UTXMP "should" be U2XMP!

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Sir_Brizz

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[tH]Angelus said:
Shouldn't the closed "beta" testers have done that anyways?
Unfortunately, they were. But the whining and complaining about the length of time the release was in coming had grown to such a level that NOT releasing the beta would have been more detrimental to the community than releasing a public beta. In fact, many of the bugs in PB1 had been found by the Beta Testers already...but you wouldn't know that because all you care about is that it's not identical line for line to U2XMP.
Maybe a pre-alpha but yeah ok.
Do you know ANYTHING about software development? It's pretty much recognized that an Alpha of software is NOT FEATURE COMPLETE. What "features" are missing from UTXMP whether or not they are working exactly right, even according to you?
The sniper rifle needs very little fixing as it is almost the same as the U2XMP one except for the scope.
This is a perfect example of one of the things that I personally think is A FUNDAMENTAL FLAW in U2XMP that should be removed from UTXMP. I knew alot of Rangers, even some "novice" ones, back in U2XMP that almost NEVER zoomed in. What is the point of giving the Ranger any other weapon than the Sniper Rifle if they can shoot it just as well as the Pistol in practically every situation?
If you watched these forums more you may have noticed that I have already posted suggested changes and I agree with the majority of the community, at least at the start of their posts like the "movement isnt right" thread which started off with some honest opinions which i totally agreed with then morphed into a stupid bitching competition between people who had good views of the game and people who wanted to change this into some kind of crap mod for ut2k4.
So in other words you think that your opinions are right and if anyone has an opposing opinion they are wrong.
This is not ut2k4 its XMP!
What's this? You unwittingly proved my point that XMP is NOT ATTACHED TO ANY GAME??? You, my good man, are exactly right! This isn't Ut2004! It's also NOT U2XMP! It's XMP, only AS A MOD FOR UT2004.
I beg to differ
So your true colors show through. You think that it's possible to have a perfect game and that U2XMP was it. You think that you don't need to change anything from one game to the next. If someone remade Wolfenstein 3D with updated Textures, you would pay $50 for it.
more than I have for you kid ;)
Apparently your first post has lost you more respect than it has gained you.
UTXMP is nothing like U2XMP. I understand there are some engine limitations and obviously those cant be gotten round, but there are major issues such as movement and game feeling that im sure arent caused by the engine.
Considering that alot of the community has embraced UTXMP and many people that complained about the first beta are even know less concerned with the feel of the game I think that this view is more of a minority than majority. At least half of the 4 month ago U2XMP community has left U2XMP and moved to UTXMP. Why? Because it feels like XMP and it's fun. You're just mad because all of the exploits you could take advantage of before aren't in UTXMP.
err... no it wouldnt... by what you said it would be different, nice one lad, rofl.
It would still be XMP.

XMP is a concept of [some number of] teams with [some number of] classes who capture certain objectives outside of their base to increase their "hold" on a map, use defensive deployables to defend their base, and try to capture all four of the "flags" (which could be just about anything).

XMP could easily be made into a four team game, a six team game, a three team game and still be XMP. XMP could easily have eight artifacts, three artifacts, six artifacts and STILL BE XMP. It could easily have a completely different array of weapons (i.e. UT2004 weapons) AND IT WOULD STILL BE XMP.

However, the problem isn't that you want to play XMP but better but that you want to play U2XMP on a better Master Server. My suggestion to you would be to write a modification to UTXMP that makes it identical to U2XMP and see how no one wants to play it.
So you dont even like U2XMP then?!?
Are your reading comprehension skills in the negatives? I like U2XMP just fine! However, there is no reason to port the game if no improvements are going to be made. Just leave it where it is and let it stagnate (because eventually you will find a game you like better and play that and no one will be left playing U2XMP).
I am very happy and grateful for what FMI are trying to do but I am not happy and grateful for what is in front of me at this stage.
Maybe you ought to try and show it better than you did in your first post. You really haven't gained any "friends" here, more likely enemies. Additionally, you are the minority still.
No, my feedback is going to be the most helpful thing that has been said on these forums. Im saying we have to listen to people who want UTXMP to be as similar to U2XMP as possible, because U2XMP was perfect,
Wrong. That is ENTIRELY your own opinion. Many here, including people from Legend Entertainment, the developers of FMI and U2XMP community members will completely disagree with that statement on many grounds. At the very least, fps and netcode.
UT2K4 is far from it,
There are thousands of people who would tend to disagree with that statement.
I dont want UTXMP to die within a month of its birth and if its like U2XMP it wont!
You (and several other people on these forums) need to pull your head out and recognize that U2XMP IS DEAD. No new players are coming to it, less than 100 people are playing it at any one time. The master server goes up and down. And it is incredibly unfriendly to noobs (and lots of regular players will attest to that).
because FMI cant aim to please the UT2K4 community with the mod simply because the UT2K4 community cant be expected to budge from their respective game eg ctf and ictf.
Many CTF players from these forums are already playing UTXMP regularly. Try not putting words into the community's mouth for once.
Therefore the people which FMI have to aim at is new players and ex-U2XMP players and to please them we have to listen to the experienced and known players of U2XMP.
Oh we do? I forgot where you said that FMI should care what the "experienced" players think. I haven't heard as much whining from a community about so many things as I have heard in this forum about UTXMP since the day Ut2k3 came out. The simple fact is: many of the "experienced" players are whining but most of the community is not. New players are not going to come to U2XMP on UT2004 because new players never stayed on U2XMP before the Master Server problems.
I am doing for now, but atm the master server's down again... one of "the real" xmp's only two problems and servers are quite laggy (its second problem) so there are few players, but the ones that are left nearly all have UT2K4 and dont want to play UTXMP so I think there lies the proof of a loss of community potentials by differing from a simple port.
You mean out of the whole 90 persona playerbase there's only like 30 of them left? Imagine that.
 
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cyb

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Dec 15, 2003
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Sir_Brizz said:
XMP is a concept of [some number of] teams with [some number of] classes who capture certain objectives outside of their base to increase their "hold" on a map, use defensive deployables to defend their base, and try to capture all four of the "flags" (which could be just about anything).

XMP could easily be made into a four team game, a six team game, a three team game and still be XMP. XMP could easily have eight artifacts, three artifacts, six artifacts and STILL BE XMP. It could easily have a completely different array of weapons (i.e. UT2004 weapons) AND IT WOULD STILL BE XMP.
:rolleyes: concept here, concept there. i really wonder where the hell you got that thought from. in every 2nd post from you we have to read about it, concept game, concept xmp, concept news paper, concept car.
 

Naib

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Jan 31, 2004
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[tH]Angelus said:
Personally I believe even with the release of the 1a patch the game is still not at a stage to be called a beta and im tired of people complimenting the attainment level of the game.

That's strange, I'm tired of people moaning because it's not as complete as they would like.

[tH]Angelus said:
Many more experienced players and clans have simply given up on UTXMP and returned to play U2XMP because it is fun to play.

But not as many as gave up with u2xmp due it it's faults and problems. How many players and clans stopped playing due to the people using exploits?

[tH]Angelus said:
And I must say it is n00b friendly, of course players who have been playing for a week cannot beat those who have practised every day for a year but the learning curve for new players is incredibly fast.

I find it very hard to agree with that. I've know loads of experienced gamers that try xmp, but then give up because they don't have a clue what is going on. I've spent a few nights in the last few weeks teaching people from the 12m UT'99 ctf team how to play.

[tH]Angelus said:
I would call this very much a beginning with graphics and some factors in place already but i cant bring myself to believe it to be a beta. Most betas that I have had experience of have been almost complete and this game is surely a long way away.

From what I see almost all of the game elements are in place, and it's now a matter of fixing bugs, and tweaking the balance. Which is what you would expect for a beta release. What, in your view, is missing from them game?
 

Sir_Brizz

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Maybe because it is? Quit being juvenile. You KNOW that EVERYTHING starts out as a concept. If you think that almost 100% of XMP could not be changed without changing the fundamental game design, you are either fooling yourself, brainwashed, or just plain unintelligent. The fact that any little thing in U2XMP that might have been different in the initial release would have changed your opinion on several matters is proof that XMP is only a concept and the only reason you are attributing the concept to any particular game is because there is only one game making use of the comcept.

I don't know what the complication is for some of you to understand this. It really isn't hard. Everything that has ever been invented began as a concept then was designed and then created. You obviously have never been involved with the creation of...well...anything or else this would be pretty clear to you.
 
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You should lock the thread, if he wants to ditch this mod that's his problem but the ranting might scare people away from here, you don't want that! that's what happened to xmp.
 

Mantik

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Hi. My name is a forum troll. I quote 50 things that people have said before making this post and take 95% of those quotes and use them out of context.

I have penis-envy denial.
 

FurociousFa

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Apr 1, 2004
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Angelus is a prick, but i feel the exact same way (or very closely)

even patched, its hardly a beta..

people who wanted to play utxmp wanted the feel of xmp, screw that textures colors or any of that, we wanted the feel. I really just think FMI took on more than they could handle, or had the skill to accomplish. Over the 8 months since they set out other (more) talented people could've been working towards the same goal, its just a shame.
 

Xaero

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www.xaero.us
argueoninternet.jpg
 

SwiftPaladin

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I just had a flash of when I used to dream I could move like the ranger in real life: such grace and finesse, fused with an arsenal of doom. Elegance meets bloodshed.
 

your friend

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FurociousFa said:
Angelus is a prick, but i feel the exact same way (or very closely)

even patched, its hardly a beta..

You do know what a 'beta' is, yes? If you do, please explain why this is 'hardly a beta', lol. I am confused.

Back in the day at work, when some friends and I got our hands on the windows xp beta, we didn't say to ourselves 'this is hardly a beta'. It wasn't supposed to be 100% feature complete. That's why it was called 'beta'. They needed our input to improve the quality of the finished product.

This mod is actully pretty good already, considering it's only in the beta stage. Most beta mods that I have tried dont even have completed maps, yet alone over 5 maps. To be honest, you're actually getting a lot more than what you should be getting at this stage of the game. If you're not sure what a beta is, all you have to do is use Google. I recommend anyone else here that doesn't know what 'beta' means to do the same.

I mean, let's be real... use some COMMON SENSE.

Unless you really did NOT know what a beta is. Then you're excused. But if that's the case, is it really wise to post about something you dont know much about? This case being, knowing what a beta is?

P.S. Brizz, good post.. but I dont even think you should waste your time trying to explain things to some people anymore, lol. If you took the time to do that, and a few people still show up with the same argument.. leave them be, hehe. I still see more people from these forums online than before and they dont even fully represent the majority of players who are online playing rather than spending their free time here (in the forums). No matter where you go, there always be those who take longer to grasp basic things. No sense in you excerting too much energy to explain it anymore, lol. In fact, I'm not going to waste much on it anymore myself - I dont post a whole lot here as it is. Too busy using my pc time to actually play the game I guess :(. Oh well.

They're just coming to this forum to get a few things off their chests and vent, since they realize their 'awesome' 30+ player online community is dying off. I mean, I guess I could understand how someone would be upset that their favorite game is dying off. But what I can't understand is how you can remain feeling the same way when a group of guys actually spend their free time bringing 'XMP' to a thriving community that has thousands of players - with the sole intent on letting XMP survive. Let me remind you, the U2xmp community wasn't doing much to help the situation (there were hardly any players online). Then, when FMI clearly announces UTxmp is in the beta stage(open beta) they reply back that they want to stay in U2xmp.

Do they somehow think they are 'hurting someone's feelings' (lol) by telling us they are staying in U2xmp? I dunno. Personally, it's just a game.. so I wouldn't hop online to announce something like that. But what I DO know is, before any talk of UTxmp there were basically NO U2xmp players I saw online. The few that I do see from time to time only started to pop up after the UTxmp beta was released. Go figure. People would rather shell out 40+ bucks for a stable game, than to spend 5 bucks (from the bargain bin) on a single player game that was 'modded' to miraculously play as a multiplayer game - aka Unreal 2. And people wondered why it was so laggy/buggy. Well it is no wonder to me nor the 500 or so players who have moved on since (it has been said in these forums that U2xmp had 500 players at its peak). You couldn't even give Unreal 2 away nowadays. In other words the U2xmp player base is not gaining new players. Before UTxmp servers even appeared online I saw almost no activity in the U2xmp servers. If U2xmp's community was doing so great, UTxmp would have never needed to be created.

So if those few want to come to these forums and sulk/cry let them, lol. Most of us know otherwise. The end.

Btw, that post http://www.xaero.us/forum/argueoninternet.jpg gave me a good chuckle Xaero.
 
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