And yes, if Pelosi was in on it, she goes right up there with the rest of them. There is a reason those sorts of activities do not happen on US soil, and there is a reason they were kept hidden from the American public as long as possible: Because they are wrong.
Then prosecute anyone and everyone involved and quit making it out that only members of a certain political party are guilty of this crap.
See:
KaiserWarrior said:A) Lol.
I mean seriously, you're not even trying.
Crotale said:One thing some of you forget is that these guys are not some simpleton civilians plucked off the street in random fashion. They are known terrorists and criminals. Do they deserve human treatment? Yes. But if you can squeeze some information out of them by going a little further than holding their hands, so be it. For a lot of reasons, the US is damned if it does and damned if it doesn't. For that alone, why not go ahead and waterboard? Oh, but you will argue that little if any information can be obtained through these techniques. You would be missing the big picture if you think these techniques are fruitless. You see, in the intelligence world, you use multiple sources to verify. And these dudes when p-whipped are good sources for verification. What, did you think we were going to use them as sole sources of info? What a frackin' joke.
The only reason we need to be careful how we handle these folks is so that our enemies cannot use this against us. We don't need to act more civilized, for where has THAT gotten us? Did our enemies give a **** during Clinton's "feel good" terms in office? Yeah, sure, 'tis why they bombed the WTC the first time and planned the eventual destruction of the towers.
It's good to know that in 2009, people are still justifying inhumane acts of cruelty by saying that the ends justify the means. It's great to know that society hasn't progressed since the mother****ing dark ages because you think it's alright to commit grievous crimes against people as long as the government that you don't even trust in the first place tells you it's A-OK and will "stop teh terrorists".
You people are monstrous. You are willing to throw away the very things that are supposed to separate you from the people you are waging war on at the drop of a hat. You are willing to sacrifice every shred of your humanity as long as some man in a suit who gets paid to lie to you tells you that it was for a good cause.
I mean hey, if torturing people to save lives is okay, why stop there? Why don't we just carpet-bomb every 'terrorist' nation with nukes, just to be sure? I bet it'll save American Lives™. Hey, we can even extend this! If torturing people stops terror plots and saves lives, imagine what it can do for armed robbery? What's the moral difference? I mean, if "saving American Lives™" is our measure for whether secret prison camps and blatant violations of human rights are justified, there's a whole hell of a lot of American Lives™ to be saved by torturing all kinds of suspects for crimes right here on good ol' USA soil.
What's the difference between a suspected serial killer and a terrorist? Why is it 'legal' to torture one and not the other? Are you going to say that something as asinine as what country he's from makes the difference on whether or not you can completely ignore the law regarding your treatment of him?
"Oh, but we do it to our own soldiers, so it's okay!" If you believe that's equivalent, you are retarded. If a random crazy hobo off the street tells you your mother is dead, you're not going to give a ****. If your brother tells you your mother is dead, it suddenly means something entirely different. If your own people 'torture' you in what you know for a fact to be a training exercise where no actual harm is going to come to you, it is a completely different story from a group of hostile people from another country that want to kill you doing it.
But that's okay, because none of it matters. Americans have no problem re-creating the leadup to Nazi Germany, because you're all stupid jingoists with little if any knowledge of history, and certainly no appreciation for the significance of throwing away your humanity to fight an invisible enemy you will never defeat.