Group Camp: Your thoughts
- Thread starter DeadEyeNick
- Start date
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![[DiE]x8668k](/data/avatars/s/18/18034.jpg?1424422815){kind=avatar}
Hmmm, am I getting this wrong???
I started to play online with Delta force 1.
And one of most Clans favorite map was Beachhead, you snipers would love that map.
Almost every Clan had 2 snipers and then 3 people that are trying to go to the other Clans spawnpoint, directly or around or whatever way they could working together.
Now I get the feeling, the Clan that can do the best Camping winns, wich I find a little sad.
I thought that games like this is going to be played like:
I go to point A covering it.
You go to point B covering it.
Then I go to point C covering it.
Then you go to point D covering it.
Until we find the enemy and we start shooting at each other.
But in all the Clan Wars I have played most Clans go to point A, then they sit there, waiting, nothing else.
Then I here people talk about making it harder to Rush, hmm, wouldn't that make it even easier for the Campers?
I would like the INF team to make Camping and Rushing equal, if they change something so Rushing is harder, then they should change something to make Camping harder too, all to make it equal.
I know that DiE is a Rusher Clan but we try to take it slow sometimes, we do however search for the enemy, not wait for them.
That more and more Clans go for the Camping strategy can only prove that Camping is easier than Camping now.
And that talk about you have to Camp becouse of the Rushers, no, I dont buy that.
DiE played a nice friendly War against a Clan and they practised Camping and we decided to Rush them and the more we Rushed the more they Camped becouse they didn't have any other choise, at least they said so, DiE won that map with 10 - 0 or something like that.
Then we changed map and we Rushed and they Camped, now they won with like 10 - 0 against DiE.
One of the biggest problems is the maps, either it is to easy to Camp or to easy to Rush or 1 side has to much advantage against the other side.
This is a few things I think the INF Team should do:
Tweak the weapons.
Only make it possible to have one primary gun, not like now where you can use a M16, MP5 and Robar.
Remove the granade launchers, nades should still be there.
Maps that are more equal, that dont give one Clan more advantage than the other, or always give the win to Campers or to Rushers.
Tweak the running.
Remove buggs.
Well, I will try to make a fair map, but I'm not good at it, but I will try.
I started to play online with Delta force 1.
And one of most Clans favorite map was Beachhead, you snipers would love that map.
Almost every Clan had 2 snipers and then 3 people that are trying to go to the other Clans spawnpoint, directly or around or whatever way they could working together.
Now I get the feeling, the Clan that can do the best Camping winns, wich I find a little sad.
I thought that games like this is going to be played like:
I go to point A covering it.
You go to point B covering it.
Then I go to point C covering it.
Then you go to point D covering it.
Until we find the enemy and we start shooting at each other.
But in all the Clan Wars I have played most Clans go to point A, then they sit there, waiting, nothing else.
Then I here people talk about making it harder to Rush, hmm, wouldn't that make it even easier for the Campers?
I would like the INF team to make Camping and Rushing equal, if they change something so Rushing is harder, then they should change something to make Camping harder too, all to make it equal.
I know that DiE is a Rusher Clan but we try to take it slow sometimes, we do however search for the enemy, not wait for them.
That more and more Clans go for the Camping strategy can only prove that Camping is easier than Camping now.
And that talk about you have to Camp becouse of the Rushers, no, I dont buy that.
DiE played a nice friendly War against a Clan and they practised Camping and we decided to Rush them and the more we Rushed the more they Camped becouse they didn't have any other choise, at least they said so, DiE won that map with 10 - 0 or something like that.
Then we changed map and we Rushed and they Camped, now they won with like 10 - 0 against DiE.
One of the biggest problems is the maps, either it is to easy to Camp or to easy to Rush or 1 side has to much advantage against the other side.
This is a few things I think the INF Team should do:
Tweak the weapons.
Only make it possible to have one primary gun, not like now where you can use a M16, MP5 and Robar.
Remove the granade launchers, nades should still be there.
Maps that are more equal, that dont give one Clan more advantage than the other, or always give the win to Campers or to Rushers.
Tweak the running.
Remove buggs.
Well, I will try to make a fair map, but I'm not good at it, but I will try.
I place it more on the map then anything else. A map like siberia is well, a DM map.
Take a map like Kosovo though (even better without the bridges): Open maps seem to have the better balance of tactics.
Too tight and its all rush or all camp.
You have 2 choke points, of course they are gonna camp.
You have winding passageways that allow you to take enemies out one-by-one, rushing will prevail.
Duh.
Thats why the rushing in CubanDawn works best downstairs. Thats also why other team will try to camp it.
Take a map like Kosovo though (even better without the bridges): Open maps seem to have the better balance of tactics.
Too tight and its all rush or all camp.
You have 2 choke points, of course they are gonna camp.
You have winding passageways that allow you to take enemies out one-by-one, rushing will prevail.
Duh.
Thats why the rushing in CubanDawn works best downstairs. Thats also why other team will try to camp it.
What? you agree with me? Must be the first time someone agrees with me. I better go play on horses or something becouse of it. 
Please take a look at military history, the days that the best rusher won started dieing with the invention of the crossbow and had died completely with the invention of the musket.
It's a fact of life that the best "camper" wins, which is why modern day military doctrine states that you should at least have a 3 to 1 advantage in mapower if you want to even have a chance of winning in ofensive combat, 5 to 1 if you want to be sure. (ofcourse this is if the enemy has equal firepower and/or technology).
This also goes for Special Forces teams if they expect confrontation, but seeing as special troops are expensive and take a long time to train they tend to avoid conflict which is why they usually get away with small unit size.
It's a fact of life that the best "camper" wins, which is why modern day military doctrine states that you should at least have a 3 to 1 advantage in mapower if you want to even have a chance of winning in ofensive combat, 5 to 1 if you want to be sure. (ofcourse this is if the enemy has equal firepower and/or technology).
This also goes for Special Forces teams if they expect confrontation, but seeing as special troops are expensive and take a long time to train they tend to avoid conflict which is why they usually get away with small unit size.
Fer, I'd love for you to try your camping strategy against us, the results would be MUCH different.
Pardon me for my absolute terminology - maybe it works sometimes but using that against a halfway organized team will rarely work.
Hell with that kind of logic, I could say that knife only rushing is a valid tactic and works - because my team was successful with it on a pub server.
Hell with that kind of logic, I could say that knife only rushing is a valid tactic and works - because my team was successful with it on a pub server.
You could say it but it is a BS tactic when held up to reality. The only valid tactics for inf should and hopefully (and doubtlessly(sp)) will be real tactics. Of which "group camp" is one.
Maybe, one day, in the far far future real tactics will prevail. But this conversation originated in the present and presently group camping tactics stink and will not be successful.
In INF maps, they are too small to effectively group camp - once you find one person you know where 3-5 are and that makes it easier to kill all of them. Spreading out and covering all choke points is the best camping tactic, not having 3-5 people hang around in the same area all within 20 meters of each other.
Inf will not have real life tactics until you shoot someone online and they actually die at the computer. The ability to play the next round again after being shot gives everyone the courage to attempt things they wouldn't do in real life. That is another reason why this is a game and not a simulator (**** not that debate again!).
In INF maps, they are too small to effectively group camp - once you find one person you know where 3-5 are and that makes it easier to kill all of them. Spreading out and covering all choke points is the best camping tactic, not having 3-5 people hang around in the same area all within 20 meters of each other.
Inf will not have real life tactics until you shoot someone online and they actually die at the computer. The ability to play the next round again after being shot gives everyone the courage to attempt things they wouldn't do in real life. That is another reason why this is a game and not a simulator (**** not that debate again!).
Originally posted by Sidewinder
it cracks me up that a "good" player is someone who runs like a monkey with herpes, sprays an area with 75 rounds to get 2-3 kills. with 75 rounds!!!!!!!!
or other such spam weapons.....
hehe sorry, im just a bitter realism nut
no offense intended...whats really funny is i used to run n gun too !
hyppppooooocriiiiteeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Ever heard of suppressive fire ? It happen to me when I've a mate that I pin down the guy. That means small runs sometimes with firing bursts of P90 while my mate circles him! i don't try to touch him and my % goes heavely down but...I don't care as long as the guy is dead!
[joke] My word is that if you need 2.000 bullets to get the last guy to win the match, why not ?
[/joke]Concerning camping/sniper, I would like to have a backup as a sniper but most of the time I'm left alone...
I used to do that it worked great, we'd run up to the house overlooking the main street in sicily, my tammate would set up his robar at the window and i'd train my shotgun at the door. Anybody who'd open the door would get to chew on some 00-shot coming his way anybody who passed in front would get to chew on a high velocity .50 projectile.
Psst, we use No.4 military buckshot in Infiltration. Not 00 buckshot.
Edit: For comparison......
Buckshot size Diameter Weight in grains No. in one ounce
OOO .36 72.9 6
OO .33 53.8 8
O .32 48.2 9
1 .30 40.0 10
2 .27 29.4 15
3 .25 23.3 18
4 .24 20.5 21
Edit: For comparison......
Buckshot size Diameter Weight in grains No. in one ounce
OOO .36 72.9 6
OO .33 53.8 8
O .32 48.2 9
1 .30 40.0 10
2 .27 29.4 15
3 .25 23.3 18
4 .24 20.5 21
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group camping does depend on the map. What I would suggest though, is play on a server with yurch's mutator... it makes all the difference in the world. I was on AFA 2 for quite a while today, and on the smaller maps, the team would usually break up into 2 or 3 groups and go off on their own... but on some of the larger maps, (like EP) most of the team would stay within 1 or 2 groups, and work together to hold an area. Not necessarily sitting in the same room together, but we had snipers in buildings across the street, and people with assault rifles backing them up. Maybe that's not what you'd define as group camping, but I seemed to think it was, and it usually worked pretty well. It's a tactic that can only work if the team is really working together, not just staying in the same area. Everyone needs to know their role. And you have to use the RA mutator
Though I think the RA mutator is nice but it makes the game a little unfair if one Team decides to Camp and never move when they have positioned themself.
I thought INF was about taking it slow and cover my Team so they can advance, then they cover for me so I can advance, until we find the enemy.
NOT go to one spot and stay there. If both Teams did that, nothing would happen, and the Team that got tired and started to advance first would loose. That is not my idea of a Tactical Team Game.
If that happens in Clan Wars, I may go to one point then go and make dinner or something then come back a little now and then to see if anything have happend.
I thought INF was about taking it slow and cover my Team so they can advance, then they cover for me so I can advance, until we find the enemy.
NOT go to one spot and stay there. If both Teams did that, nothing would happen, and the Team that got tired and started to advance first would loose. That is not my idea of a Tactical Team Game.
If that happens in Clan Wars, I may go to one point then go and make dinner or something then come back a little now and then to see if anything have happend.