UT3 online

[In73gr4L]

Grobut has pretty much nailed the reasons why I think UT3 instant action sucks.

You've pretty much nailed the reasons why you need a life seeing that you much prefer playing offline against bots (as evidenced by your own admission that you play offline much more than online in one of your posts in the thread) rather than interacting with real people. But this isn't relevant to the topic is it? Neither is your crying about offline gameplay, read the thread title. 'The **** does the UI have to do with online play?

As for Grobut, whenever it comes to online gameplay all he ever posts are ad hominems. So it's hypocritical that he would have a jibe at oldkawman's comment.

 

[UndeadRoadkill]

You've pretty much nailed the reasons why you need a life seeing that you much prefer playing offline against bots (as evidenced by your own admission that you play offline much more than online in one of your posts in the thread) rather than interacting with real people. But this isn't relevant to the topic is it? Neither is your crying about offline gameplay, read the thread title. 'The **** does the UI have to do with online play?

As for Grobut, whenever it comes to online gameplay all he ever posts are ad hominems. So it's hypocritical that he would have a jibe at oldkawman's comment.

Haha, you're telling me that playing online games is "having a life?" Ok, whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

I guess you, like oldkawman, have trouble with reading comprehension. Someone else (not I, or even Grobut) brought up instant action as an alternative to "online" play. I pointed out that it sucks here, and people were confused as to what I meant by that. Grobut outlined my reasons before I had a chance to clarify myself. It's really quite simple to follow, if you read the posts. But I guess it's more fun to spout ad hominems than to pay attention, isn't it?

As to the end of your post, what are you talking about? Do you know what "jibe," "hypocritical," or "ad hominem" mean?

 

[In73gr4L]

Haha, you're telling me that playing online games is "having a life?" Ok, whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

I guess you, like oldkawman, have trouble with reading comprehension. Someone else (not I, or even Grobut) brought up instant action as an alternative to "online" play. I pointed out that it sucks here, and people were confused as to what I meant by that. Grobut outlined my reasons before I had a chance to clarify myself. It's really quite simple to follow, if you read the posts. But I guess it's more fun to spout ad hominems than to pay attention, isn't it?

As to the end of your post, what are you talking about? Do you know what "jibe," "hypocritical," or "ad hominem" mean?

1. You're in the same boat. The only difference is that you're at the bottom level because you prefer playing against the computer over interacting with real people.

2. The fact is that this topic is about online play. Offline play has nothing to do with it as it doesn't affect the quality of the online component of the game. Realise this and acknowledge the irrelevance and error of bringing IA into the dicussion, or worse still, sustaining the waah fest regarding IA.

3. If you don't understand simple English just let me know, I'll be happy to enlighten you, there's nothing to be ashamed of. Anyone who doesn't understand what I was getting at needs to reconsider the wisdom of their decision to drop out of high school.

 

[TheIronKnuckle]

1. You're in the same boat. The only difference is that you're at the bottom level because you prefer playing against the computer over interacting with real people.

I freaking hate statements like this. Who are you to judge whether offline play is inferior to online play?

 

[In73gr4L]

I freaking hate statements like this. Who are you to judge whether offline play is inferior to online play?

Your self pity has blinded you. Take the context of what I said into account. He was having a go at me for (allegedly) saying that offline gamers are no lifers whereas online gamers have lives. My response explained to him I'm not asserting this. Rather, I said to him that offline gaming indicates a higher degree of 'no lifeness' than online gaming. There was no comparison between the quality of offline and online gaming as you somehow managed to misread.

 

[TheIronKnuckle]

meh, i really should just stay out of these discussions. Online vs offline flame wars will always be around. I can see the advantages of both but i hate it when people say that one is better then the other and then insult the player base. Sorry for interpretting your post in this way.
Ok, heres my statement so that instead of restating myself in tons of threads i can just link here:
I prefer offline play. offline play includes LAN gaming. I therefore enjoy LAN gaming. Therefore i am not socially retarded for being an offliner. If i'm going to play with humans i am going to play with humans that i know. So in my eyes offline > online. In all other cases bots do me just fine if i want to have fun. nuff said.

 

[Grobut]

You 50% may be surprised just how different online play is and how appealing the game play can be with real live peeps.

Been there, done it, not interested.

I do play games Online, but its certain kinds of games i like Online, whilst others i enjoy much more offline.

Online i'm all about the teamplay, i play games like Red-Orchestra, Ofp-Coop, IL2 and so on, realism games that require alot more teamplay from people, and are very focused on tactics, thease games i love online played with a group of good people, thats where i get my Online kicks.

The Online experiance of UT games, however, is very different from that, even in the teamplay based gamemodes they are not comparable at all.
I can see why alot of people would have fun with this, but its just not me, i'm not a very competitive person and never have been, and i don't really get a kicks out of this kind of gameplay Online, it doesen't get my adrenaline up any more than playing it Offline, so there's not much point playing it Online for me.

I love UT offline though, because its like LEGO, you can at any time go start up a match, and have a few houers of fun in many different ways, you can keep it vanilla, or spice it up with a bunch of mutators, and just plain have some quick fun when you want it, but don't feel motivated to really commit to a long session of serious coop play.
And unlike a normal storry driven SP game, the gameplay is fluid and fresh, you don't know what's going to happen around the next corner in advance.
It is definately a different experiance to playing it Online, but i just happen to like the ways in which it is different, and i find it equally exciting because i find enjoyment in different elements of the gameplay.

In my eyes, both are perfactly valid viewpoints, in your eyes.. apparently not

As for Grobut, whenever it comes to online gameplay all he ever posts are ad hominems. So it's hypocritical that he would have a jibe at oldkawman's comment.

Absolute BS, care to back it up with some body of evidence?

I don't post about Online play because i don't play it Online, nor can i recall having ever ragged on people who do play it Online, i post about IA and how i find that really poorly done in UT3, and how i wish Epic's patches would show us Offliners some love too, and about the game in genereal, that i think Epic dropped the ball here in many ways, and that i am sad and a bit peeved that this once great franchise is now in the state that it is in.


In truth, i am of the opinion, and have stated as much several times, that i view the Online part of UT games as beeing very important to us Offliners, because only when you have a strong Online player base are modders attracted to the game, and make the mods that i also enjoy playing, its a symbiotic relationship, so when the Online game does poorly, the Offline game does too, and UT is allready a niche appeal game, so it needs all the players and revenue it can get, be it from On or Offline players, and thus a bad Offline game also affects the Onliners, Epic wont be putting the same resourced to work on a game that does poorly as they would a game that does well.

So go ahead, show me where i go out of my way to allways post ad-hominem attacks on Online players (who did not attack me first, like oldkawman and you did with BS blanket statements, and do note how i am responding to you two as individuals, and not painting the whole Online playerbase with the same broad brush), i'd love to see it

 

[WHIPperSNAPper]

I freaking hate statements like this. Who are you to judge whether offline play is inferior to online play?

People who play online multiplayer games offline in single-player against AI = wussies.

 

[UndeadRoadkill]

1. You're in the same boat. The only difference is that you're at the bottom level because you prefer playing against the computer over interacting with real people.

Your self pity has blinded you. Take the context of what I said into account. He was having a go at me for (allegedly) saying that offline gamers are no lifers whereas online gamers have lives. My response explained to him I'm not asserting this. Rather, I said to him that offline gaming indicates a higher degree of 'no lifeness' than online gaming. There was no comparison between the quality of offline and online gaming as you somehow managed to misread.

Hmm, you still don't get it. I was laughing at what a ridiculous statement it was to begin with. If you need to go around telling people that don't have lives to make yourself feel better, go ahead. It's sad, but I don't take any offense because you don't know what you're talking about. I haven't said a word about any other games I play, not that I think that has any bearing on "having a life" as you seem to do.

2. The fact is that this topic is about online play. Offline play has nothing to do with it as it doesn't affect the quality of the online component of the game. Realise this and acknowledge the irrelevance and error of bringing IA into the dicussion, or worse still, sustaining the waah fest regarding IA.

Topics shift, conversations flow. If you're too anal retentive to be able to handle that, maybe forums aren't your thing. That really is a poor excuse to go bag on people.

3. If you don't understand simple English just let me know, I'll be happy to enlighten you, there's nothing to be ashamed of. Anyone who doesn't understand what I was getting at needs to reconsider the wisdom of their decision to drop out of high school.

I didn't realize how bad your reading comprehension problems are. I was not asking you the meanings of those words, I was asking if you knew what they meant (and you haven't said that you do). I asked because the wording of your comment did not make sense, as if you were using words you didn't know. Maybe you should stick to smaller words. Actually, "jibe" is small.

Grobut was certainly not agreeing with oldkawman. He wasn't attacking oldkawman's character, he was suggesting his argument lacked objectivity. Even if he was posting ad hominems, grobut wasn't complaining about any personal attacks oldkawman may have made, so I don't see the alleged hypocrisy.

But is it hypocritical for you to complain about ad hominems when that's all you're doing now?

 

[d3tox]

THE CAREBEARS ARE ANGRY! DONT FEED THEM!

 

[TheIronKnuckle]

People who play online multiplayer games offline in single-player against AI = wussies.

I freaking hate statements like this. Who are you to judge whether offline play is inferior to online play? And who the **** are you to insult the offline players just because they are offline players? Online players are obviously all elitist wankers if you guys are anything to go by.

I mean your statement is so ****ing unfounded. I can say "People who play online multiplayer games online in multi-player against real people = retarded rapists" and it would be just as valid as your worthless post.

Get an argument and stop throwing personal insults around.
All of the people suporting offline-play in this thread have done so with long content filled posts and some damn fine arguments. And you have the gall to respond with a one-liner insult? I have my reasons for prefering offline play, they do not make me a "wussie". If online play means playing against pricks like you then i don't see what the fuss is about. I'll play with people who i know and respect at home on my LAN.

 

[d3tox]

I mean your statement is so ****ing unfounded. I can say "People who play online multiplayer games online in multi-player against real people = retarded rapists" and it would be just as valid as your worthless post.

Thats great, except this thread was about online multiplayer.

Seriously, get over yourselves because you play instant action. All cpu opponents whether you play RTS games or FPS games suffer from one problem. They're predictable. After you play vs. them awhile you can find flaws in the AI and exploit them. At that point it isnt fun.

Multiplayer online has a live thinking human being on the other end, and can be very unpredictable. Thats what keeps it fresh.

 

[FuLLBLeeD]

Guys stop arguing about a game that's been dead since launch and shat on by its creator.

 

[In73gr4L]

So go ahead, show me where i go out of my way to allways post ad-hominem attacks on Online players (who did not attack me first, like oldkawman and you did with BS blanket statements, and do note how i am responding to you two as individuals, and not painting the whole Online playerbase with the same broad brush), i'd love to see it

Bolded part: Online players? Re-read what you quoted.

In any case you rarely make posts which don't in some way convey your sad hatred for an inability to play against a non-living opponents in exact way that you want to. And quite often, this means that you end up addressing the person (in this case oldkawman with irrelevant and attacking comments like 'That's an interesting argument oldkawman, yes.. very eye opening indeed..') rather than the topic itself, resulting in posts which are highly irrelevant to the topic.

Hmm, you still don't get it. I was laughing at what a ridiculous statement it was to begin with. If you need to go around telling people that don't have lives to make yourself feel better, go ahead. It's sad, but I don't take any offense because you don't know what you're talking about. I haven't said a word about any other games I play, not that I think that has any bearing on "having a life" as you seem to do.

And I suppose you also believe that the other kids only picked on you because they're jealous?

I didn't realize how bad your reading comprehension problems are. I was not asking you the meanings of those words, I was asking if you knew what they meant (and you haven't said that you do).

Wrong again. The only reason you asked me if I knew what those words meant was because you wanted to provoke a response from me that outlined their definition. That's the classic trick employed by people when words used by others go right over their heads. As for saying whether I know what those words mean, I don't need to. It's clear from my usage that I do. Only a socially inept person with nothing irl going for them would endorse the announcement of awareness of definitions of every word that is used. So it's not suprising that you would inisist that I do so in order to prove that I do understand those words.

Grobut was certainly not agreeing with oldkawman. He wasn't attacking oldkawman's character, he was suggesting his argument lacked objectivity. Even if he was posting ad hominems, grobut wasn't complaining about any personal attacks oldkawman may have made, so I don't see the alleged hypocrisy.

Grobut posts ad hominems in many topics, not just this one, and that is what I was referring to. Learn to read. You continue to validate my original hypothesis that you really don't have a social life. You take everything literally, and you're not aware that social norms quite often don't coincide with rigid definitions. Hypocrisy doesn't have to require that two people have done exactly the same thing. Let me give you an example which your pea sized brain will hopefully be able to comprehend. Person A robs a bank while person B sets fire to a building, both are sent to jail but for different crimes. I wonder what you could call person A if this individual were to call person B a criminal?

Actually, "jibe" is small.

Actually if you took your head from out of your ass you would know that outside your country there are *gasp* other accepted usages of words.

But is it hypocritical for you to complain about ad hominems when that's all you're doing now?

Taking a leaf from out of your book, topics shift, conversations flow.

 

[In73gr4L]

Oh wait I just realised, I'm arguing about a computer game with a socially inept douche that prefers to play against non-living opponents (**** on a social level that's worse than playing against animals). Only someone with nothing going for them in real life would continue this discussion. I reckon you're a dog because you'll do anything I tell you to. So I'm commanding you to continue this discussion and hence demonstrate that you really don't have anything going for you in real life. I won't be replying (so any unoriginal attempt at giving out commands doesn't apply since I've already made my decision) because to do so would be to show a complete lack of a social life, which is exactly what I'm telling you to do by commanding you to make another reply to this discussion.

 

[UndeadRoadkill]

How old are you?

 

[TheIronKnuckle]

Seriously, get over yourselves because you play instant action. All cpu opponents whether you play RTS games or FPS games suffer from one problem. They're predictable. After you play vs. them awhile you can find flaws in the AI and exploit them. At that point it isnt fun.

Speak for yourself.

Multiplayer online has a live thinking human being on the other end, and can be very unpredictable. Thats what keeps it fresh.

Ya, so what? That doesn't make it any more fun then offline.

In instant action i have control over everything: mutators, bots, mods, maps, settings, everything.
In online i have to live with either completely bare, pure servers or servers loaded with so much crap that it's not worth playing because i will exceed my download limit.

I have control over my gaming experience when i am offline. I prefer that to shoddy online play with lag and no control over what happens.

And what the hell is with the insults getting thrown around here based on gaming preference? Would you all stop insulting offline gamers please? It is just as bad as discriminating against gays or black people. You have no good reason to throw the insults around.
I've got no problem with you all arguing about whether online gaming or offline gaming is better, but the insults are just completely unecessary.
Just because someone enjoys playing offline does not make that person socially retarded. Stop implying this. WoW is an online game and I reckon the millions of people that play WoW are more socially retarded then you will ever find in the offline gaming community.

 

[Sys-X]

Still this topic is about online play, make your own thread.

 

[WHIPperSNAPper]

I freaking hate statements like this. Who are you to judge whether offline play is inferior to online play?

I've played against the bots (who tend to make dumb decisions and run in straight lines) and I've played against human players and I can authoritatively say that playing against dumb AI doesn't compare to playing against live human opponents who can be creative and outsmart you and/or surprise you. You also miss the experience of being part of a community and of being able to interact with other players, socially, such as on voice comm.

And who the **** are you to insult the offline players just because they are offline players?

My opinion is worth what you paid for it. I have been playing the game since early 2001 and I've been heavily involved in numerous UT communities, discussion forums, and IRC channels. I've released five UT99 CTF maps and I've even managed a server or two and a clan that actively competed on a major competitive ladder.

Online players are obviously all elitist wankers if you guys are anything to go by.

What's ironic about your statement is that you have no idea just how true it is when applied to some of the communities I've interacted with. (For a good time, visit http://www.ProUnreal.com where you can find new meaning for the term "elitist wankers".)

I mean your statement is so ****ing unfounded. I can say "People who play online multiplayer games online in multi-player against real people = retarded rapists" and it would be just as valid as your worthless post.

I just backed up my post by explaining how playing against live humans is a superior gaming experience to playing against dumb AI.

Why are you so afraid to play the game in online multiplayer? Are you afraid to learn that you suck at it?

All of the people suporting offline-play in this thread have done so with long content filled posts and some damn fine arguments. And you have the gall to respond with a one-liner insult? I have my reasons for prefering offline play, they do not make me a "wussie". If online play means playing against pricks like you then i don't see what the fuss is about. I'll play with people who i know and respect at home on my LAN.

I must have missed the "content filled posts" or browsed over them quickly and dismissed them as being irrational and silly. I'll have to go back and reread the thread when I have time. Assuming that you have a decent Internet connection there's no reason to play the game in single player other than to learn the basic game play.

 

[WHIPperSNAPper]

In instant action i have control over everything: mutators, bots, mods, maps, settings, everything.
In online i have to live with either completely bare, pure servers or servers loaded with so much crap that it's not worth playing because i will exceed my download limit.

I have control over my gaming experience when i am offline. I prefer that to shoddy online play with lag and no control over what happens.

OK, I see part of your point. I agree that the game needs higher player counts (which would support server setting diversity, allowing you to chose servers that have settings you'd want to play). Regardless, I'd definitely rather play online with non-ideal settings than play dumb bots. All things being equal, given a certain game type and conditions, playing it in online multiplayer is better than playing it against bots offline. I think it's implied in people's arguments when you compare the same game in single player to the same game in online multiplayer that the online multiplayer experience is superior.

I noticed that your join date is Feb 2008. Did you play any of the other UT games? Judging the online multiplayer aspect of the game based on UT3 (which, as an overall package, has proven to be a huge failure) is a mistake. Perhaps you'd have had a better appreciation for online multiplayer if you had played back when UT99 and UT 2004 were popular. I recommend getting UT 2004 and playing Onslaught and Invasion Monster Mash RPG online.

Would you all stop insulting offline gamers please? It is just as bad as discriminating against gays or black people.

Gays and blacks don't have any control over being gay or black. However, people who choose to play the game in single player instead of playing it online do have a choice.

This problem is even worse in the Sins of a Solar Empire community where the overwhelming majority of people just play the game in single player mode against a dumb and predictable AI. On the forums they complain that the game needs a campaign. Why do you need a campaign? Just click the "Ironclad Online" button and getcher butt into the real Sins game.