Religious/Evolutionary Debate Thread

[bobtheking]

Only the people who get all freaked out,like saying "under God" or seeing the 10 commandments,public place or not.Is gonna like make turn into pumpkins or whatever thier problem is.

I say let the people vote on it,then the majority will rule,as it should be,not 1 parent causing all this trouble.

yeah, because athiests are the only ones causing trouble for the majority. like the parents television council, with 99.8% of FCC complaints http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20041207-4442.htm oh wait...

you getting all bent out of shape over the issue makes you just as stupid as that one parent.

 

[Mister_Prophet]

We didn't try any medical stuff to get pregnant. We were just about to start fertility treatments when she got pregnant.

Angels today are less noticible than they were 2000 years ago. It's a bit like the show "Touched By An Angel" where they come into your life briefly and then are gone. Their purpose isn't always like that of the show (directly helping people). Sometimes the help they give is more indirect. I encountered what I believe to be an angel a few years ago. My wife and I were running a bit late heading to a youth group function. We went thru the drive-thru at McD's and were going to eat on the way. I was waiting to turn out of the lot onto the street when this man walks up to my car out of nowhere. He was obviously homeless. He asked if he could have just one dollar so he could get a little something to eat at McD's. I don't usually give to panhandlers so I told him no at first. He walked away. A few seconds later, I was compelled by the Holy Spirit to give that man some food. I drove around the block and found him and gave him the food I had just recieved. I figured I could just eat later, this guy had no idea if he would eat that day. I truly believe God sent that man to me to teach me to slow down and take a look at the world instead of just rushing about. He taught me to look closer at situations people are in and he gave me better discernment on how to help people.

Not smack your Hobo-Angel story, but wouldn't you consider the possibility that you gave the guy a bite to eat simply because you felt bad for him? Because you felt crummy about saying "No" originally and went out of your way to be a good person? Is it at all possible that this guy was simply a hobo? Maybe you don't give yourself enough credit for just being a nice dude that day.

 

[Cat Fuzz]

That was a really nice thing of you to do. Do bad you didnt just do it to be a nice person...
I tend to give money or food if I can, to a person or to a cause just because I want to help. I want to be a decent person... no deity involved for me... I think people should just be good people.

I didn't do it because I felt a holy smackdown coming my way if I didn't. I did it because I got the feeling that this guy was in genuine need instead of most of these other panhandlers that make their living begging people for money and live relatively comfortable lives doing it.

 

[Cat Fuzz]

Not smack your Hobo-Angel story, but wouldn't you consider the possibility that you gave the guy a bite to eat simply because you felt bad for him? Because you felt crummy about saying "No" originally and went out of your way to be a good person? Is it at all possible that this guy was simply a hobo? Maybe you don't give yourself enough credit for just being a nice dude that day.

Yeah, that must have been it.

 

[Chrysaor]

Cat that's very considerate of you, and I for one feel equally compelled to do those sorta things. Atheists and myself just see all that as self action. That holy spirit thing is what I'd call the Self or Soul, just an aspect of your consciousness. Just because we use different terms doesn't mean that kind of encounter doesn't mean equally as much to us. I don't think it deserves a rolleyes.

 

[ReD_Fist]

yeah, because athiests are the only ones causing trouble for the majority. like the parents television council, with 99.8% of FCC complaints http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20041207-4442.htm oh wait...

you getting all bent out of shape over the issue makes you just as stupid as that one parent.

Ya this is true,but relgion or not there looking out for the folks.

Janet Jackson
Got the ball rolling, hehe.

 

[oosyxxx]

i got a hypo for those whose lives are more or less governed by faith. say you're on trial for a heinous crime that you did not commit, and the facts, or lack thereof, bear out during the trial that you almost certainly did not commit the crime, or at least it could not be proven that you did. and then, as the jury (of which i am a part) is deliberating, God starts talking to me. He tells me that you did it. my fellow jurors share my religious beliefs, and i instantly tell them about this, and based on this, we decide to convict you.

thoughts?

 

[Cat Fuzz]

Yeah, yeah. What if, what if, what if.......blah blah blah.

 

[Stilgar]

i got a hypo for those whose lives are more or less governed by faith. say you're on trial for a heinous crime that you did not commit, and the facts, or lack thereof, bear out during the trial that you almost certainly did not commit the crime, or at least it could not be proven that you did. and then, as the jury (of which i am a part) is deliberating, God starts talking to me. He tells me that you did it. my fellow jurors share my religious beliefs, and i instantly tell them about this, and based on this, we decide to convict you.

thoughts?

That's an odd hypothetical question. The other believers don't really know that god spoke to 'you'. If the evidence mounts up, then they should do the right thing. God is asking these people to put all their faith in this one juror, and they wouldn't know wether to believe him or not, which seems wrong (on the part of god) To assume that they would all believe the special juror is to make an assumption about christians in general, that they would place the defendants freedom at risk because the voice of god has spoken to them through this one person. How many christians, that you know, would believe the one juror in the first place? I don't believe Cat would.

To add to that... if we assume that the above(quoted) is true, then it seems fair to assume that either the defendant is indeed guilty, and doesn't know he is guilty, or that god is a liar. (or just makes bad mistakes) If god is as real, powerful and loving as the faith suggests, who could presume to believe such an entity capable of blatant callousness?

I could spend all day inventing nightmare hypothetical scenarios about god, but I probably wouldn't be treating the subject fairly.

 

[oosyxxx]

Yeah, yeah. What if, what if, what if.......blah blah blah.

yeeeeeeeeep.

 

[Nachimir]

To add to that... if we assume that the above(quoted) is true, then it seems fair to assume that either the defendant is indeed guilty, and doesn't know he is guilty, or that god is a liar. (or just makes bad mistakes) If god is as real, powerful and loving as the faith suggests, who could presume to believe such an entity capable of blatant callousness?

"If we assume it is true". You have to tell the difference between divine revelation and psychosis though. I'd like to see some criteria for that, from anyone.

 

[bobtheking]

Ya this is true,but relgion or not there looking out for the folks.

Janet Jackson
Got the ball rolling, hehe.

bull****.

so as long as you agree with whoever is bitching, you think it is fine to give in even if they don't represent the majority?

you are either a ****ing hypocrit, a ****ing dumbass, or too stupid to know what you are saying.

 

[oosyxxx]

the difference between divine revelation and psychosis is the difference between god coming down and stopping those motha****ing bullets from hitting jules and vincent and my gramma seeing jesus walk out of the wall and having him tell her everything would be ok. one is certainly fiction, and one, well, what do you think?

 

[Mister_Prophet]

the difference between divine revelation and psychosis is the difference between god coming down and stopping those motha****ing bullets from hitting jules and vincent and my gramma seeing jesus walk out of the wall and having him tell her everything would be ok. one is certainly fiction, and one, well, what do you think?

I was gonna make a Pulp Fiction reference with the bullet thing earlier because it is a good example of what we are talking about. But I didn't.

In Pulp Fiction, two hit man get surprised by some guy (who looks alot like Jerry Seinfeld) who blasts away the payload from an entire revolver. The two hit man stand there and look at the wall behind them to see all the bullet holes from the gun planted in the wall right behind where there bodies were. Now later in a car ride, they bring up what they both had just experienced. One guy thinks it is a freak occurance while the other guy thinks it was divine intervention. It is a movie of course, but the way the scene was setup you really couldn't tell what the hell happened.

Just an interesting comparison to what is going on here. That's why some people will see the face of mary on the underbelly of an under-pass, and others will see a dirt smear. Sometimes it is just a freaking dirt smear.

 

[Stilgar]

"If we assume it is true". You have to tell the difference between divine revelation and psychosis though. I'd like to see some criteria for that, from anyone.

Criteria? I've some got criteria for ya, it invovles me whooping your arse at dow tonight with the aid of some divine intervention.

 

[ReD_Fist]

bull****.

so as long as you agree with whoever is bitching, you think it is fine to give in even if they don't represent the majority?

you are either a ****ing hypocrit, a ****ing dumbass, or too stupid to know what you are saying.

One big problem there buddy,they are on the majority side of things,and you know it.
The guy in calfornia whos kid whom he doesnt even have custody of ,about the "under God" in the pledge,now thats a minority,and he don't speak for anyone accept his own self.

 

[Nachimir]

Later, I will make dirt smears out of any space marines that head my way. Divine Emperor my ass

 

[bobtheking]

One big problem there buddy,they are on the majority side of things,and you know it.
The guy in calfornia whos kid whom he doesnt even have custody of ,about the "under God" in the pledge,now thats a minority,and he don't speak for anyone accept his own self.

Americans do not want the government to censor what they watch, according to a study released yesterday by TV Watch, a nonprofit advocacy group. Three out of four of the 1,002 people polled for the survey "strongly agreed" that they would rather decide what programs to watch instead of having government censors decide, researchers reported.

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=domesticNews&storyID=8380162

oops!

edit: i'd say the idiot parent has an even bigger portion of people agreeing with him than the moral decency retards.

 

[Stilgar]

Wow, just over 1000 people. Truly representative of a nation of millions.

 

[bobtheking]

Wow, just over 1000 people. Truly representative of a nation of millions.

ah yes, i forgot you are supposed to ask everyone in the country.

1000 people is standard for nationwide polls, the margin of error is 3.1%.

edit: http://www.gallup.com/help/FAQs/poll1.asp