Movement

[AMmayhem]

While making the game have the ability to competitive is important, it is by no means more important than making it accessible for everyone else, from new player to experienced player-but-not-pro. Most players are not going to touch the competitive scene, and many will rarely go online. This isn't really about "noobifying" the game as it is making it fun with a complexity level that most people can recognize and practice without feeling pressured to master it just to last more than ten seconds online.

Basically the competitive scene needs to be considered in development, but it should not be the main focus.

I'll second this.

 

[Crotale]

Actually, 'a-hole' yourself. I'm not registered there at all and never have been.
<-- Check my join date here, 'newbie'

I picked Rough, [possibly the most popular 1v1 map] as an example of how making a small effort to learn the simplest, [shield jump] of the so-called 'advanced' movement totally changed your chances of escaping the 100 pickup tunnel & especially in 1v1 didn't telegraph your escape route to the other player.
The first time I played a higher skilled player I asked him why he wasn't contesting the 100 & then killing me everytime I came back out & he said because I know you can't get out any other way & I'm good enough to sacrifice it to keep the game interesting. He then showed me how to shield jump & use the 3 or 4? other exits & opening up a whole new level of gameplay. Personally I found that extra layer of movement the icing on the cake and set about learning all the tricks you can do, massively increasing my interest in the game.

All true, and I'm not disputing that. Besides, the Shield Jump is roughly essentially Piston Jumping in UT, which was used quite as bit to get to certain high risk pickups. Piston/Shield Jumping is simple enough to learn, but when you have to use a wall dodge jump to get to a pickup on a standard map, that ruins the fun for those players who have not acquired that skill.

but to drag everyone down to the casual players level does the game a disservice, is boring for people who aren't & you will still get annihilated by people who play more than you do. No one wins.

I'm not looking to drag everyone down to noob level of play, just asking for Epic to consider keeping the movement itself fairly simple and streamlined so that it is easy to grasp the basics. Plenty of "casual" players picked up on the fancy jumps, but I am speaking for myself and my personal issues with certain movement styles. I am but one player, but I won't get heard if I don't speak up.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

Here is another video raxxy made that shows the proposed movement with a bit faster run speed. As you can see, it makes the game feel really good.

[webm]http://ut.raxxy.com/e07e817aca_800_max.walk.speed_nick_prototype.webm[/webm]

 

[FuLLBLeeD]

Based on what the developers are posting on the official forums its clear dodge jumping isn't coming back and the movement is going to be closer to U99/UT3.

Now hey just to get stuff like runspeed and air control perfect.

 

[Cadaver]

is it just me or the dodge has a really short distance?

 

[N1ghtmare]

It might be. I think Steve Polge mentioned on the forums that he always thought of the dodge as an evasive maneuver and its use in moving across the map quickly a side effect.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

He said he wants it to be more tactical.Using it for map traversal is bad.

 

[ambershee]

It's not that bad - environmental awareness is a key layer in any successful arena shooter. If you strip down the movement too much and make it too simple, you're basically killing off that layer.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

It's not that bad - environmental awareness is a key layer in any successful arena shooter. If you strip down the movement too much and make it too simple, you're basically killing off that layer.

Well, when the game is scaled such that the only real way to traverse them is with a dodge jump, it messes things up a lot. I'm not opposed to some cool movement stuff, but it needs to be measured. Anything that practically gives you an easy button to run away from a fight is a bad thing for an arena shooter.

 

[-AEnubis-]

You just have to be aware of the ability to chain moves together.

You remember some of those silly bounce pad, or hammer boost dodges in 2k3. They are basically chaining ~4 different "moves" together, and as a result, are able to traverse half the map.

There really is something to be said for the continuity of not being able to propel yourself in a direction from mid air. The second jump just doubled everything.

 

[MakeMeUnreal]

I vote for something like UC 2's movement stuff.
People should decide that they want an Unreal T. or a CoD. (Autoclimbing for example)

 

[Cadaver]

He said he wants it to be more tactical.Using it for map traversal is bad.

I really hope the dodge will have a longer distance than the jump, otherwise bunnytrack is already dead

 

[sneh]

Here are some of my ideas (for wall running specifically). I think it would be great if even some aspects of this were in the new UT, makes moving around feel more natural a flowing

Prototype Movement https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJQSOs3vgXI

Keep in mind this is just a prototype to show some examples, there are a lot of variables that change how it works exactly like speed, gravity, air control, whether double jump or dodge jump exists etc..

Also some people said it looks too easy - it's not, just edited in some decent stuff.. I've set it up so you have to hit the walls at certain angles and at certain speeds, and it's based on momentum too

 

[Al]

Yes, please ^

 

[-AEnubis-]

That wall walk didn't look bad. I would also be okay with as second jump if a wall was involved. Obviously, they should have some limitations, but that didn't look to crazy.

 

[UTNemesis]

Here are some of my ideas (for wall running specifically). I think it would be great if even some aspects of this were in the new UT, makes moving around feel more natural a flowing

Prototype Movement https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJQSOs3vgXI

Keep in mind this is just a prototype to show some examples, there are a lot of variables that change how it works exactly like speed, gravity, air control, whether double jump or dodge jump exists etc..

Also some people said it looks too easy - it's not, just edited in some decent stuff.. I've set it up so you have to hit the walls at certain angles and at certain speeds, and it's based on momentum too

I was ok with it until :31 in the video. I'm concerned that being able to walk up walls like that might start to affect the level design too much. I'd hate to have a bunch of flat walls everywhere to make all those tricks practical. Otherwise, very brief wall running might be neat to have. We'll probably just have to see how it all plays out in actual detailed maps.

Not trying to hate on your work though. No harm done with a little experimentation like this.

 

[-AEnubis-]

As long as gravity is prevalent, and makes that climb relatively slow, they will make them selves easy targets for big boomy weapons, or an easy trace for rapid fire ones.

I could easily see absolutly melting people with link trying to do that straight long climb.

 

[sneh]

No harm done with a little experimentation like this.

Yeah
Some of these ideas might not work at all, others would need to be fine tuned, but I wouldn't mind seeing something added if it works..

There's plenty enough people asking to simply take moves away and nothing else

 

[UTNemesis]

I just downloaded the pre-alpha build yesterday and started trying it out. One thing I noticed is the jump movement. I might be splitting hairs here, but does it seem to be a bit slow or lofty to anyone else?