1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Two Factor Authentication is now available on BeyondUnreal Forums. To configure it, visit your Profile and look for the "Two Step Verification" option on the left side. We can send codes via email (may be slower) or you can set up any TOTP Authenticator app on your phone (Authy, Google Authenticator, etc) to deliver codes. It is highly recommended that you configure this to keep your account safe.

UT 2k3/2k4 RainbowSix mute would like some testers

Discussion in 'Infiltration Development' started by meowcat, Apr 10, 2004.

  1. meowcat

    meowcat take a chance

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2001
    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    3
    Got any favorites R6 missions? I am trying to work in a basic storyline to tie everything together. Something along the lines of a bad Country suspected of ethnic cleansing, and your country going in to investigate and intervene. I have a few ideas for misisons, but I'm open to any ideas.
     
  2. Corporal_Lib [BR]

    Corporal_Lib [BR] Brazilian Graphic Designer & Gun Nut {=)

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    Messages:
    524
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nice news Meowcat (except for the lack of webhosting part, but you´ll certainly come over it), I´m reinstalling UT2k4, and will be waiting to test the new implementations (both YARM and TD rox... but will TD feature iron sights too, as YARM?)

    As sugestion for SP missons, I´m reading the R6 novel, and it seems to me that R6 for PSOne was a faithfull adaptation of the novel, so I would sugest some missions based on the novel (British embassy hostage rescue, shoot out and rescue on a Spanish Park and the final raid on the lab that was creating the ultimate virus to "purify humanity"... (that´s one is nice: everyone is using hazmat suits and a single shoot could kill cus the suit would be exposed to the mortal virus... bizarre!!!
    Keep up the good work, Meow!! XD
     
  3. Texx

    Texx New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2005
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    0
    The PSOne version was prolly the worst designed port of R6 ever made. The controls are horrible. The graphics were horrible and glitchy. Even the GB port was better. N64 had a port almost identical to the PC version. Better graphics, more stable port.

    The book is wonderful.
     
  4. chuckus

    chuckus Can't stop the bum rush.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2001
    Messages:
    771
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sorry to resurrect this thread but has Meowcat found a new host or has someone mirrored the latest beta for YARM?. I just found my UT2k4 and had a hankerin to play this.
     
  5. BTH

    BTH Dickcheese Faggot

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Messages:
    197
    Likes Received:
    0
    im waiting for this to be released too, lack of webspace doesnt sound like a big deal...
     
  6. chuckus

    chuckus Can't stop the bum rush.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2001
    Messages:
    771
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well I was referring to the version that's already been released. Without his webhosting ther's no mirrored site but it seems plenty of peopl have the install files on the HD. Can someone host it for a while or e-mail it to me. The last time I played it was Tango down for ut2k3 so I wanted to give YARM a spin now that I got my 2k4 back.


    EDIT: its all gravy gents. I got one off of file front. Both Yarm and Tango Down
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2006
  7. Corporal_Lib [BR]

    Corporal_Lib [BR] Brazilian Graphic Designer & Gun Nut {=)

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    Messages:
    524
    Likes Received:
    0
    Did you got YARM 1.10? With iron sights for rifles and SMGs? If you didn´t, I can send you chuckus!!! (and TD vehicles too..)
     
  8. chuckus

    chuckus Can't stop the bum rush.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2001
    Messages:
    771
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have TD 1.18 if that's the one.

    For YARM it's 104
     
  9. meowcat

    meowcat take a chance

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2001
    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    3
    Well, I hate to upload what I have without a website, but are there any file sites that you all recommend for uploading the latest version? If I zip up my latest version of YARM (with updated TD content) it is about 20Mb (too large to email). I also have a new version of TD vehicles w/ a Hound MI-4 helicopter and a test SP / Coop map.
     
  10. sir_edmond

    sir_edmond In my own world

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2003
    Messages:
    606
    Likes Received:
    0
    MeowCat have you considered signing up for the file hosting from filefront. You could use that to distribute files. Think they give you blog space now too.
     
  11. meowcat

    meowcat take a chance

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2001
    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    3
    @ siredmond: Thanks for pointing that out! I am going to get the current version together in a useable form and upload it there. I will update this post when its up (maybe a day or so, I have to make sure I have all of the files needed together and test them on my other comp).
     
  12. Corporal_Lib [BR]

    Corporal_Lib [BR] Brazilian Graphic Designer & Gun Nut {=)

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    Messages:
    524
    Likes Received:
    0
    Meow, you could also use (temporarily, for us, your fans) rapidshare.com, yousendit.com or other 1 week free upload spaces, how about? ;-)

    OMG, TD vehicles now have 1 helicopter!!! Sweetest of all sweet things! Good job! Wainting anxiously for the files...
     
  13. Psychomorph

    Psychomorph  

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Messages:
    2,267
    Likes Received:
    2
    It is so long ago since I played TD, I so want it now, since I start to hate INF more and more, sponsored by IBT and OICW.

    R6:RS was always my game Nr.1 when it comes to TacShooters, would be great if TD would develope itself to a full CQB mod-game, with high quality models, animations and stuff.


    -----
    @meowcat:
    Somewhere in this thread you asked if people have some "wishes" sort of, I have no clue how TD is now, since I didn't play it long, but they are of course some things I think would be important for such game.

    1) Movement
    The "movement key" should be a toggle between a slow (normal) walk and a fast (tactical) walk.
    The slow walk has perfect weapon accuracy on closer distances and you aim the weapon the fastest, same with motionless standind.
    The fast walk has a very acceptable accuracy on closer distances, fast aim too, but not as fast as when you walk, or stand.

    Holding the "movement key", or a separate "run key" (maybe both optional), you increase movement to a fast jog AKA run.
    The rifles are still held at the shoulder, but the barrel is pointed slightly down (about 20°).
    The pistols are still pointed forward, but not aimed, showing also about 20° down, you see them still almost centered, but the sights not alingned.
    You see "a lot" of view bob, since the movement isn't controlled, the weapon sways and you hear the breath after few seconds of running.
    You can run only forward, moving to the side, or backward uses the fast walk, so you can release the "movement/run key".

    If you crouch you use a slow crouch and fast crouch as equivalent to the slow walk and fast walk, but when you use the run function, you perform a ducked run, still run, lower stance, but slower. During the normal, upright run you can hold the "crouch key" to duck and keep moving.


    2) Weapon Handling
    An unaimed rifle should have freeaim and projectiles (hitscan) always impacts where the barrel shows. No crosshair, no conefire.
    The "freeaim zone" is pretty small, a bit ellyptic, to allow the weapon to be lowered a bit.

    A pistol should not be held unaimed, the sights are alingned/aimed always, but the "freeaim zone" is very elyptic, so you can lower the pistol to have open view and still aim/fire lower.
    Actually it should look and work exactly like the aimed pistols in Infiltration (in my opinion one of the most realistic features in Infiltration ever).

    Sniper rifles aren't shouldered all the time when you stand and move, they are held sideways (not visible in the 1st person).
    However, you can push the "use key" to shoulder it (not aimed, just prepared) and take it back to the sideways position by using the "use key" again. A shouldered sniper rifle increase swaying, so it is better to keep it low for later accurate aiming.
    The rifle will be kept at the shoulder also when you move, except run, than it moves to the low position and stays low even if you stop moving.
    After you aimed the scope, the rifle stays shouldered aswell.
    If you crouch the rifle will be shouldered and kept, even if you move crouched. Swaying doesn't increase when you crouch with a shouldered sniper rifle.
    Maybe that sounds to complicated, even if I think it is not, but I just would like to eliminate sniper rifles as CQB usable weapons, to make the player switching to a sidegun instead.

    When you run, rifles and pistols are pointed 20° down as said above, you still can fire, but you will automatical drop speed to the fast walk, the weapon will be pointed forward and only then fired. Once happened you can release the "run key" (which means you can release it before fireing anyway).

    Binocular aiming.
    It makes 0,000 point to me to implement reflex and red dot sights without to make it correct, at least if you care.
    Point is, they are aimed with both eyes open, atleast it is easily allowed/intended. In CQB a must.
    Here is an example. However you can make it, with a transparent sight at the centre like in the picture, or just a red point (which is in my opinion totally acceptable), it have to be.
    That kind of aiming wont make it a simple crossahair, close, but not exactly, because you see the weapon is far more closer to the view (blocks more view) and can influence the movement (slightly slower fast walk than usual), but it defenitely is made for effeciency.


    3) Injury / Hit System
    Lethal & fatal shots, or knock-out shots (trauma caused by an ammount of not vest piercing small caliber hits) take you down.

    Serious wounds (less fatal) and a bearable ammount of small caliber impacts to the vest will have a "shock" effect. That doesn't mean you stop moving prepared to be moved down, you still can move and even bring yourself into cover, but you suffer a speed loss and weapon accuracy is like not given (you fire into the ground, because you loose the weapon stability completely).
    Weapon accuracy recovers after some seconds, speed keeps slower.
    A system like this will not allow you to mow down an opponent, if he hits you serious first allready. Single shot will become more useful.

    Light damage caused by indirect hits (touching shot), or light small caliber hits to the vest will just slow you down a bit for a second and your weapon accuracy decreases a bit (incl. unaimed sights), but you can still point the gun forward and fire.
    ----


    That would be the at least what I would like to have in a CQB TacSim, or Game.
    Ok, i went into detail, stuff like the injury system, the sniper rifle thing and the ducked run are maybe to much, forget it then, but the movement and weapon handling (which I think you can make if you allready implemented so many features) are in my opinion a total must, because it is pretty much reality.
    I personally do not accept anything below conceptual wise, atleast I do not take it serious anymore than. Just my point of view of course.
     
  14. Corporal_Lib [BR]

    Corporal_Lib [BR] Brazilian Graphic Designer & Gun Nut {=)

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    Messages:
    524
    Likes Received:
    0
  15. meowcat

    meowcat take a chance

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2001
    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    3
    [EDIT] I uploaded the latest version (115) to file front, I think this is the link (http://files.filefront.com/yarm115_nonumodzip/;4923101;;/fileinfo.html) If it does not work let me know and I will try to figure out how to make it accessible.

    If it does work, try out all three main weapon mutators; yarm weapons, yarm TD weapons, and yarm TFC mode.

    @Psychomorph: I think I can eventually implement a lot of your suggestions, but it will require some time to make it work nicely. I still want the weapons to be usable by non-yarm/td players (like with the stuffswapper mutator) so I will have to rewrite/modify a lot of the base UT2004 code.

    1. Definitely seems reasonable. I have tried a few different implementations of sprinting already (both allowing and not allowing you to fire your weapon) and as long as the tactical walk is still reasonably quick, then I 'should' be able to test this out. I also have tried the 'ducked' sprint. Because of player animation issues, I would probably have to prevent weapon firing while performing the ducked sprint, but again it should be doable. Gonna be sort of tricky for replication...

    2. Free aim is where the code gets all messy. It requires much higher coupling between the player and weapon code. I have to change many, many functions in the weapons to adjust how they get the player's rotation axes (both in the weapon and weaponfires classes).

    I completely agree about the use of sniper rifles as CQB weapons (I would like to prevent it).

    The dropping to tactical walk to fire also seems reasonable. Its kind of funny how much that feature would have bugged me had I not actually gotten the chance to fire while moving in rl (I can't really hit anything while moving at anything over a walk really)

    3. I like most of that, although the speed penalty when hit (seems realistic enough) really may end up turning the game into GE64 in license2kill mode (like you said, 1 shot kills since the target has little hope of making it to cover if the speed penalty is too great). I could always try it and see how it feels. I agree with the accuracy disruption, and that should be fairly easy to implement.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2006
  16. Corporal_Lib [BR]

    Corporal_Lib [BR] Brazilian Graphic Designer & Gun Nut {=)

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    Messages:
    524
    Likes Received:
    0
    Meow, upload the TD vehicles with the heli and the Sp/COOP map too!!!!
     
  17. chuckus

    chuckus Can't stop the bum rush.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2001
    Messages:
    771
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sweet downloading now.

    I forgot that you also worked on C4. I loved that. I still play it sometimes. I usually couple it with old schoolamped and play SP missions with guns that don't all look like fruity rectangles.
     
  18. Psychomorph

    Psychomorph  

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Messages:
    2,267
    Likes Received:
    2
    Yarm is fun, I like to use pistols. The skins are good and pistol models are good too. Climbing is awesome, also when you are kneeled after it.


    Hope you can make it. Even if not, a solid conefire still can do the job. I just think about SWAT3 here, the conefire and accuracy, also during movement was the best in a "conefire" game.
    I have to say, that the TD reticule system is something I always hated in the R6 games, it simulates rather a newb on a gun and not a specialist. R6:4 made it better.

    Unaimed
    You have a white, transparent point crosshair, simulating your ability to guess where the weapon is pointed at.
    - When standing, the conefire is very tight.
    - When walking same.
    - When walking fast it increases, but is still pretty tight and allows good controlled fire on close distances.

    Aimed
    - The aimed sights are pinpoint when standing.
    - Have a slight conefire when walking
    - Have a larger, but still small conefire when walking fast.

    Reflex sights have the weapon model displayed higher and closer to the view, still at the right side. The red dot is a red crosshair instead of the white transparent, but has a glowing effect (see Battlefield 2 Aimpoint dot).
    - The accuracy of reflex sights is the same as with ironsights, but the red dot is bouncing when you move (red dots have no misalignment, but the dot displayes weapon bob aswell, because it always is pointed where the gun barrel shows).

    Pistols are handled unaimed and aimed same as rifles.

    Still, I hope you can make freeaim.


    Exactly, actually real operatives stop and aim when they fire (before they fire), but I'm sure the ability to keep the fast walk and fire is a reasonable option in very close encounters, something real operatives surely perform when it comes to that.

    But fireing when running should not be given, not because it isn't possible, but because real operatives never do this, and as I understand, they don't do it not because they mantain self control, or are taught so, but mainly because it is a natural reflex to drop speed to gain accuracy, it is something you don't really control, but just intentionally do.
    Because players have no real sense for the movement and the actual weapon accuracy in a game, I think they should be the limitation to drop speed automatical when fireing.


    What I mean is, that when you are hit serious, but less fatal, you still can move to cover, ok let's say without a speed drop, but only can't use your weapon. It is like the opposite to what you have in INF.
    It is like the shock state, where you run for cover, but realize later what happened, where your speed minimizes a bit due to the injury.

    Ok, what about two random kinds of this "non fatal" injuries, because it will suck to hit an opponent and see him running away like a chicken:

    3. Injury
    3.1 Fatal
    As said, fatal, lethal and knock out hits bring you down.

    3.2 Serious
    3.2.a -light
    You receive a serious hit, but non lethal, the shock allows you to keep your movement, untill your speed and agility drops after some seconds. For a period of few seconds, after the hit you have no control over the weapon, you'll fire to the ground if pulling the trigger (randomly, sometimes you wont fire).
    After few seconds you gain your weapon accuracy again, but the effectivity is lower.
    3.2.b -serious
    The result is the same as described in 3.2a, but when you get hit, you suffer a stunn-shock, where you are like paralyzed, can't move, your view sways a bit, weapon can't be fired.
    After a secod you can move, but slow, after few seconds your speed increases, but stays slower and weapon accuracy lower.

    3.3 Light
    As allready described, you get a punch and pain, you stop for less than a second (you body recoils sort of), but can move fast again.
    Sights get unaimed, but the weapon is still high and can be fired.


    As said it would be weird to see injured opponents to run away like a chicken, so a randomized effect can make it more interessting and realistic looking.

    Snce they should not be a health meter, the power of higher caliber weapons like cal .308 will express their effect in a higher chance for a more serious injury effect. Where a .223 cartridge can cause a 3.2 type effect, a .308 cartridge has a higher chance to cause a 3.1 effect.

    --------------------------


    Meowcat, I don't know how far you want to go with your stuff, making a "R6" mod, or so, but I can say it is an open gap in the TacGame genre.
    The military genre is filled now, with the upcoming "Ghost Recon: Advanced Warfighter" and the "Insurgency" Mod, but the CQB realism fraction is empty. And I speak about CQB realism, no CS, TacOps stuff.
    Who makes a game like this allready has a community that he/she knows nothing about.
    "Rainbow Six: Raven Shield" caused a split in the R6 community, "Rainbow Six: Lockdown" unified them again, in a negative way, 90% of the community hates it (incl. me, I dislike both).
    "SWAT4" isn't a bad game, but not the ideal as many in the SWAT community expressed.

    I for my part, always waited for a realism mod adaption of R6, it's like I waited my whole life for that.

    Sure designing the SP/coop experence of R6 and SWAT4 is another story, but at least having a solid realism MP thing will find A LOT resonnance in both communities.


    I don't know how far your skills go there, but it would be a great thing if TD (or YARM) goes into the high quality realism direction. You can code it and always hire experienced mappers, skinners and modelers for high quality content.

    Btw, what means "YARM"?.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2006
  19. chuckus

    chuckus Can't stop the bum rush.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2001
    Messages:
    771
    Likes Received:
    0
    What about a moving crosshair and the faster the movement the more it becomes transparent. It could function much like the INF scopes movement.
     
  20. Psychomorph

    Psychomorph  

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Messages:
    2,267
    Likes Received:
    2
    Actually a good idea, I also thought about that the "point" grows a bit, displaying a very (more, as you say) transparent circle, so you don't have an exact point to guess but a small area that just gives you the idea.
    It's like you get a more transparent small circle.

    @the moving crosshair:
    That is what I thought about reflex sights, so I don't know if this moving crosshair effect will give you the impression of a (laser) pointer or so (what it isn't), since it is just an abstract way to fire unaimed.
    The red dot would have the moving crosshair, simulating a true dot.


    Still, freeaim would be a better solution, I think. My desire always was having a smaller, tighter freeaim for shouldered rifles to give you the accuracy that you have in real life in CQB situations, incl. a better (more centered) weapon position for better and more comfortable "guessing". INF has a bad (hipped) weapon position and to much freeaim.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2006

Share This Page