Mechs?

[Bang Yr Head]

But mechs are in loads of games, i would like Epic to come up with truly unique vehicles etc.

true that. maybe some kind of mobile ammo/health depot? but in the form of a huge spider-like tank (legs instead of treads).

 

[gregori]

mech could'nt really hurt the series might even bridge the gap between vehicles and walking on foot, they be better than turrets but not as fast as vehicles therefore more tactical, howbout even some mounted or flyng creatures or some crazy suicide stunt bike faster than all other vehicles kamakaze thingies, basically it wouls suck if all the vehicles are going to be basically realworld warsim thingies, that's unimaginative and boring. it's not called [B]real tournament[/B], it called unreal tournament after all

 

[]SideWinder[]

Mechs, yeah I can see that, but they would be like walking ONS Lazar turrets if you ask me. Thats what I would want, and they would only show up on that new game type, code named "Conquest" or whatever. Seeing as how the maps would be soooo big, its bound to have lots of vehicles. I think in order to balance these Mechs out, they should be vary easy to take down with a tank. By take down I mean, knock over. If a Mech would get shot by a tank round, it should fly back and hit the ground. It should get up faster then a tank can fire though, so you cant just pound one in to the ground with just one tank. But they should have enough armor to take a **** load of tank hits. As far as mobility, it should walk rather slow, maybe slightly slower then a tank. But It should also have jump jets, that can aid in movement. The jump jets would allow you to glide across the ground at a fast pace for a short distance. Then you would have a small amount of tricks you can do with it, like Jump Jet boosted jumps, helping them get up and over things and help them travel faster.

 

[gregori]

exactly, camping in a static turret isn't all that fun.

 

[]SideWinder[]

yeah I totaly agree. I never really jumped in a turret for all that long, I'ed much rather drive around, and run people over.

 

[The_Head]

But It should also have jump jets, that can aid in movement. The jump jets would allow you to glide across the ground at a fast pace for a short distance. Then you would have a small amount of tricks you can do with it, like Jump Jet boosted jumps, helping them get up and over things and help them travel faster.

This could be neet. Just so you can jump forwards every now and then, bit like doing a dodge jump on foot.
Not sure about the idea of tricks in one though :s thats what a shiled gun is for

 

[gregori]

yeah but it would own in a mech, robot thingy, turrets are a bit boring, also the scale a mech could do trick jumps on and that of a sheild gun are way different, people are smaller than mechs!

 

[Dark Pulse]

a mule with dual lasers on top

Ridable Nali Warcows!

 

[The_Head]

Ridable Nali Warcows!

^^ YEH!

Bring back the Nali Warcow!

 

[gregori]

yeah it least that would be UNREAL, not realwarfare sim 101, it's a sci fi fantasy universe for godsake, anybody see the flying beasts in the U engine 3.0 video, something like that would own

 

[carmatic]

if they can bring the programming to be as advanced as to model legs as accurately as a vehicles suspension, then i'd really really really be impressed... after all, if a vehicle can walk, it has an advantage in terms of the variety of terrain that it can cover, but it wont be as fast as wheels or treads... so, theyre really better off as semi-mobile turrets, with walking speeds of somewhere near that of a paladin (a player can run as fast as a paladin) , and their size or extra legs should help them navigate terrain thats impossible for people on foot , and they can pick advantageous camper-like positions to defend places that otherwise will be defended by turrets etc...

 

[gregori]

thats true except a mech would have a larger gait than a human because of it leg size so it would be a tiny bit faster, the programming for such things is alot simpler than you think, it's just a extention of inverse kinematic skeletal animations ,the physics are well possible in UE3, in fact such adjustments of a characters body to his terrain have been done before mainly on humans. most of is just about how animations look, the physics are not too complex.

 

[carmatic]

eh, in inverse kinematics its simply a fixed position of a point that the computer has to figure out how to reach... plus, i do read somewhere before thats its also quite cpu expensive but maybe thats back in the days of pentium 2's and stuff... the main problem is, like, if youve played half life 2, you can see alyx's legs snap all over uneven surfaces... the same goes for the striders, in fact the striders legs can change length to fit the terrain theyre stepping on , its very subtle but if you purposely spawn a strider next to a cliff you'll see what i mean...

its not just asking the computer 'what positions should these different joined pieces be in so that they join these 2 points' , it has to take account on how they will move so that they do not collide with anything, and that they will end up in the final position, etc etc etc... its abit like the comparison between collision detection and ragdoll physics...

in terms of timeframe and experience:
collision detection = VRML back in the pentium mmx days
ragdoll physics = unreal tournament 2003

in terms of how i think it works:
simple inverse kinematics = static and you simply define a very specific situation for the computer to work out the solution for, and time does not flow
modelling legs = dynamic, you may not reach the solution so you have to find ways of getting to the solution (like figuring out where to put the robot's foot without making it topple over), and for every timeframe that the computer is calculating , it has to take account of the speed , acceleration, etc etc of the moving parts, in addition to their position, as time flows

 

[gregori]

it uneccisary to use the real physics of legs, the human characters in ut don't it just an animation, you just have to fake them and make the animations of the legs look okay. if you went on that complex way of calculation it be impossble to do vehicles in ut, there just a simplified version of vehicle physics but they appear correct,the robot would never be designed to topple over from it's own walking that would be stupid however you can mainpulate physics software to allow people to topple it over by shooting it/crashing into it. yeah inverse kinematics, you tell the leg where to move and computer figures out how the bones should respond/extend that can be done with time flowing, dynamically, look at the physics demonstration on the UE3 video, where stress is put on a corpses bones and the joints tear dynamically as they reach their breaking point, it's all possible, it's not about whether it really works like a mech there no real world mech to compare them by, it's all about how it looks

 

[carmatic]

well possibly the demonstration of that ripping corpse shows that complicated physics are possible... but if the physics is purely based on how it looks, then your probably gonna run into problems involving the looks sooner or later... like, lets say that the feet are only modelled via inverse kinematics on each solid step, then in between steps they will clip through anything , in the worst case scenario...

 

[gregori]

make the physics simple make them work don't brealk the gameplay this way, the visuals of it can be messed around with later on you can use various hacks and tricks to get that looking but once the principle works.....

 

[Bullet10k]

How about mechs ABOUT HALF THE SIZE OR LESS of the regular mechs such as the matrix one and the one in mechwarrior. I think Mechs are a good idea AS LONG AS THEY ARE BALANCED...just like how the levi is. Make them about as high as a node or summin maybe.

Dont forget this word: BALANCE!

 

[gregori]

too much balance can suck, doing the mech like the matrix ones would be cool, though they might have to be enclosed, mechs are slower than vehicles, you would be very prone to sniping__ even include the thingy where they twirl the gun.once they don't give them some combination of a minigun, rocket launcher or plasma deally like they did with every single vehicle in 2k4, jesus think up some new UNREAL weapons, crazy ****, a black hole cannon, or wepons thyat cause localised earthquakes, a tractor beam for f#cking up vehicles and troops, flametrower?, laserbeam that turns thing chars.some cool sh't!

 

[shadow_dragon]

There is no such thing as too much balance!

I think I like SIdeWinders idea, that they're basically Mobile turrets like the ones from UT, and give them a melee mode aswell for beating on enemy vehicles/tanks mostly. Maybe give them a radius of the node they were originally based at so they can't travel too far. (THough i'd still like to dropship them in.

Also loving the ridable Nali Warcow. Kinda. It'd be good to see Creature/Monster vehicles. From what i've seen there are kind of team specific Vehicles in the next UT. (Though that is personal speculation) I'd like to see some flappy winged dragon/monsters with guys on top going toe to toe with Raptors and Cicadas. Greta big Spikey Rhino things with gun placements on top beating on hellbenders. Or.... Oliphaunts? heh heh!

 

[gregori]

of course theirs too much balance it grinds a game to halt much like WW1 stuck in the trenches and the likes, it takes out any fun or unpredicatability, makes a game too slow,
in ut99 the weapons are balanced in a fun way in that no wepons is useless everyone has a range of specific uses unlike in ut2kx where your completely screwed with an assaultrife
biorifle and so on.