RAv286 updates...

[Freon]

im very sure that very few of us here have actually had field experience

in fact that's quite the opposite. the whole point of RA was to make things more real. that's why it was at first used by the AFA clan: a clan of active or retired military men

-Ability to get to higher places by jumping on top of another soldier

TOAD, are you trying to turn Infiltration into Counter Strike? just like the climbing, it will only cause more map exploits.

 

[OpFor]

Keihas, itsn ot that people are playing Ra286, its because it takes away one of the better servers. AFA3 and GD4 ususaly dont work right..so all we are left with is a single 14 player Euro server we're lucky to get 300 ping on. Who wants to play INF when your P90 in full auto fires like its a bolt action?

 

[Dr.J]

freon, if you ask me most the military personnel are either not here or dormant.... i remember when you could talk to people like tiffy regularly.... and i consider myself pretty new. i respect RA and RA286 for what they are, but what i was talking about are the gameplayers that search for what they THINK is real and them proceed to have a cry when someone does something that they dont THINK is real, without questioning their own ideas or considering who the person at the other end is... and whether we like it or not, i guess its just us kids here now... maybe the men will come back after 2.9 comes out.

[edit] i know that AFA and stuff use RA [/edit]

 

[keihaswarrior]

You must have a terrible connection. I get a ping of about 220 on jgkdo. It is perfectly playable and possible to kick lots of ass. Besides, Euros have played on NA servers for months with minimal complaints. I think you should follow their example and play on the Euro servers for a change.

 

[jaymian]

Thanks for the files and the crazy ini stuff. I'll check it out. RA286 seems to have some really cool features from the list. I always hated being a sitting duck while coming up from prone. And not being able to climb through windows was retarded. The tackle is funny, I have to try that out. The only thing I suggest is having the grab key do the healing, and maybe make some sound while doing it so you know its working. Having to make another key I don't think is needed. The only problem with the climb to me is when you go certain places in a map that you weren't supposed to go, the map looses its realism. For example if you exit Sicily, you will see building floating in the air. I have no problem with roof hoppers, or people getting on crates and such. But actually exiting the confines of the map is pretty retarded. It's one of those issues people will never agree on I suppose. As long as people realize the maps original intention, and don't hold the exploits against it.

 

[yurch]

-INF soldier's hitbox is 20 percent 'skinnier'

Interesting. There weren't any problems with bullets going 'through' people? I've been looking for ways to decrease the target surface area that don't cause too many notable errors...

 

[LIGHTFIGHTER]

freon, if you ask me most the military personnel are either not here or dormant.... i remember when you could talk to people like tiffy regularly.... and i consider myself pretty new. i respect RA and RA286 for what they are, but what i was talking about are the gameplayers that search for what they THINK is real and them proceed to have a cry when someone does something that they dont THINK is real, without questioning their own ideas or considering who the person at the other end is... and whether we like it or not, i guess its just us kids here now... maybe the men will come back after 2.9 comes out.

[edit] i know that AFA and stuff use RA [/edit]

Well I check in from time to time...............also I appreciate any efforts to make the game more real and try to help out when I can.......But I have been cussed as some sort of "military snob" by a few, Like I give a sh*t. Anyway I'm just kinda waiting around for the next version

 

[Taque]

I didn't even notice the reduction in hitbox size.

jaymian, we suggest that you double bind firstaid to your infgrab key as such:

set input (X) infgrab | firstaid

There will be messages in the corner of your screen like "First Aid READY" and the wounded soldier will produce a relieved sigh when the first aid has taken effect. Furthermore, I also agree that leaving the confines of the actual map is retarded. Yay, you get to roam aimlessly in a huge field. However, I must defend my beloved ninja roof hopping.

 

[(SDS)benmcl]

Thanks Taque for pointing out that bind. I should have known that. Back to bind school.
Actually I have only seen once people leaving the map area and we hinted that we were going over. Just messing about. In an actual match no.
I would like to request that the mute speechpad be installed on the server. Check Crowze's thread in development. Hopefully I will post a large sample of what it does. If you like binds, you'll love it.
If the target box is 20% smaller than people have gotten 20% better because I still get slaughtered.
Lets celebrate, only 2 tks for me last night. Not even the same person.

 

[Bushwack]

Keihas, its not that people are playing Ra286, its because it takes away one of the better servers. AFA3 and GD4 ususaly dont work right..so all we are left with is a single 14 player Euro server we're lucky to get 300 ping on. Who wants to play INF when your P90 in full auto fires like its a bolt action?

this is the operator of said servers' problem? NO, in point of fact, we did not get the server to make anyone but OURSELVES{the guys who pay for it} happy...if anyone comes there and has a good time, then so be it, if all they do is come to criticise and piss and moan about the mutey thats running on it, then they dont need to be there in the first place.
By all means come and decide for yourself about RA286, thats why we are BETA TESTING it, its never been final as long as it has been on our server, nor is it final yet, FYI there have been almost 20+ updates to the original since its inception when the server was known as PR1.{sometimes 2-3 updates per night even}
Also id like to point out, that i absolutely love Rav2, and RA286, they will both be on the server. We are just testing Ra286 at the moment, so its somewhat dedicated to furthuring Duke and Toads efforts.{in short, ill take it off when its done and totally finished, and run RAV2 again, but they will both be on there, forever, running at my discretion...}

Also, any clans wishing to have a clan match on our server can, as long as they email me ahead of time, with dates and times {EST please}, as long as they dont mind a mod spectating, feel free to use the low pings ya get on ours. I can even change rotations/camos accordingly for you guys given enough notice beforehand.
With the release of 2.9 immenent, we will be updating to 2.9 as well

 

[Keganator]

Time to clear a few things up.

As for Rav2 being a 'quick fix' and for its realism, there are those among the INF community that have actual REAL LIFE military experience, and noone seems to take EXPERTISE in place of OPINION. Opinions of armchair commandoes that get all thier information from TV, movies, books and the like.

There was only one reason why RA was put into making, and that was to suit the AFA, also known as The Armed Forces Association. The AFA, for those of you who have not been around long enough to know of them, are a clan made entirely of current and former military officers. The mutator, RA, was originally made by Yurch for the clan AFA, to make Infiltration more realistic for them. For military officers. When an entire clan of military officers sign off on a mutator as 'more realistic', I will believe that more than the claims of one or two people and their opinions.

{incidentally, a LOT of the complainers and naysayers ive seen post here, have NEVER even bothered to play on MY server for more than a few minutes, so nice to see people using thier highly educated opinions to bolster thier claims of legitimacy in this day and age}

I'm glad you keep claiming that, since it's very obviously directed at me and may of the other naysayers. Unfortunately, it's wrong. I alone have put in three or four hours online with ra286, and quite a few more offline. I can't stand it, and I stand by my opinions. There are pretty things in ra286, but I do not like them. The wallclimb is bogus, needs to be completely redone. The explosions, while pretty, are not realistic to what I understand and have seen from footage of grenades, specifically INF's m67 grenade. If you want the video footage to try to copy it, I woul d be willing to look for it. The recoil, while reduced, has been reduced to a point that many feel is too much reduced...it feels even less than the regular INF's recoil to me, at least.

RA was about making a more realistic Infiltration, backed by an entire clan of people from many different nations' armed forces. Terminator vision? Please. Full auto m16a2? Fun, maybe. But the current version used in the US armed forces (where I must assume this inspiration for Infiltration's particular model must have come from) does not have said feature.

By all means come and decide for yourself about RA286, thats why we are BETA TESTING it, its never been final as long as it has been on our server, nor is it final yet, FYI there have been almost 20+ updates to the original since its inception when the server was known as PR1.{sometimes 2-3 updates per night even}

That's great, bushwack. Unfortunately, every new 'feature' that you seem to add detracts more and more from realism. With the current trend, only the CS l33t h@x0rz will like it in a few more 'betas'. What's next? A quick-action key to put silencers on your FAMAS? And ooh! How about the ability to add and detach your ACOG from your SIG or M16 in game? And please, please bring back the lazers, I think they make the game 100013% better and more realistic, but integrate it into ra286 this time, since we all know lazer weapons are the wave of the future.

Of course, there's the argument that "you don't have to use these new features, so don't complain!". That, unfortunately, is bunk. That's like playing on a server populated by entirely broadband users with only a 28.8 modem, playing CS without a aimbot, or playing on Vietnam without a scope: you're just giving the advantage to the other team. And it is a huge advantage, even more so in the latest ra286. With bandaging, 'zoomsight', and the new buckshot round, it makes competing impossible for those of us who want to stay 'pure', so to speak. It's like not rushing on a Vanilla inf server: you're not playing with the feature set that you were given, and you're not going to have a chance.

We are just testing Ra286 at the moment, so its somewhat dedicated to furthuring Duke and Toads efforts.

Just like it was 'only in testing' when it was still the clan's server? This is an aside from the ra286 debate, but BW, remember that it was not just you who ponyed up for that server. Other clan members contributed too. And regardless of how much you contributed, which we all were very thankful for, it was for everyone. Being a server manager meant that you were the person to deal with the server for us, not dictating to us what was going to happen. Just like SW ponying up for the webspace and time on his hands to make the site, it was for everyone. When you took it over as your own personal fiefdom, that's where things fell apart. We were willing to try out ra286 for a few weeks at most, but most of us wanted RAv2 back, and you fought it, claiming we didn't know what we were talking about. You continue to incorrectly do that now. Don't give people false impressions, it's unbecoming of you.

On a positive side note, I'm glad you still like RAv2. Since there seems to be a large demand for RA servers in the NA time zones, I have a suggestion for you and your server (since it very much is now, and I would like to recognize the distinction between <P^R>1 and what you have now.) Maybe on nights that aren't specifically for new ra286 builds, you could bring back RAv2 for everyone over here craving it? It would certainly boot the server's reputation

As I end this, I would like to say I recognize that there is, and I do see some potential in ra286. I don't want people to get the impression that I totally hate that mutie. Some features I think could be very nifty, if implemented correctly. The climbing feature could be very very useful, if it wasn't a powerleap. The 'focus' feature on the zoom could be useful, if it didn't give everyone a 2.8 times scope...which basically puts it in the realm of the original Infiltration 286's robar at min zoom. I'm glad there are now zoom restrictions...although I must admit I have not had a chance to test it with the latest versions, so I will hold off judgement on that aspect. The grenade blasts, while cool, did not improve on their realism. If you would like, I would be happy to try to find my video again of US army soldiers demonstrating the use of the m67. The criticals could be interesting, if there was a very obvious pattern to why they happened, rather than at random (which is what i was told, I may be mistaken, so please don't take it as gospel ). If the "focus lock" is removed, and the recoil put back up at least some, it would further improve the situation. However, my negativity and trepidation concerning each version is that other, even more unrealistic things will creep in, I feel that ra286 will not ever be able to match the level of realism that RAv2 brought to the table.

I am not here to play infiltration for the features, nor the gametypes. I am here because it strives to be the most realistic game out there. It pushes the boundaries in realism all over the place. Hell, I remember the heated debates over whether or not a HUD Radar was acceptable ingame (bet some of ya didn't even know INF had that, did ya? ). Realism won out there. Same with weapon handling...from iron sights in a day of conefire, to now free movement and sight misalignment in an age of sprite sites, infiltration and the community (with much props to Yurch for his work in continuing that) has strived for the most realism possible. I firmly believe that ra286 is taking this a step back, and is something that duke and everyone else working on it should take a firm look at it, and ask themselves what exactly they are trying to accomplish. A more fun game? Fine...but leave it aside from bringing the most realistic experience you can get. The standpoint of "I think it's real" is hard to define, but I can firmly say after playing this game since it's UT conception, and actively foruming here for more than two years, I think it's real...but it's less real than RAv2. I feel like I'm playing The Third Reich, Infiltration Edition crossed with America's Army, where things kind of seem real, but there's something wrong, something not quite believable or feasible. I'm not outright asking for changes, since it's very obvious you do not care about community input for your mutator (except maybe a very small cadre of loyalists), but I impore you that are making decisions on this: take out the garbage, fix the unrealisms, and focus on bringing us, the community, a game that is "As real as it gets". If you want more players, make it realistic...and they will come

 

[OICW]

One thing that puzzles me is why bleeding is put in when IMO, RA286 is going for a more arcadey feel with reduced recoil, Terminator vision etc.

Keg- would you mind posting the videos of actual grenades? Cheers,

 

[(SDS)benmcl]

They want to try different things. Terminator vision is now gone.

 

[5eleven]

Keg, I love ya brother, but I really hate to see something devolve into a mudslinging argument between you and Bush. Your points about the clan, server contributing, etc., are well taken, although it was more than just a server issue in my opinion.

It ain't about loyalties at all, and maybe it ain't even about realism, to an extent. It's just something different. We all think RaV2 is awesome, this is just something different.

As far as AFA, I agree that many real world military folks have a keen insight on realism. Go out your back door and fire off a few rounds and you get some idea of realism as well. Recoil, although replicated well in any form of Infiltration, doesn't beat your shoulder and is definitely subjective. I find a Benelli shotgun easy to fire and can shoot it all day, while others on my team would rather not shoot it if they don't have to.

Because I'm not a member of AFA doesn't mean I'm a retard with no experience. I have launched my share of frag grenades, as well as CS, CN, and distraction devices. I have fired a few of the Inf weapons IRL, and I don't find anything other than the sight pictures to be accurate. Again, probably cuz it ain't on my shoulder or in my hand. I fire a handgun entirely different than in Infiltration, that doesn't mean that I don't find it realistic. Hell, two nights ago I was an MP5 operator on a SWAT callout..................

On a side note, the M16 in full auto, really only changes it from an A2 to an A1. I own a civilian M16, an AR H-Bar Competition, and have access through work to both A1's and A2's, and fire both frequently.

I will tell you that I don't like having the shotgun in pump only. But I can work it both ways, so what the hell.

The lasers are nothing more than something else different to play with on specific nights, or when others want to play that. Just something different.

In closing, as I have said before, much to your ire, Infiltration, despite "realism" attempts, IS a game. Realism is putting on the gear, sweating your ass off, scared out of your wits and either shooting, or getting shot at. I'm not trying to be a dick or give you ****, it's just (in my opinion) a fact. I play a game to relax and unwind. If I wanted 24 hrs of realism, I'd just stay at work.

BTW, I use the HUD RADAR sometimes offline.

Peace dude.

 

[<P^R>Imperial]

One thing that i dont get is how Bush always uses his contribution of money to the server as his justification for doing what he did. When we first decided to rent the server we made it known up front, that no matter if you didnt even contribute a dime, you still had a say on what happened on the server. Many people including me and about 3/4th of the clan contributed money, with major contributors being Bush and 511 who contributed a large sum, due mainly to them having more money. Note, Bush and 511 did not pay for the cost of the server entirely there was still a good portion left that was paid off by other clan members.

Then SW didnt have time to keep up the server or constantly fix so he passed on the responsiblities to Bush. Bush took this as his mandate that he could do what ever the hell he wanted regardless of what his other clan members who did, and didnt contribute money wanted. He put RA286 on the P^R at the request of his croonie Duke when it wasnt his place to do that. He did it without consulting the clan, and while the clan was willing to give it a try and give Bush the benefit of the doubt he abused his power. When asked about when there would be a vote to keep it on, he said when its done testing. It is now apparent that RA286 is gonna be done testing at about the same time 2.9 comes out. Bush lied and manipulated other members of his clan in order to please Duke. 511 doesnt go around making claims that he could do what ever he wanted with the server even though he donated (note donated, not bought) more money than Bush gave by a good $20-$30 or so. I respect 511, because he stands up for his friend no matter how imorale his actions were and because he respects the opinions of others. Bushwack however has a complete disregard for others continually insulting them if they dont agree with him and refusing to abide by the spirit the clan was formed which was laid down long before he joined.
Now I am not trashing RA286, though like with Keg, it did make me finally move on past inf and take up better and greater games. And I agree completely with keganators reasons for what made RA286 so atrotious and horendous. Before Bush says that i never played it, i did play it on serveral occasions on multiple different releases and i still could not being myself to stand it.

 

[OICW]

There's quite a bit of difference between a M16A1 and M16A2 besides the auto selector. There's only a windage adjustment knob (which is cruder than the M16A2 carrying handle, the M16A2 has an elevation knob as well), the M16A1 has triangular handguards, no spent brass deflector, no finger notches on the pistol grip, a round front sight (M16A2 has a tapered square or trapezoid) , a 1 in 12 twist barrel and other differences I can't remember.

Most of those differences would be model changes, but it's not as if the M16A1 is identical in everyway to the M16A2 apart from auto.

 

[5eleven]

Imperial, I love you too, brother, but I would rather not my name be brought up in regards to donations to the server................that ain't me. I appreciate your comments, but the dough was for the clan.

I don't like to read flaming of any sort, especially about any of my former clanmates, or of Duke or Toad.

To both Keg and Imp, Bush JUST posted that RaV2 AND Ra286 are on and are available on the server, and that if any clans want to play matches with either version because of the ping, to just let him know. It's regrettable that the clan disbanded, but IMO it was much more than the server or 286. It's done, and we all need to let it go.

I'm not gonna speak for Bush, I'm sure he can and will do that on his own.

But I will tell you this: I know Bush personally, and I can tell you that he would do anything for anyone. Yeah, he might be a little rough around the edges, and says exactly what's on his mind (whether it's offensive or not), but in a PC world, that's pretty friggin' refreshing. At least you always know where you stand. Nonetheless, he's a good dude, and one of my best friends. All of the PR guys are my friends, and tearing away at personalities and personal attacks is dumb.

We all played on RaV2 servers before we got our own, and I don't understand why people that like RaV2 don't continue to do that. The fact is, that people just aren't playing much right now, period.

The only thing that I will say about the server, is that Shadow was right, the server would be the clan's undoing. He was partially right.

****In best Rodney King crying voice****
Can't we all just......get along?

Peace brother.

OICW, I'll give you the 1 in 12 twist and the windage adjustment, even though I'm tired and can't concentrate........, but triangular handguards, a notched pistol grip, lack of a spent brass deflector and non-round front sight post, in my opinion, don't affect the efficacy or major functioning of the weapon. 3 round burst v. full auto does. I suppose I could get off my ass and go upstairs and look at them both, but I'm too tired, and too lazy right now.

 

[OICW]

I meant the actual appearence of the weapon model, particularly in 3rd person.

 

[Mappie]

Im jsut curious, but.....My question is, if the server was completely paid by 1 or 2 people, what was my money used for ???

edit, damn it 511, you never on aim anymore

 

[5eleven]

EVERYONE that donated.............the server contract is up this month. Bush and I are going to renew it ourselves. I'm not getting into who paid what, it doesn't matter. Everyone that donated, the server had about a month left when the clan sorta folded.

Anyone that feels that they were slighted, email me, and I will refund the full amount you donated personally.

Map, I've been on, but I was at a firearms instructor class for 2 weeks, and another school about a week before that.

Overtime at work has been through the roof, and I honestly haven't been on much. I'll try to catch you this weekend.

And I gotcha OICW.......I was strictly referring to firing modes. The way I took the comment was that the M16 being full auto was somewhat out there. I was merely pointing out the firing modes not really affecting the weapon and not being so incredibly "out there"..........In addition, I've got an Aimpoint, aka red dot, on my AR, as well as a couple of shotguns, and had one on a handgun and they don't look ANYTHING like the Infiltration model.

Also, just to throw in a little update for those interested........ 2x zoom is back, and night vision is the only add on extra vision mode. Too bad too, because I liked the thermal imaging. (it wasn't quite so easy, because you did have to try to differentiate between friend and foe, because all appeared the same) Also, a laser tripped trip bomb is available (keybind = tripbomb) now. They are immediately armed, and currently everyone carries 5. I expect that to change, because 5 seems to be too many, especially when unexplodeds hang through rounds. They are sticky, and can be placed on walls, or the ground. If I am correct, they have like a 5m trip radius, so BE CAREFUL. Nice to see all the pureInf guys on checking it out. Had a great time, and sorry for all the tk's......me sweepy. As usual, Taque, Toad, NoFate and Duke kicked my ass, but alas, I seemed to be my OWN worst enemy tonight. As well as my teammates.

And a good time was had by all.

Am I even making any sense? Did I contradict myself with the A1 v. A2 comparisons?