Conservative talk show host waterboarded, admits it is torture

[-Jes-]

You started it, gave us **** and giggles for our participation (hell we were even ****talked back then - literally being called "european traitorist trash" while in bloody Florida quite a while BEFORE we decided to pull out), happily break geneva convention rules that we are adamant about protecting, lie about WMD's, VETO a condemning of a bombing of a UN BASE, THEN turn and bitch at us for being PO'ed for your lack of interest in those trying to help..

Nice one, Larkin.

And no, I didn't sign up.

Oh yeah, and we're still in full force at Afghan (700 men).
We just don't really give a sh!# about Iraq anymore, seeing your government couldn't be assed to tell it's "allies" the truth, or even pay the UN the slightest bit of acknowledgement.

"Freedom Fries, Freedom Toast!"

 

[Darkdrium]

The number of people who are still stuck in the middle ages is scary.

Yes, it is scary.

Now Jes, you can do statistics, and you are most likely probably right about them.
However I find in this case it does not serve to prove a point as each and every human life is as valuable as the other, so even though statistically the United States seem to have less casualties per capita, they still have a lot, and that's a lot of widows, parents and families living a tragedy. Even one and one only is one too much.

I still don't advocate torture. It seems to me you must be very conflicted psychologically and emotionally to be able to inflict physical or psychological pain to someone else voluntarily and to the point where that person begs for his or her life. And in this case, I do believe waterboarding is torture, as it is said it provokes the sensation of drowning (You die if you drown), so it makes the person extremely uncomfortable and anguished. I don't understand how some people can't see it as torture... :/

 

[Crotale]

Crotale, the reason we are advocating waterboarding conservatives is that they are the ones saying that waterboarding is not torture.

So either they are pussies afraid of getting trick drowned, or full of ****. Take your pick.

Back up the bus a minute. Only certain conservatives claimed waterboarding to not be torture. Now, if you want to get technical and claim that no torture should be allowed, what about the insect issue? Would you have preferred that? Or should we simply sit down with these guys, have a movie and a pizza and call it a day?

You can sit there at your computer and judge what has been done as being barbaric and inhuman, but what you tend to forget is that one, these people for the most part cannot be reasoned with, and two, they will use any excuse to attack innocent civilians. Our government needed a way to get to these guys and make them break. What other forms of interrogation would YOU have used? And don't give me that, "no lives were saved by using torture," because you have no proof of that.

When you can show me proof that our military and other government agencies have resorted to breaking limbs and leaving these guys to rot with their pain without medical treatment, then you can compare us to other countries who torture.

 

[-Jes-]

However I find in this case it does not serve to prove a point as each and every human life is as valuable as the other

-- as opposed to Larkin's theory.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

Back up the bus a minute. Only certain conservatives claimed waterboarding to not be torture. Now, if you want to get technical and claim that no torture should be allowed, what about the insect issue? Would you have preferred that? Or should we simply sit down with these guys, have a movie and a pizza and call it a day?

You can sit there at your computer and judge what has been done as being barbaric and inhuman, but what you tend to forget is that one, these people for the most part cannot be reasoned with, and two, they will use any excuse to attack innocent civilians. Our government needed a way to get to these guys and make them break. What other forms of interrogation would YOU have used? And don't give me that, "no lives were saved by using torture," because you have no proof of that.

When you can show me proof that our military and other government agencies have resorted to breaking limbs and leaving these guys to rot with their pain without medical treatment, then you can compare us to other countries who torture.

And I've just got to add to this, what form of interrogation can you think of that would NOT be considered torture and IS effective? I can't think of a single one.

 

[NeoNite]

 

[Sir_Brizz]

 

[T2A`]

I'm glad to see this guy got waterboarded properly. I've seen videos before where they did it the pussified way. This guy actually held his nose shut which is a big part in it being so bad -- the water goes into your mouth and pools in the back of your throat and nasal cavity, but since your nose is being held shut none of it can be expelled. Your brain immediately thinks you're drowning and starts to freak the f**k out and you lose all control over your body. Since you're tied down and can't move your brain goes into panic mode as it thinks you're about to die. Hence why people only last a few seconds even under controlled conditions where there is no reason to panic. I bet it's pretty terrifying.

We should keep a tally of who supports torture around here. I only glanced through the thread but I got:

• Crotale, Interbellum (who?), and Larkin. Gonna go ahead and assume hal. And Iron Felcher.
• Brizz doesn't support it per se but he defends those who support it, so we'll put him on the list too.

All conservatives and religious. Surprising. Once again, religion is merely an excuse to hate others.

People are forgetting the true issue here. The real issue is that publicly America does not advocate the use of torture as an interrogation technique. Admitting that we've waterboarded people and then declaring waterboarding torture is publicly admitting to our hypocrisy. Can't have that, can we? D:

Not that I've studied it but I've heard many times that torture doesn't work. It makes people talk, sure, but expecting good information from it is pretty dumb. Those getting tortured will tell you what you want to hear so you'll leave them alone.

 

[Plumb_Drumb]

And I've just got to add to this, what form of interrogation can you think of that would NOT be considered torture and IS effective? I can't think of a single one.

having to sit through one of those Jeesus ceremonies on the one of those Jeesus channels.

I mean, JEEESUUUUS!
________
Live sex

 

[Sir_Brizz]

All conservatives and religious. Surprising. Once again, religion is merely an excuse to hate others.

This has nothing to do with why I somewhat support it, and acting like it is is just a scapegoat to demonize "anyone who disagrees with me". It's the same demonization that's been going on since the technique's usage was publicized. Actually, it's the same demonization that has been going on since the left decided they needed to demonize conservatives and religious people (as if there are no religious people on the left... ?).

The reason I somewhat support it is that it is impossible for me to judge how effective the techniques were, and if they were effective then I stand behind them.

Not that I've studied it but I've heard many times that torture doesn't work. It makes people talk, sure, but expecting good information from it is pretty dumb. Those getting tortured will tell you what you want to hear so you'll leave them alone.

As Crotale said, interrogation is rarely used for first-class information. It's more often used to confirm or complement previously received data. And it's not like the interrogator is going to be in there asking leading questions, so how would the person being interrogated know "what they wanted to hear"?

I guess if they had gone with the insects, people would probably be sitting around not caring about what happened at all.

 

[Interbellum]

We should keep a tally of who supports torture around here. I only glanced through the thread but I got:

• Crotale, Interbellum (who? me!), and Larkin. Gonna go ahead and assume hal. And Iron Felcher.
• Brizz doesn't support it per se but he defends those who support it, so we'll put him on the list too.

All conservatives and religious. Surprising. Once again, religion is merely an excuse to hate others.

Well, I'm neither conservative nor religious (duh!), yet as you rightly mentioned I do support torture. I also support oldskool corporal and capital punishment, the right to keep & bear arms, strict immigration policies, the full and complete legalization of all drugs, prostitution, abortion, and victimless crimes in general, (embryonic) stem cell research, gay marriage, free universal healthcare and a basic income guarantee... among other things. Are we confused yet? Hint:

Spoiler

it's called common sense.

People are forgetting the true issue here. The real issue is that publicly America does not advocate the use of torture as an interrogation technique. Admitting that we've waterboarded people and then declaring waterboarding torture is publicly admitting to our hypocrisy.

Yes, sanctimoniousness is a major problem. Always has been.

Not that I've studied it but I've heard many times that torture doesn't work. It makes people talk, sure, but expecting good information from it is pretty dumb. Those getting tortured will tell you what you want to hear so you'll leave them alone.

That's why you must ask them very specific questions (like 'where did you hide the body / murder weapon / bomb' etc.), and never use torture to merely get a (meaningless) confession.

On a lighter note, it would be fun to have an extreme version of shows like Fear Factor, where people get tortured in various (reasonably safe) ways, and whoever lasts the longest wins the prize.

 

[Zur]

"Where is Bin Laden ?"
"I do not know. I am just normal Afghan that get sold by treacherous brother"
"Ok let him have it"
"Glugglugglugglug"
"Now tell us where Bin Laden is !"
"Ok, I tell you ... he is in cave 53234 on right side after big rock. I know this to be true because he tell me in person !"

 

[Larkin]

Talking about retarded (embryonic) stem cell research is retarded at this point. Adult stem cells is actually working in some cases and the lefties are still pushing this bull**** and honestly I see no point in the fight. All they are going to do is have to deal with the right telling them its murder when they could just admit that adult stem cell research actually is working and move on. Why deal with the fight? Its not like they actually lose anything here? Its basically just not wasting time trying to get embryonic stem cell research to the same point while avoiding a pointless endless fight. Sorry tangent, but still it makes no sense to me to continue the fight. Unless ofcourse, they think they need a reason for abortions...oh wait..that is exactly what this is....nevermind.

You started it, gave us **** and giggles for our participation (hell we were even ****talked back then - literally being called "european traitorist trash" while in bloody Florida quite a while BEFORE we decided to pull out), happily break geneva convention rules that we are adamant about protecting, lie about WMD's, VETO a condemning of a bombing of a UN BASE, THEN turn and bitch at us for being PO'ed for your lack of interest in those trying to help..

That first part is kinda funny. That sounds like you guys couldn't take a joke, then you most likely mouthed off and we came back with something hateful. Seems typical.

The WMD's thing was bad intelligence and not everyone was in on it even in the white house. One of the big reasons, one of them is a dem now.

I remember them breaking the geneva convention, but saying sorry soon after, but this may be a different event you are talking about.

And no, I didn't sign up.

So I was wrong, no biggie.

-- as opposed to Larkin's theory.

I never said that one life means less then another.

 

[Plumb_Drumb]

"Where is Bin Laden ?"
"I do not know. I am just normal Afghan that get sold by treacherous brother"
"Ok let him have it"
"Glugglugglugglug"
"Now tell us where Bin Laden is !"
"Ok, I tell you ... he is in cave 53234 on right side after big rock. I know this to be true because he tell me in person !"

proof that waterboarding is working.

I like how this Cheney deuche tells everybody we've save thousands of lives with this extra special interrogation, but doesn't even specify as to what incident might have occurred.

It's after the fact now, you can divulge your super secret information !
________
Park Royal 3 Condos Pattaya

 

[Hadmar]

The reason I somewhat support it is that it is impossible for me to judge how effective the techniques were, and if they were effective then I stand behind them.

So violating human rights is ok as long as it's effective?

Awesome.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

"Where is Bin Laden ?"
"I do not know. I am just normal Afghan that get sold by treacherous brother"
"Ok let him have it"
"Glugglugglugglug"
"Now tell us where Bin Laden is !"
"Ok, I tell you ... he is in cave 53234 on right side after big rock. I know this to be true because he tell me in person !"

See, this is what I mean. It is EXTREMELY unlikely that questions like this are being asked. The fact of the matter is that nobody in the current administration is going to release any more information about the methods or the effectiveness, because any level of effectiveness is adverse to their goal of releasing this information in the first place.

So violating human rights is ok as long as it's effective?

I guess it depends on what kind of "human rights" you think murderers should be afforded. If you are for capital punishment (for anyone) then that is a pretty hypocritical stance. I find it really hard to sympathize with these people at all.

 

[kiff]

recently he decided to prove waterboarding is not torture, by having it done to himself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUkj9pjx3H0

man, after seeing that, I now agree even more with Pelosi and other dems in 2002 when they asked "is that all?"

what a joke. I've seen worse crap inflicted upon high school freshmen

You guys talking about wanting to break into people's houses or make them drown and stuff sound really hypocritical. That's how you'd treat people with whom you have a political disagreement?

I'm a bit shocked.

the hypocrisy of the left still shocks you?

so, the navy seals get waterboarded and so do many other citizens. WHERE's the outrage from the left?

 

[Jacks:Revenge]

Do you work with intel? Do you know how information is obtained and verified?

do you?

Try reading "The Craft of Intelligence" by former CIA intel guru Allen Dulles. There's lengthy discussion on torture citing exactly why it doesn't work.

Fact is that the Gitmo detainees are better cared for than many elderly that live in nursing homes in this country (not that I'm ragging on nursing homes at all).

Great job ignoring the point entirely.

We can't play world police and torture people at the same time, period. Bottom line.

 

[Plumb_Drumb]

See, this is what I mean. It is EXTREMELY unlikely that questions like this are being asked. The fact of the matter is that nobody in the current administration is going to release any more information about the methods or the effectiveness, because any level of effectiveness is adverse to their goal of releasing this information in the first place.

I guess it depends on what kind of "human rights" you think murderers should be afforded. If you are for capital punishment (for anyone) then that is a pretty hypocritical stance. I find it really hard to sympathize with these people at all.

speaking of hypcritical, why would you torture someone to attempt to stop terrorism.
They are one and the same really.
________
Park Royal 3 Condominium Pattaya

 

[Hadmar]

I guess it depends on what kind of "human rights" you think murderers should be afforded.

The famous kind of human rights. Not that other imposter brand. And murderers? Were they ever convicted in a fair trial with a judge, jury, lawyers and all the stuff that usually goes with it? Not that that would change anything, really.

If you are for capital punishment (for anyone) then that is a pretty hypocritical stance. I find it really hard to sympathize with these people at all.

Hmm, let's see, yep, I'm not a hypocrite. You do the math what that means in regards of my stance on capital punishment.