Personality test...

[Claw]

Originally posted by BangOut
Those magazines don't respect celebrities, we don't respect celebrities, no one really does... BUT... they are interesting. They are given attention because they are INTERESTING and on occassion entertaining.

Maybe the mags don't and we don't but I've seen 16+ yrs olds, even obvious "adults" (physically) cheering at celebs in extasy... it makes me sick.
And I get also sick at those capitalists in fine suits walking around with the nose in the air, getting asked thair opinion by greasy reporters, talking sh*t about how workers must be more flexible and work for less or else the world market will collapse...
Hang 'em high is what I'd propose...
I wish we could just ignore those retarded scum, but we can't. It's corrupt politicians and managers and stuff who make important decisions fo all of us... not that I really believe they are exceptionally bad... they are just evidence a human isn't good by nature. Either one bothers to make an effort or one's giving in to being scum. Champagne drinking scum in some cases.

The richest ppl in the world aren't celebs anyway... but Bill Gates guys. And I don't think he's the worst. He's just a typical product of the American society: a pure capitalist.

I don't envy celebs being rich or anything... I'd like to be rich too, and I have no intention of donating 50% if I ever get rich. But if I should ever own over 10 million, I'll donate one instantly. I'll still be rich with 9 million.
It's just all the fuss that bugs me... a bit. I don't run around fretting over it... only now and then I get annoyed...

Oh, and I respect Robbie Williams for his musik, or Michael Schumacher for being a really great driver. I can't go around looking down on everyone... I ain't that good. But I hate capitalists. The business guys that is. Making moiney by having money already, I despise those especially. Most companies don't feel the least responsible for their workers, and I honetly believe the rich share holders and managers deem themselves gods compared to a simple worker... an insect of a human they can crush under their heels...
I believe sooner or later there will be social disorder again. It'S just the way it always went and always will unless humansd change fundamentally... which isn't to be expected in the near future... near meaning as long as I can think, which is very long.

PS: 'hoarding' is what I meant BangOut...

 

[Claw]

Originally posted by The Spiritwalker


Well you twit.. I bet YOU would care if you and/or yours needed help.. and would hope for a few token actions

I for one was very grateful for the help that was given my family when I was a kid...
If you had a child that was dying.. I bet you would be in tears when/if the "Make a Wish Foundation" came calling..

If some blue-haired lady wants to give some of her $$$ to help some faceless child living in poverty..
Or some movie star that makes 10 mil. a film give money to help the families of the NY/DC tradgies..
Or me giving my 3 dollars in canned dog food to the NCARL..

It dosen't matter the "whys" people have for helping others.. just as long as those that CAN.. DO..

Now tell me "Mr. really dumbass person that gets his name from a Japanese production company of really bad films." would YOU care why someone was putting .50 in your cup.. if you were homeless?

think about it.

As a matter of fact, I do believe the "why" matters.

Because that celebrity could afford 10 times as much as it gives in most cases and wouldn't even 'feel' the loss... but that doesn't happen. That is why African nations still owe ridiculously high amounts of money to our banks... hell, with what we've done to their societies, we should f*** half their debts and give them a pause in their interest payments so they can try to establish some economy. I recently read about an African country that actually had a pretty well-off economy if it just didn't have to pay the ridiculously high interest rates. Hell, the European civilization (feel yourself included, Americans) spread over the whole world, shaking and destroying entire civilizations and even now after "we all know it was wrong and we've much higher morals now" they still suffer under our tyrany. We just use other tools of suppression.

My point is that the charity given isn't something we should be overly proud of. It's an obligation. Don't bash Dai2 for stating the obvious. We're basically selfish bastards; exception proves the rule.

PS: your 3 dollars in dog food propably hurt you more than the film star whatever much (s)he gave... after the first 10 million money really starts to loose it's relevance.


Attitude does matter! Or else Bill Gates will get into heaven and I won't cos I can't afford a ticket! (just a metaphor)


PS: I gotta add this one about "CAN DO"
Did you ever think of why they CAN DO? Becuse the concert tickets are so f*** expensive... rich ppl don't make money... they take it from someone else... and usually they are rich because they are good at getting more in return than they give...

 

[oosyxxx]

ALL RIGHT SPIRITWALKER! SHOW THOSE ****OS WHO THE MAN IS! WOAHHHHHHHHHHH-YAY-YUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! AND DON'T HOLD BACK ON THE SWEAR WORDS NEITHER!

 

[Stilgar]

perhaps the truth behind the action is sometimes more important than the action itself.

 

[Stilgar]

I dont understand Claw, you dont like capitalists but you would like to be rich ? ...... so either you better get lucky and win the lottery or else you're going to have to follow a capitalist dogma.... capital for the sake of capital....

 

[Claw]

Originally posted by The Spiritwalker
If Gates/Clooney/Jordan.. whomever.. that only gave 1mil... DIDN'T
then where would the people that needed it be..?

Wrong Question.
Correct Question: If Gates/Clooney/Jordan that have 1mil...
DIDN'T
then who would be the people that had it?


My point was how much one gives compared to how much one could afford to give. I know Gates gave 100 million $ once, but that's nearly NOTHING compared to how much he actually has.
I propably donated more that he did (in relation to my wealth) this year. But at the same time, I need the money more 'cos a bigger part of it goes to covering basic needs. Get it? I don't expect him to give up half his possesions... but f*** 1% of his wealth wouldn't be asked too much...
I heard he donated quite often though... mabye he did even reach the 1% over some time... but others didn't... and I doubt he gave 1% per year..

 

[Claw]

Originally posted by Stilgar
perhaps the truth behind the action is sometimes more important than the action itself.

The simple truth.

I dont understand Claw, you dont like capitalists but you would like to be rich ? ...... so either you better get lucky and win the lottery or else you're going to have to follow a capitalist dogma.... capital for the sake of capital....

Too late for another lengthy post... just let me tell you that your sight is overly simplified. Not being capitalisic doesn't mean giving away every cent you don't really need. If I could earn 20 mil and donate 5 mil, I wouldn't be a capitalist... donating stuff isn't a capitalist thing, esp. not donating 25% of what one has.

Capitalism is an ideology for human society... like communism. Capitalists believe in a kind of automatic regulation due to economics. No B$ laws protecting the consumer needed... no welfare either... everyone gets his share.
Capitalism has failed, jobless ppl are evidence. It'll just take some time for everyone to understand the problem isn't the system, but the people.

 

[SpiritWalker]

As a matter of fact, I do believe the "why" matters.

Because that celebrity could afford 10 times as much as it gives in most cases and wouldn't even 'feel' the loss... but that doesn't happen. That is why African nations still owe ridiculously high amounts of money to our banks... hell, with what we've done to their societies, we should f*** half their debts and give them a pause in their interest payments so they can try to establish some economy. I recently read about an African country that actually had a pretty well-off economy if it just didn't have to pay the ridiculously high interest rates.

We/I am not talking about banks.. I am talking about private citizens.. I do agree your point about the banks..


Hell, the European civilization (feel yourself included, Americans) spread over the whole world, shaking and destroying entire civilizations and even now after "we all know it was wrong and we've much higher morals now" they still suffer under our tyrany. We just use other tools of suppression.

sounds kinda like the Cathloic church.. oopsss wrong thread..


My point is that the charity given isn't something we should be overly proud of. It's an obligation. Don't bash Dai2 for stating the obvious. We're basically selfish bastards; exception proves the rule.

Charity, isn't an obligation.. it's something that people can do.. if they are willing and able.. I don't hold anything against the billionaires that don't.. but it would be great if they did..
And yes we are selfish bastards..for the most part..but I don't think that we should be REQUIRED to help.. like.. maybe ..what if I didn't belive in the "charity" that I was being required to give to?


Attitude does matter! Or else Bill Gates will get into heaven and I won't cos I can't afford a ticket! (just a metaphor)


So.. if Bin Laden..say.. were to donate 99% of his wealth... then he would be a better person than Gates.. who say donates say, LESS than .01%

PS: I gotta add this one about "CAN DO"
Did you ever think of why they CAN DO? Becuse the concert tickets are so f*** expensive... rich ppl don't make money... they take it from someone else... and usually they are rich because they are good at getting more in return than they give...

I just can't find fault in people that do something to help others.. no matter how small.. sure it would be great if the Gates of the world did more.. but hey.. something is better than nothing..

 

[BangOut]

LOL @ all of you

Bill Gates donates a ****load of money and has bequeathed less than 10% of his fortune to his family, with the rest going to charities

Will his family still be rich? You betcha... but 90+% going to charities is impressive

 

[SpiritWalker]

Originally posted by Claw


I know Gates gave 100 million $ once, but that's nearly NOTHING compared to how much he actually has.


do you think that the people that benifited from that 100 mil.. thought it was nothing..

there is no law that says that anyone should (and there shouldn't be) give away there $$$ (hard earned or not)..

It would be great if people that could afford more did.. but hey.. that's the way things are.. maybe one day they will be better..

 

[SpiritWalker]

Originally posted by oosyxxx
ALL RIGHT SPIRITWALKER! SHOW THOSE ****OS WHO THE MAN IS! WOAHHHHHHHHHHH-YAY-YUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! AND DON'T HOLD BACK ON THE SWEAR WORDS NEITHER!

Hey.. jus cause I'm not a foul mouth bratty kid.. don't mean nothin!

 

[Skorch]

Screw u Spirit...we won because we could...and Europe was the first one in the barrel, with every other country stomping on us...

...If another civilization had taken over the world, you'd be raggin' on them...sour grapes, thats all...

 

[SpiritWalker]

Originally posted by Skorch
Screw u Spirit...we won because we could...and Europe was the first one in the barrel, with every other country stomping on us...

...If another civilization had taken over the world, you'd be raggin' on them...sour grapes, thats all...

huh? what are you talking about????

If you mean my comment about the Cathloic church...

I loath the Cathloic Church.. because IMO.. it is the most morally corrupt organization around today..
why?
Let's see..
The Cathloic Church is REAL good at making backdoor deals with some of the most vile worthless peoples that could ever be imagined..just to be left alone..
They are GREAT at covering up the FACT that a rather LARGE
%age of their staff are some the crap that they say is "sinful"..
and many other things like that.. BUT those are the worst..

 

[Frostblood]

Claw : Maybe the mags don't and we don't but I've seen 16+ yrs olds, even obvious "adults" (physically) cheering at celebs in extasy... it makes me sick.

I agree. I've seen people that really seem to be obsessed with celeberitys. I've also known someone with anorexia and while I dont think that was a result of the media, in many people it is...before the advent of the mass media anorexia was unheard of. It still is in developing countrys.
As for the capitalism v something else debate, I think that capitalism has failed but there is no viable alternative yet, and compared to its rivals it is very good indeed.

Spirit : The point is, yes Bill Gates gave a humongous amount and it did a huge amount of good, but think of it this way : he didn't give thousands of times more than he did give, and that would have done thousands of times more. By his decision he denied people billions of dollars. He has a legal right to do that of course, and i'm not saying he should sell his whole company and give it away, but he must have had more than 100 million of disposable income. The people on the recieving end won't care of course, but thats not the point.

BangOut : Gates is in a tiny minority of celebritys, but that is very good news.

The "white people stompted all over everyone's civilisations" argument has come up again I see...In the newspaper yesterday someone wrote in to say "There was a fundamentalist faction who slaughtered heretics, banned theatre and oppressed women. They invaded other nations and conducted witch hunts. They were the crusaders. Get the point?" So? That was 500 years ago and the Taliban are still worse than that. Stop living in the past.

 

[lucifix]

Right wing commies
Leftist Nazis
Point their fingers
Rumours linger

We don't care what you think

Branded sexist
Labelled racist
Want it clearer ?
Check the mirror

We don't care what you think

Lies and slander in vain try to shame us
Riots, protests, violence just makes us famous
TV interviews, free publicity
Increase record sales dramatically

The left they say I'm a facist
The right calling me communist
Hate hate hate hatred for all - one and all
No matter what you believe
Don't believe in you - and that's true

Some would say that we're biased
Accusations that we are racist
Well, **** comes in all hues
Now this means you
Cause things ain't always like they seem

We hate everyone

We don't care what you think

 

[Claw]

Originally posted by The Spiritwalker

We/I am not talking about banks.. I am talking about private citizens.. I do agree your point about the banks..

It's a matter of principles. Think about how many hard working ppl have to give as much as they can afford to make up for how much an incredibly rich person can do. And then I hear one of those sluts in her incredibly expensive dress saying into a camera how important charity is and that everyone has to give his share when she actually gives than she could afford while a hard working person in a bad-payed job can't afford a holiday tip into a foreign country and still has a little for welfare... but maybe you americans don't have such a tradition of being charitable as we Germans... that's why you're so baffled by some billionaire donating his loose change... kinda explains why your country is so wealthy and stuff...

Charity, isn't an obligation.. it's something that people can do.. if they are willing and able.. I don't hold anything against the billionaires that don't.. but it would be great if they did..
And yes we are selfish bastards..for the most part..but I don't think that we should be REQUIRED to help.. like.. maybe ..what if I didn't belive in the "charity" that I was being required to give to?

That is a matter of philosophy and moralty really. I think it is. All our society and moralty boils down to the belief we need to help each other to survive. And that doesn't exclude persons who don't seem to need this help anymore... for instance, there is a law in Germany saying if you see a person in urgent need you are REQUIRED to help or you can get punished. This means physical threats like being hurt actually but it's the same principle. Do I help or do I let 'em die? If I ever see a billionaire in danger I'll ask him to write me a cheque before I help him...
Yes I do hold it against billionaires who don't help. It's immoral. Rich people tend to be anti-social because they don't 'need' society anymore. Companies would hold slaves if they thought it'd increase their profit.
The Bavarian Constitution includes a part about ethic principles that should be applied... one paragraph says "property obliges" so I am not the only freak who thinks differently than you...
And to your last question: You'd be a capitalist, of course. Which is what you are.

So.. if Bin Laden..say.. were to donate 99% of his wealth... then he would be a better person than Gates.. who say donates say, LESS than .01%

Argh. That was uncalled for. And completly besides the point also. You can't add and substract good and evil deeds. Bin Laden is a very evil person... what I was saying is that a rich person donating 0.001% of it's money isn't better than a worker donating 0.1% just 'cos 0.001% of his billions is more than the worker's 0.1% Got it?

I just can't find fault in people that do something to help others.. no matter how small.. sure it would be great if the Gates of the world did more.. but hey.. something is better than nothing..

Besides the point again... and the "no matter how small" argument has just been invented to encourage people who can't afford high sums to give at least as much as they feel they can.
But his topic has been covered before...

 

[Claw]

flame

Originally posted by The Spiritwalker
do you think that the people that benifited from that 100 mil.. thought it was nothing..

I don't know if they knew it came from Bill Gates... or cared. You're coming with the quantity argument again when I am talking about ethicality. Hopeless.

there is no law that says that anyone should (and there shouldn't be) give away there $$$ (hard earned or not)..

Didn't ya hear about taxes? What do you think taxes are? Obligatory donations of course... rich people could build their own streets and not allow poor people to use them unless they are on errands for those rich. How would you like to be OWNED by someone? Nothing in capitalism says that isn't OK. If you think it isn't OK that is the part in yourself that isn't entirely capitalistic.
Of course there has to be a legal reason why ownage of your person is transferred to somebody else...

Besides which, the "law" argument is cheap and shallow.
Say... if I started a revolution, killing a few ppl in the process... and undid the laws afterwards, promoting anarchy... would that mean the killings were OK 'cos the law is no more? I am only an evil murderer if I fail and a respectable revolutionary if I succeed?
See, my point is laws don't make the difference between good and evil. Laws are rules for regulating social interaction and also supposedly expression of people's will... but what about a society in which the opinions of a few rich people are more relevant than those of millions? You say whatever the rich want is OK? I can tell ya that there's a number of laws that go against people's will and? They exist still. Just 'cos something is legal doesn't mean it's right also. Morals are also rules. Unwritten, but they define us. They say what we think is OK and what is not. And it is a fundamental belief among many people that the behaviour of rich capitalists is not OK.

It would be great if people that could afford more did.. but hey.. that's the way things are.. maybe one day they will be better..

ARGH! YOU DID IT! YOU SAID "that's the way things are"! HOW I HATE THAT PHRASE! YOU... YOU... GRRrrr....

[/calmly] Phew... now... that phrase... it is an utter lie. What are 'things'? The environment isn't to be blamed... it's the people. The way things are is the way we are. We decide how things are. 'Things' don't chage while we sit and watch. We change things by changing ourselves. But you don't show the slightest will to do so. You won't change 'things' with that attitude. You are, in fact, to be blame for 'the way things are' by accepting it. People with your attitude fortify 'the way things are' and make sure they won't get better. Look at history.
equal humans form society --> upper class<>lower class --> civil unrest --> Bang! BOOM! Crash! revolution! --> *cough* equal humans form new society --> upper class<>lower class --> civil unrest --> Bloodshed again... --> next try (...) --> TO BE CONTINUED...

nothing changes unless you change...



PS: oh, well. You may have noticed I get easily tempered... just need to release steam to cool down...

 

[SpiritWalker]

Originally posted by Claw
And then I hear one of those sluts in her incredibly expensive dress saying into a camera how important charity is and that everyone has to give his share when she actually gives than she could afford while a hard working person in a bad-payed job can't afford a holiday tip into a foreign country and still has a little for welfare...
seems to me that you have a problem with people that have $$$ but don't help people.. it may not be "right" but people have to make their own choices, what if I.. who has never had tons of cash.. win a huge lottery... and I keep EVERY PENNY for myself..if I have had a hard life and not a lot of the finer things.. then nobody would say a thing about it.., but if I earned all my $$$$ and was selfish.. that's bad, if I don't want to give the majority away?? that's kinda odd to me..

but maybe you americans don't have such a tradition of being charitable as we Germans...

yeah..you guys are real charitable...you made the gas almost painless.. and the rooms real big so the jews could go with their friends.. given a choice of being an amercian or german..I would be an amercian.. even if we did butcher the natives..

that's why you're so baffled by some billionaire donating his loose change...
not baffled.. I have always though that it was great that they do something..

kinda explains why your country is so wealthy and stuff...

for the most part hard work IS rewarded....


All our society and moralty boils down to the belief we need to help each other to survive.

but that's just not true.. we DON'T need to help.. I think that it's great when people help others.. no matter how little it's just great..

The Bavarian Constitution includes a part about ethic principles that should be applied... one paragraph says "property obliges" so I am not the only freak who thinks differently than you...
and that's the problem.. you shouldn't have a government that says what it's peoples ethics should be..

And to your last question: You'd be a capitalist, of course. Which is what you are.
I never asked the question.. and I am proud to be a capitalist..


It just seems to me that you need to learn that just because a billionaire dosn't give what they can "afford" dosen't mean that what they do give isn't wanted..

 

[Evil_Cope]

Originally posted by The Spiritwalker

but maybe you americans don't have such a tradition of being charitable as we Germans...

yeah..you guys are real charitable...you made the gas almost painless.. and the rooms real big so the jews could go with their friends.. given a choice of being an amercian or german..I would be an amercian.. even if we did butcher the natives..

that's below the belt spiritwalker.
shame on you.

 

[SpiritWalker]

Re: flame

Originally posted by Claw

I don't know if they knew it came from Bill Gates... or cared. You're coming with the quantity argument again when I am talking about ethicality. Hopeless.

and that is your problem.. depending on the ethics of the person giving time/money.. that is what they want to do.. and you saying that they should do more..when they don't have to do ANYTHING, just belittles the efforts of those who choose to do "something"
no matter how small.. to say to the Gates/and other rich peoples.. "hey you need to do more"..is just plain wrong..and I would even say selfish

Didn't ya hear about taxes? What do you think taxes are? Obligatory donations of course...
WRONG.. taxes are what is needed to keep this country afloat..
yes some of our taxes do go to charity.. but prolly less than 1%..

rich people could build their own streets and not allow poor people to use them unless they are on errands for those rich.
if they own the street that they.. then that is their progrative