
Soooooo I'm really confused honestly
For info I use this launcher but set it to "No mod" so that it uses the 7.0 files instead of the 5.5 included ones...
Use this launcher: http://sc2.nibbits.com/assets/starcraft-2-beta-best-allin1-tool/
Just install it over everything and you're good to go.
Here's the complete map pack: http://www.mediafire.com/?toqziwogyzt
Just put those in the maps folder somewhere in your documents.
Start that launcher and play on the hard difficulty. That puts the AI on the hardest and also gives it maphack and mineral bonus.
Right when the game starts go into options and put the gameplay to the fastest, it doesn't do it automatically for some reason.
I seriously find playing it impossible. Even if I play toss, wall off with Lots and deter their first ling attack, by the time I get up only my first Immortal or t2 unit they have like 15 roaches attacking. Impossible to defend against.
Someone show me a video of them beating this and I'll be surprised as hell.
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You never know what hackers can do. Seriously if they can implant AI into the game why can't they put another human in instead? Hell maybe they can implant AI that connects to another program that interprets human commands and then the AI does whatever the human says.
Meh, I don't know what I'm talking about.
Brizz vs SC2 is the new JaFO vs Steam :3
In other news Terrans Reaper rushes and Marauder/Bunker rushes are OP now.
Reaper Rush Thread
In other news Terrans Reaper rushes and Marauder/Bunker rushes are OP now.
Reaper Rush Thread
This is only an issue for Protoss. As a Zerg you can just 10 pool, and avoid the whole thing.
Edit, oh it looks like a new patch is coming anyways.
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AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH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