Will there be another UT?

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MonsOlympus

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May 27, 2004
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Kantham brings up a good point also. If theyd spent time actually advancing the gameplay, say building on 2k4 instead of rewriting it then perhaps more resources would have gone in the right place. Thats not to say the gameplay is bad or flawed but it is to say its lacking.

One thing the reviewers said is that it was just more of the same, well Im almost certain that it isnt more of the same its actually less than the same. Thats not to say UT3 is a lesser game than past games but from a code standpoint, somethings seemed to go backwards.

If Epic had spent the time upgrading UT2k4's gameplay, aside from just warfare and a few bits and pieces. You know, rosters for starters things could be different but Im not here to speculate. What I do know is that while UT3 is cleaner in some respects it could be considered a step backwards from 2k4, not in terms of gameplay but in terms of engine code.

Why this all came about I wouldnt know but I have heard things about UE3 being based on a branch closer to 2k3 than 2k4 which makes sense. The potential was there, I mean this is Epic we are talkin about not just another no name indy studio.

Theres certainly advancements in there but perhaps there were too many steps in the wrong directions and not enough in the right ones. Im sure Epic tried to please fans but all those were minor surface things and nothing deep down in the core, the things Epic did to make the game better, say the impact hammer alt for example, in my eyes worked. It might have been seem as gimmicky from a mapping standpoint but without fearless to go along with people might have seen things differently, ofcoarse its not a bad map so dont get me wrong here.

There just needed to be more to it, when you look at UT3 and you see a fixed UE1 you gotta know somethings wrong. UE2.5 was by no means perfect, it was a hacked version of UE1 with bits and pieces all b0rked. Perhaps UT3 was too much too soon, Epic should have perhaps waiting until the engine was in perfect (not to be taken literally :lol:) workin order before attempting to make a project of the scale of the original unreal envy plans.
 
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MonsOlympus

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Thats kinda not what I meant if you were directing that at me. What I meant was a future direction, like TF2 or many other shooters. It doesnt have to be ww2 shooter and I think TF2 and L4D hammer that home. The popularity of invasion in 2k4 shoulda told epic somethin right? Not everyone wants to do PvP! The coop in UT3 and GoW is a joke, I mean cmon, nothin we havent seen many a time on PC over the years. Lets BFH!

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Call me crazy but Epic has a HUGE drawcard in this area cause... they actually have bots and AI that works online yet they rarely exploit it@!
 
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DarkSonny

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Apr 8, 2008
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You are crazy dude? Omg didn't you realize that Epic tried to make a comeback to ut classic style ( 80% game ) mixed with ut2004 style (20% game) ? Isn't ut2004 expansion or continuation or so...

Crazy!

Be or not to be...
 

MonsOlympus

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You are crazy dude? Omg didn't you realize that Epic tried to make a comeback to ut classic style ( 80% game ) mixed with ut2004 style (20% game) ? Isn't ut2004 expansion or continuation or so...

Crazy!

Be or not to be...

Actually 2k4 was a return to UT for 2k3, assualt and invasion... Plus fixes for exploits like boost dodge, depends on how you describe that one though.

UT3 tried to expand on ons and add vctf to cement it as a gametype, what they didnt look at was mods like fraghouse invasion and take it seriously! Hell I wouldnt mind a game with AI like pariah with TF2's campaign style CP maps, UT3's vehicles and weapons. Assault and Invasion, pffft!

Epic coulda blasted it! All the assets were there, if they wanted more they coulda but instead we get a player scale with a halo! Dynamic PvE campaign styled assault, basically. The AI woulda needed work but its nothin that GoW doesnt have Id imagine.

Now UC2 expanded on UC with all the goodies, nice adren moves with a solid UI as well. None of that was ib UT3! its still timed powerups, no option to hold, no option to pickup more than one and activate 2 etc. FPS has come along way since UT, 80% maybe but FPS have come 200% further since that orignal %100 you put together!
 

Raynor.Z

Ad Nocendum Potentes Sumus
Feb 1, 2006
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Don't compare UC2 with UT3 because it's something completely different and overall, UT needs to stay UT. Sure - vehicles are nice, but lets not try to over-innovate.
 

MonsOlympus

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Its not over innovating it, its called options. Ever heard of relics? well then, dont complain about adren moves in UC2! Sorry but it had to be said!
 

Raynor.Z

Ad Nocendum Potentes Sumus
Feb 1, 2006
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Never complained about UC2 adrenaline moves, just pointed the fact about different games.
 

MonsOlympus

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Surely that fact is one! What Im sayin is that relics and adren moves share inherent similarities, its not totally unfeasable that they become one in the same, which name is more popular I'll leave up to the culture. All I know is what I see in green comments :p
 
Nov 4, 2001
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The Kitchen
I really don't agree with all the UT3 hate, but I can sorta understand why people are disappointed. I never fail to enjoy myself when I play DM, CTF, vCTF, Warfare, or especially TDM (players against bots with a 1:2 bot ratio and a friend). But I don't play it like it's a sport and never compete online. Some people want an online experience, and I guess UT3 has failed them; but for me, it's still solid gold. I enjoy the stock gameplay in UT3 far more than UT99's stock gameplay, as the weapons feel better-balanced and faster and are more entertaining to use.

That said, UT3 is not without its flaws. No bot customization (in UT99 you could customize all sorts of crap for each individual bot, and I loved that); bot allocation is inflexible (can't do a Players vs. Bots match offline unless you host a private online TDM game for just yourself, and you're still limited to just two enemies); abominable menu that's extremely awkward to use and at times buggy (friends list, game browser, etc); questionable AI behavior (link gun alt fire, etc); some poorly-balanced gimmick powerups (personal slow field generator - I'm looking at YOU DM-OceanRelic, you bastard. Hitscan weapons should at least be able to penetrate that damn thing); poorly-designed stock mutators (Why the HELL isn't Friendly Fire a simple CONFIGURABLE SLIDER? Why the hell did they cap that at 50%? Totally unnecessary); etc. Depending on who you ask, the vehicle bugs in UT3 are also flaws, but honestly I find them incredibly hilarious. It never gets old for me when a Leviathan does a huge front flip for no reason whatsoever, sometimes exploding afterwards and sometimes not.

Mods can help overcome a lot of this stuff, though. If you aren't a huge die-hard online player who ABSOLUTELY MUST kill real people or else life isn't worth living, UT3 is still a fantastic game, but I can understand why not everyone feels this way. It's a shame that it shipped with so many issues to turn off so many people and that, even now, the game feels so unpolished in some ways (especially the menus). Perhaps with better attention to details, UT3 might still be thriving, but what's done is done. I'm just glad the game hasn't been ruined for me personally.


And to whoever said GoW coop isn't fun: you clearly have never tried playing it melee- or chainsaw-only on Impossible with a friend. It's absolutely hysterical and incredibly enjoyable. That and trying to survive the Kryll swarm in the junker driving sequence without ever shooting the UV turret. Great entertainment value. Then again, I also enjoy playing GoW offline by myself because I really like the story, its presentation, and the awesome (and also hilarious) voice acting. If all you care about is the gameplay, I guess GoW isn't particularly incredible after a few playthroughs.
 

MonsOlympus

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And to whoever said GoW coop isn't fun: you clearly have never tried playing it melee- or chainsaw-only on Impossible with a friend. It's absolutely hysterical and incredibly enjoyable.

Someone said that? Damn them. Fun and originality = two totally different things.

If all you care about is the gameplay, I guess GoW isn't particularly incredible after a few playthroughs.

Thanks, I played it through once and that was enough to be annoyed at the "walkthrough" cuts. Id rather be locked in tbh. By no means is it not fun, infact I stated the opposite but it would seem people have a hard time being objective when it comes to epic, sure I might even have my own subjectivity but so far no one has said anything I havent heard.

UT3 is sick hey, hence the sig! The TDM was a surprise for me really, I didnt think Id like it as much as I did; in 2k4 I despised tdm and ctf, maybe because of TAM but that still doesnt explain ctf..

Nostalgia perhaps, either/or I certainly felt the return to the classic in this department. Its just a shame, well some people will hate me for sayin this but uc2 had a wicked dynamic in ctf cause of the player classes that reminded me of tribes! A game we certainly wont see again, UT on the other hand, I think theres more ridin on that one.

TF2 only took what? 7yrs. From quake mod to what it is now. If you ask me its a bigger success than counterstrike! We dont need no tac in our shooters right? :p

P.S. funny thing of it is, Im pretty sure that styled crosshair is in RPG's as well :lol:
 
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Fife8

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Aug 6, 2008
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Oh well, my post turned into a hate post, but thanks for the first replies anyway, I think it's pretty clear right now. I'm gonna forget it for the moment. I think Epic Games should do like iD software did with Quake Live, just a re-release of an old classic and make it even better. No more, no less.

Anyway, my rant about UT3 is the fact that the game is so ugly. ****ing ugly actually. Making everything look dirty and grimy is a very major design flaw if you ask me. Even the menu has this look. Wtf. It's not pretty or "kool". Best maps out there are probably Echelon and Integrity, by Slainchild. Those are two maps that were smartly designed. Congratulations to the HOLP team. These guys didn't get enough love.

So yeah, I guess it's just too bad it's all finished. The UT series. But hey, whatever. We all knew it was already dead, just reminding it again because that's the only thing we have to do right now. Sigh:(
 
Nov 4, 2001
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The Kitchen
Anyway, my rant about UT3 is the fact that the game is so ugly. ****ing ugly actually. Making everything look dirty and grimy is a very major design flaw if you ask me. Even the menu has this look. Wtf. It's not pretty or "kool". Best maps out there are probably Echelon and Integrity, by Slainchild. Those are two maps that were smartly designed. Congratulations to the HOLP team. These guys didn't get enough love.
Personal opinions are not design flaws
 

DarkSonny

Beware!
Apr 8, 2008
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In a time far far in the future when all of us are old or gone, UT will rise from the ashes as a FPS hologram game!:)

I hope i can still in the wave xd when me came an green dog...

Epic team will became old and will miss too and dissapear == dead :( ut will not the same
 
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Nov 4, 2001
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The Kitchen
True, but purposely adding eye bleeding, and migraine inducing fog/blur to every stock map, is.
Just turn off Depth of Field and bloom if you don't like it. I can't stand the implementation of either in UT3 so I leave them disabled.

And Muted post-processing really helps, too.

Really, though, at the end of the day, the art side of UT3 is not at all problematic. The only gripes I have about the art is that some of the models are OVER-detailed to the point where you can hardly discern any form (like half of the Necris maps), but they still look good.

sadly thats true. there is a lot of "noobspam" online these days. thats why you meet with some (skilled) friends on irc and go for some nice rounds of bta/tdm/ictf/whatever, without any spam, lameness and way more fun.
If this is true online (which I completely believe), then it's because flak and rockets are easiest to use when compensating for lag. It's hard as balls to pull off a proper shock combo in the heat of combat when you have ping to account for, especially if you aren't used to it. Even offline half my sniper kills are pure luck; I can only imagine how much harder it would be if I was playing regularly as a client instead of a listen server!

The Biorifle alt, though, really aught to be used much more often, as it's absurdly easy to kill people with it when you are using it properly.
 
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