The community killed UT3
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You seem to be under the assumption that the number of people reading this forum (those who like it and can actually run it) will be enough to save the game. This is not true.
The game has been shunned by the millions of Average Joe gamers out there, cutting its potential player base down to a bare minimum. UT3 can only be "saved" in small, niche groups (e.g. something like FragBU) but it will never gain widespread attention.
Just as we did not kill the game we alone cannot save it. Its saving is up to Epic, but they don't seem too interested in doing so.
Unless we can mod it to be more scalable.
What was ut2k4's demo btw? ut2k3? lol
UT's weapons were kinda ridiculous. They needed some nerfing, though 2kx over did it. I really like where they sit now, barring maybe the 180+ dmg chunk ><
What was ut2k4's demo btw? ut2k3? lol
UT's weapons were kinda ridiculous. They needed some nerfing, though 2kx over did it. I really like where they sit now, barring maybe the 180+ dmg chunk ><
You don't mod UT3 to be more scaleable. The proper course of action is to mod UT2004 to be more like UT3. Remove the dodge-jump and make some slightly smaller maps and you're halfway there and on an engine anyone can run. 2ez. 
As for the UT2004 demo, it had more than three maps for two gametypes. Having ONS in there was probably a big factor to its success (considering cheapskates are still playing it). Epic not including Warfare was a huge mistake, especially considering they did it for a really stupid reason. Unfathomably stupid, even, since Warfare is nothing like the epic journey across a virtual world like they'd promised.
Another thing is it included some decent maps whereas UT3 pretty much had the bottom of the barrel stuff for the respective gametypes plus no Warfare and no CTF. Sure, they could have put something crappy like Irondust in UT2004's demo, but instead they chose Rankin, a map that's very good for FFA and fairly good for TDM/1v1. It had staying power and is still popular.
Okay, yeah, we're all tired of Rankin, but think back to four years ago to before everyone was so biased against it. If you can remember, at that time Rankin seemed effing awesome -- people were claiming Hourences was the savior of UT DM.
What did people have to say about the UT3 demo in comparison? Boo, hiss, crappy, broken, stupid, terrible UI, server browser sucks, can't connect to any servers, GameSpy is ghey, no players, no CTF, no Warfare, bad maps, exploits, mouse input is screwed up, INI changes aren't sticking, runs like poop, bad player scale... Uninstalled! And then nothing changed for the retail release! :x
As for the UT2004 demo, it had more than three maps for two gametypes. Having ONS in there was probably a big factor to its success (considering cheapskates are still playing it). Epic not including Warfare was a huge mistake, especially considering they did it for a really stupid reason. Unfathomably stupid, even, since Warfare is nothing like the epic journey across a virtual world like they'd promised.
Another thing is it included some decent maps whereas UT3 pretty much had the bottom of the barrel stuff for the respective gametypes plus no Warfare and no CTF. Sure, they could have put something crappy like Irondust in UT2004's demo, but instead they chose Rankin, a map that's very good for FFA and fairly good for TDM/1v1. It had staying power and is still popular.
Okay, yeah, we're all tired of Rankin, but think back to four years ago to before everyone was so biased against it. If you can remember, at that time Rankin seemed effing awesome -- people were claiming Hourences was the savior of UT DM.
What did people have to say about the UT3 demo in comparison? Boo, hiss, crappy, broken, stupid, terrible UI, server browser sucks, can't connect to any servers, GameSpy is ghey, no players, no CTF, no Warfare, bad maps, exploits, mouse input is screwed up, INI changes aren't sticking, runs like poop, bad player scale... Uninstalled! And then nothing changed for the retail release! :x
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yeah conquest was supposed to load on the fly and affects carried on from previous team losses / wins through each map it was awesome in concept and was one of the features i was looking foreward too ... now that i remember it makes me want to cry that its not there ... OR IS IT! *cues dramatic music* dum dum dummmmmmm
now that i remember it makes me want to cry that its not there ... OR IS IT! *cues dramatic music* dum dum dummmmmmm
Epic ruined UT3, not the community. I'm not going to accept mediocrity at $50 a pop. If Epic really wanted their game to be competitive they would've spent more time and considered a 2008 release.
People were saying this was going to happen. They released a rushed product into a market with heavy competition. It's funny after all their babbling about "we'll release it when it's done" and we end up with UT3 the way it was released. All we can hope for now is a UT3.5 or a UT4, but after the total failure of UT and the success of their console franchise (GoW) I don't think it would be worth it for Epic to spend millions of dollars developing a game that sells a few hundred thousand copies, at best.
People were saying this was going to happen. They released a rushed product into a market with heavy competition. It's funny after all their babbling about "we'll release it when it's done" and we end up with UT3 the way it was released. All we can hope for now is a UT3.5 or a UT4, but after the total failure of UT and the success of their console franchise (GoW) I don't think it would be worth it for Epic to spend millions of dollars developing a game that sells a few hundred thousand copies, at best.
there will be additions to the game as they have made advancements to the engine. While these advancements have been primarily shown for GOW2 they have stated that these changes will make it into UT3 ... I don’t think that epic will really drop the UT title they have said that Unreal and the Unreal Tournament series is in their blood (quote from bonus dvd)
To be honest there are small issues that should be addressed but i don’t think Epic have ruined it ... really all they have done is tried something different the single player campaign is a testament to that.
Its not so much different from previous versions in my opinion and really if anything Epic just make that game its up to us the community to make it great, instead we complain and cry like children who have just had their fav toy taken off them and lets face it and fan of any game will have something to say about the fav title if it doesn’t meet their own standards.
Could it be possible that we ourselves as gamers expected a little too much this time?
This kind of thing doesn’t just happen with games but it can happen with anything i.e. when guns n roses released the spaghetti incident .. i wasn’t happy with it but i still bought it even though it was nothing like user your illusion and after a period of time it grew on me so maybe with alot of us UT3 will as well.
Disregard everything if have just said cause im biased as i love the damn game
To be honest there are small issues that should be addressed but i don’t think Epic have ruined it ... really all they have done is tried something different the single player campaign is a testament to that.
Its not so much different from previous versions in my opinion and really if anything Epic just make that game its up to us the community to make it great, instead we complain and cry like children who have just had their fav toy taken off them and lets face it and fan of any game will have something to say about the fav title if it doesn’t meet their own standards.
Could it be possible that we ourselves as gamers expected a little too much this time?
This kind of thing doesn’t just happen with games but it can happen with anything i.e. when guns n roses released the spaghetti incident .. i wasn’t happy with it but i still bought it even though it was nothing like user your illusion and after a period of time it grew on me so maybe with alot of us UT3 will as well.
Disregard everything if have just said cause im biased as i love the damn game
Exactly! Especially not when that $50 can buy Crysis, Orange Box, Call of Duty 4, Bioshock..etc etc.
Its down to $30 on Steam now. And thats before the game has even been out a year. Sad.
It would make the most sense to mod UT, because EVERYONE can run that, not to mention, you don't have to heavily mod the player scale there, you can use old maps, and rewrite the new ones. I, though, was being sarcastic.
As well, my demo comment was more pointing to how UT2k4 had the unfair advantage of the live beta that was UT2k3. The only thing coming out of UT2k4 that was totally fresh as far as I can remember, was ONS, and seems to have acted as a beta to WAR, and because of it, I think WAR is good. Just like most UT2k4 gametypes that were in UT2k3 are far better, even if they didn't get any play anymore (BR RIP)
Mostly sarcastic I was, yes.
All in all though, UT3.5 will probably be worth the money if it happens, not that I don't like UT3. I do definitely understand everyones gripes though. I just love the lack of this...
As well, my demo comment was more pointing to how UT2k4 had the unfair advantage of the live beta that was UT2k3. The only thing coming out of UT2k4 that was totally fresh as far as I can remember, was ONS, and seems to have acted as a beta to WAR, and because of it, I think WAR is good. Just like most UT2k4 gametypes that were in UT2k3 are far better, even if they didn't get any play anymore (BR RIP)
Mostly sarcastic I was, yes.
All in all though, UT3.5 will probably be worth the money if it happens, not that I don't like UT3. I do definitely understand everyones gripes though. I just love the lack of this...
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I can only speak for the EU ONS community*. They were all looking for UT3's WAR mode. Plans were made for recruiting the best remaining ONS players when UT3 is out.
"Then the WAR came."
And most of the EU ONS community said: "WTF is this?" Only a very, very few of them moved on to WAR, because it is bad in their humble opinion.
UT3 should IMHO have ONS with tweaks compared to 2k4 AND the new Conquest/Warfare gametype with Orbs and objectives.
I am not saying that this is the main reason UT3 didn't do well. It is one reason that adds up with the other ones.
*) A community that at least managed to organize an ONS cup with $2.000 prizemoney in 2007 by themselves.
I think part of the problem may have something to do with the porgression of the titles.
2k3 drove away a lot of the original community, and gradually accrued a new one over the course of 2k3 and 4.
Now, the trend of fanbases to hate any new installment has a lot to do, I think, with the strife that each new UT title has faced, but with UT3 trying to feel more like UT than 2k4, it alienated the community that filled the void after 2k3.
Unfortunately, that didn't leave much of a community left, as it would seem it would only appeal to those who actually stuck around through the whole progression, and with the addition of the expected degree of hate that any new title faces, it seems like a doomed attempt from the start.
The best hope they have now, I think, is to stay consistent. If their next title aims at appealing to 2k4 players again, I think they'll manage to completely destroy any fanbase they might have left, since I suspect most of the 2k4 fans went the way of a lot of the UT fans 5 years ago. I could be wrong, but they'll almost need to build from scratch again it would seem, so they might as well maintain a style that will appeal to the few who do like 3.
Having two different ONS/WAR gametypes might be a good approach, as ONS was a substantial part of 2k4's community, as far as I understand, but I'm not sure how they'd go about differentiating them enough. To anyone other than the hardcore ONS fans, it'd seem like having Capture the Flag and Capture the Tree.
If they could take the AS aspect of WAR, and maybe introduce some XMP-esque aspects (energy management, locked doors...) to a more prominent level they could better differentiate the two. Including the UC style species differences (that were a latent, but still present part of 2k4) they could simulate XMP's class-based gameplay as well. Some classes might be better at building nodes, others could carry multiple deployables. I certainly wouldn't mind the introduction of some of these elements from the UC series... especially the more refined adrenaline system.
2k3 drove away a lot of the original community, and gradually accrued a new one over the course of 2k3 and 4.
Now, the trend of fanbases to hate any new installment has a lot to do, I think, with the strife that each new UT title has faced, but with UT3 trying to feel more like UT than 2k4, it alienated the community that filled the void after 2k3.
Unfortunately, that didn't leave much of a community left, as it would seem it would only appeal to those who actually stuck around through the whole progression, and with the addition of the expected degree of hate that any new title faces, it seems like a doomed attempt from the start.
The best hope they have now, I think, is to stay consistent. If their next title aims at appealing to 2k4 players again, I think they'll manage to completely destroy any fanbase they might have left, since I suspect most of the 2k4 fans went the way of a lot of the UT fans 5 years ago. I could be wrong, but they'll almost need to build from scratch again it would seem, so they might as well maintain a style that will appeal to the few who do like 3.
Having two different ONS/WAR gametypes might be a good approach, as ONS was a substantial part of 2k4's community, as far as I understand, but I'm not sure how they'd go about differentiating them enough. To anyone other than the hardcore ONS fans, it'd seem like having Capture the Flag and Capture the Tree.
If they could take the AS aspect of WAR, and maybe introduce some XMP-esque aspects (energy management, locked doors...) to a more prominent level they could better differentiate the two. Including the UC style species differences (that were a latent, but still present part of 2k4) they could simulate XMP's class-based gameplay as well. Some classes might be better at building nodes, others could carry multiple deployables. I certainly wouldn't mind the introduction of some of these elements from the UC series... especially the more refined adrenaline system.
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