Forget about the positive thing you heard about The Netherlands
- Thread starter zeep
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That is why the price index is updated all years representing changes of consumer behavement, but still it is a MODEL!. And note "a theory that tries to picture the realitiy would be as useful as a map in 1:1 measure for navigation" by Joan Robinson (poorly translated by me)
And as such the model doesn't have anything to do with the reality of people actually paying more, which has been proven ... in fact our own government had had to admit that most prices went up after the Euro was introduced.
Perhaps it wasn't as bad in Germany, but here it definitely did matter.
And to top it off they've managed to eliminate the 1 and 2 cent coins which practically allows shopkeepers to raise prices by 2-5 cents on average ...
Perhaps it wasn't as bad in Germany, but here it definitely did matter.
And to top it off they've managed to eliminate the 1 and 2 cent coins which practically allows shopkeepers to raise prices by 2-5 cents on average ...
I can only talk of Germany (because of that country I have some figures), but the prices rised 1.5% from April 2001 to April 2002 and that is NOT much!
Overall there are 750 goods and services in the "basket of goods", in Germany they visit 50.000 shops (super markets, hair dressers, petrol stations ...) every month. So this model IS significant.
And if many prices rised strong in the last years (after the example I posted) it has to do with the higher gas prices but not really with the Euro.
Overall there are 750 goods and services in the "basket of goods", in Germany they visit 50.000 shops (super markets, hair dressers, petrol stations ...) every month. So this model IS significant.
And if many prices rised strong in the last years (after the example I posted) it has to do with the higher gas prices but not really with the Euro.
Let's not forget the source. The guys doing the maths and claiming things are cheaper now are the same ones responsible for all the ****ups in the first place.
That's not really an argument, because many people are working with those figures so it would not be good if they are wrong because if there is an absence of measures against high inflation "there is not inflation you know, because of our nice figures" it would not end good.
And everyone can controll the figures for himself too. Just note the prices of milk (calculate the average of different shops and brands) and than do the same thing again in one year and compare it with the offical figures.
And everyone can controll the figures for himself too. Just note the prices of milk (calculate the average of different shops and brands) and than do the same thing again in one year and compare it with the offical figures.
Coup i say. It's the goods we need on a day to day basis (food etc) that are expensive, if you ask me it's stuff like TV's and car's that the consumer price index used to calculate the inflation rate refers to.
The other day i wanted to buy a bottle of water on the train station, the shopkeeper said 2 euro, i was like WHAT?? You want me to pay fl4.20 for a bottle of water?
This **** is insane.
The other day i wanted to buy a bottle of water on the train station, the shopkeeper said 2 euro, i was like WHAT?? You want me to pay fl4.20 for a bottle of water?
This **** is insane.
Zeep is indeed right. It's things like washing machines, TV's and other more or less luxery items that dropped in price. Food increased like insane, as well as many other things. Not everything is because of the country we live in though, the oil price of course plays a big role (also affects electricity price).
Statistics, you want statistics? 1 in 10 children in Holland grow up in poverty. Atleast 1 in 3 people spends one year in poverty for every 10 years. Thousands live without electricity because they can't afford it, many of which also don't have any gas and sometimes they don't even have WATER (in a country with 16 million people). About 5% is a risk when it comes to debts, these folks can be thrown out of their homes or - like I mentioned earlier - be denied electricity or gas. As far as I know the amount of people struggling to keep their homes and survive as a familly has reached a new low. The amount of people that HAVE to make debts to buy food and pay the rent has hit so high that I can't find a period tracked by our 'CBS' (handling statistics) that is higher. Banks happily give out money and then collect interest. They happily put people out of homes.
Guess what? This situation is STILL better than the situation in Germany. Do some research, or alternatively look around and open your eyes.
Statistics, you want statistics? 1 in 10 children in Holland grow up in poverty. Atleast 1 in 3 people spends one year in poverty for every 10 years. Thousands live without electricity because they can't afford it, many of which also don't have any gas and sometimes they don't even have WATER (in a country with 16 million people). About 5% is a risk when it comes to debts, these folks can be thrown out of their homes or - like I mentioned earlier - be denied electricity or gas. As far as I know the amount of people struggling to keep their homes and survive as a familly has reached a new low. The amount of people that HAVE to make debts to buy food and pay the rent has hit so high that I can't find a period tracked by our 'CBS' (handling statistics) that is higher. Banks happily give out money and then collect interest. They happily put people out of homes.
Guess what? This situation is STILL better than the situation in Germany. Do some research, or alternatively look around and open your eyes.
Yes see how your government has mislead you.Rostam said:
Anyway for me the situation is hard to ignore being a self employed worker, my eyes are open all the time. I wish i could *afford to* stop looking and chill out.
It's true that bread and the like got much more expensive, while other products like pork, lettuce, field garlic (who the hell likes that? 
), coffee, drugs got cheapier. Yet those are still statistics, I know that.
Do your figures have to do with the Euro? I doubt so. So if the situation is bad it has more to do with the politics than with currency of your choice.
I'm not sure if the situation you describe is better than in Germany - I do not have enough information - at leas the situation here (Austria) seems to be better.
), coffee, drugs got cheapier. Yet those are still statistics, I know that.Do your figures have to do with the Euro? I doubt so. So if the situation is bad it has more to do with the politics than with currency of your choice.
I'm not sure if the situation you describe is better than in Germany - I do not have enough information - at leas the situation here (Austria) seems to be better.
Mat, I compared it with the last 5 years plus 10 years ago. Not only is everything being worse right now, it is also getting worse faster. I don't know if it came because of the euro, and I'm not blaming the euro. But those guys and the national bank sure are trying hard to tell everybody that things are cheaper now. Effectively calling 90% of the population crazy when they notice the end of the month is getting more and more difficult.
The amount of people that live in poverty for a long time have doubled in both the Netherlands and Austria when comparing 2001 with 2003. Austria having 1 percentage more than Holland. That is the only comparision between these 2 countries by the CBS.
The amount of people that live in poverty for a long time have doubled in both the Netherlands and Austria when comparing 2001 with 2003. Austria having 1 percentage more than Holland. That is the only comparision between these 2 countries by the CBS.
A bit off topic but funny thing about the Euro in Finland (and for me) is that things "feels" a lot cheaper. The reason is that the old Finnish markka rate compared to Euro goes like €1 = 6 FMK. So, something that costs €10 in the old currency did cost 60 mk.
The threshold to spend €10 is so much lower than to spend 60 mk...
I bought new earphones last week...~€90...which wasn't so much. Don't think I would ever had spent ~540 mk on earphones....
Funny how the mind works...
//K
The threshold to spend €10 is so much lower than to spend 60 mk...
I bought new earphones last week...~€90...which wasn't so much. Don't think I would ever had spent ~540 mk on earphones....
Funny how the mind works...
//K
Again same here, 1€ = 6.56 FF and same feeling, then we could rename the topic to "Forget about positive thing you heard about Europe" ?MP_Lord_Kee said:A bit off topic but funny thing about the Euro in Finland (and for me) is that things "feels" a lot cheaper. The reason is that the old Finnish markka rate compared to Euro goes like €1 = 6 FMK. So, something that costs €10 in the old currency did cost 60 mk.
The threshold to spend €10 is so much lower than to spend 60 mk...
I bought new earphones last week...~€90...which wasn't so much. Don't think I would ever had spent ~540 mk on earphones....
Funny how the mind works...
//K
So best would have been if one Euro=one Franc and one Euro=one DM ...
As long as your dollar does not "crash" we all can be happy, but that is not certain.
As long as your dollar does not "crash" we all can be happy, but that is not certain.
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Do you realize how long people have been saying that for? A hell of a lot longer than you and I have been alive. Do you know how many times that's happened? Once. On a technicality, no less.
Go dollar.
--Harrm
The Euro has been constantly gaining importance during the last few years while the Dollar's weight stagnated. While it's unlikely that the dollar will crash any soon, these developments could mean that the dollar loses its domination of world trade.