Major UT3 Update Details

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Phopojijo

A Loose Screw
Nov 13, 2005
1,458
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Canada
Surely they can't tell you "you need 1 456 654 554 bytes for this installation on C, and the same amount on D", but it should give you *approximate* values. Now they give nothing at all. And no, not all programs write something to C, for example, look at any earlier UTs. All they need to run is a RegFix, which adds, say, 20 bytes of space, that's all. And UT99 (or at least U1) doesn't even need that.

Plus, I'm trying to reinstall UT3 demo and I can't. It says "not enough space" even though I have tons on another drive. Why? Because of Ageia? Why does it install in C, although I explicitly set it to install on D? And people report that Ageia is only needed for the Ageia maps, which are few, so why all this hassle anyway? And I'm not the only person to deal with these kind of problems:
http://www.gamehourz.com/UT3-Install-Problem-ftopict205537.html
Looks like I'll have to either go over to Windows 7 and install from there, or, as you said, "rethink your partitioning structure", which means wasted space that lies in system partitions without any use.
Yeah that's all totally wrong.

1) PhysX is the major Physics Engine of Unreal Tournament 3. Every map uses it. However -- the PhysX maps were the only ones to use it enough that it makes running it on the CPU pretty difficult. All the other maps keep the number of simultaneous collisions and stuff low enough that the CPU can kinda grind away at it and still accomplish the task.

2) Many programs write to C for APIs and such. That way -- you don't have 150 copies of DirectX (for instance, there are hundreds of others... PhysX is another example) in each application folder all at different versions.
 
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alex904

New Member
Feb 24, 2006
39
0
0
Good job Epic, but it's impossible to make a perfect game out of the dead horse. Please, move on and make UT2k9 instead. :p
 

JaFO

bugs are features too ...
Nov 5, 2000
8,408
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well ive been playing UT3 since it released, but youre right on this...

seriously, as happy as i'll be for all the fixes and content - if they don't repackage and resell the retail version to generate new players, theres really almost no point to any of this.
There is a point :
it proves that despite all the whining by the wannabe-fans out there they really do love UT3 and consider the pc their 'bread & butter' ...

OTOH a real pessimist would say that the only reason for patching UT3 is that it acts as test-bed (sp?) for the UE3-fixes. As the community is dead there'll be no problems if anything doesn't work as expected ...




... We really need a voice selection menu in the character select screen at minimum, but Voice Pack support being totally missing is real sad. So hopefully the Titan pack will help Character Models get made and used again with some support there.

I'm a bit boggled how a complete Speech Binder is not in the patch though it said the patch list is not complete ... so that gives us hope :)
I'm not sure it'll be fixed.
I mean ... yes, they are planning to fix the 'GUI', which is one thing that wasn't expected (this late in the project).
The voice-support appears to have been a design-decision that no one (important) considered (as) bad for the game as the GUI apparently was.

but hey ... we can and should hope for better news on this aspect of the game.
I kind of wish that the size of the 'titan-update' could be because they decided to add (better) voices. However part of me wonders how they'd pay for all of that ...
 

JohnDoe641

Killer Fools Pro
Staff member
Nov 8, 2000
5,330
51
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N.J.
www.zombo.com
well ive been playing UT3 since it released, but youre right on this...

seriously, as happy as i'll be for all the fixes and content - if they don't repackage and resell the retail version to generate new players, theres really almost no point to any of this.
Well, it will get back some of the players that left, I'll certainly play it more, and I think FragBU would benefit from more players as well. They'll probably release an updated demo and surely that will entice a lot of new players who weren't around during the pre-megapatch days. Now people can show their friends the game and they won't be worried that they'll hate it. :D

Besides, it'll give me more targets to destroy. :)
 

oldkawman

Master of Your Disaster
Eww. That's why they didn't release the Linux installer. Logical - there's no such thing as "my documents" in Linux, instead it's called /home/user/documents, and all programs go not into some Program Files, but into /home/user/.appname... Splitting into two would give absolutely nothing good... Windows FTL :tdown:
...

I think the Linux installer will come with the expansion, ditto for the MAC version.

Linux install for UT2K4 was sweet. I still have it on my other machine. This is how I did it and why.

As root I mounted a seperate ata drive as /usr/local/games/ and then installed UT2K4 to /usr/local/games/UT2004/

Later, I copied the UT2004 directory over to a larger and larger drives and then to the current 300 Gb SATA drive. That allows for lots of disc space for maps and stuff. This is good as I do have over 700 custom maps.

For those who know about Linux, this also means I can do a fresh install of an updated Linux version without having to reinstall any of the custom content or patches. Before mounting the UT20004 drive, just reinstall UT2K4 from the DVD so the paths are OK. Then mount the drive and your good to go. Linux file system is very nice to deal with. I cannot even contemplate reinstalling >700 custom maps from like >650 zip files, OMFG, No Fracking way. I guess with windoze, your kinda stuck.
 

shoptroll

Active Member
Jan 21, 2004
2,226
2
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They'll probably release an updated demo and surely that will entice a lot of new players who weren't around during the pre-megapatch days.

I think that's pretty much a necessity at this point. The current demo has performance issues, and the game has drastically changed since that build. People aren't going to want to sink $20 on a game that is the gaming equivalent of Vista without a chance to test drive the real thing first. Hopefully they'll allow demo servers to handle retail connections as well.

OMFG, No Fracking way. I guess with windoze, your kinda stuck.

There was a really sweet map installer program that would parse zip files and put UT2004 content in the appropriate folders (although I think it was slightly buggy in certain situations). I think JaFo's bot manager would handle the custom character installs perfectly fine.
 
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UnrealGrrl

Enemy flag carrier is Her!
Jun 16, 2000
1,696
6
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www.unrealgrrl.com
1. There is a point :
it proves that despite all the whining by the wannabe-fans out there they really do love UT3 and consider the pc their 'bread & butter' ...

OTOH a real pessimist would say that the only reason for patching UT3 is that it acts as test-bed (sp?) for the UE3-fixes. As the community is dead there'll be no problems if anything doesn't work as expected ...

2. I'm not sure it'll be fixed.
I mean ... yes, they are planning to fix the 'GUI', which is one thing that wasn't expected (this late in the project).
The voice-support appears to have been a design-decision that no one (important) considered (as) bad for the game as the GUI apparently was.

3. but hey ... we can and should hope for better news on this aspect of the game.
I kind of wish that the size of the 'titan-update' could be because they decided to add (better) voices. However part of me wonders how they'd pay for all of that ...

1. what you said was kinda my point. but i think the "proving" of anything is a waste... they dont need to prove anything cause the players they lost are lost. game over. anyone saying 'well maybe this will bring me back now' is not gonna really change the current state of UT online. but if they do something new and they release a finished polished gem here thats available as a "Titan Edition" then maybe we'll see more new players... the whiners and ppl who jumped ship are gone.

2. well Voice support was broken when UT2003 was released too but it did get fixed in 2k4 by the ECE edition so I still hope they decide its important. I mean if you look at half a million downloads i generated with just my voicepacks and the hundreds of sound mods that existed for UT and 2k4, that should give some reason to include it again. especially for a game thats supposed to be mod friendly.
Itd also really help with Character models being popular again. I mean. there were hundreds of models released every year for previous versions of UT ... with UT3 there would be about 8 if not for the MSUC and even with that there are only 30 UT3 models listed on skincity. THATS PATHETIC considering again that UT3 is supposed to be mod friendly and what UT and 2k4 had with Models and voicepacks.

3. i'm hoping that because the list is not yet complete that we get some help with voice support or any of the sound issues... i saw they did a fix for the vehicle sounds so thats something! maybe there will be more goodness to come, like... (we'd love to see)

* Complete Speech Binder
* Voice Menu in the Character Selection Menu (to pick which voice you want to use)
* Custom Character Support for Online play (ability to push custom models to players)
* Fix Male / Female player model sound cues (hit, pain, jump etc.) to play properly
* Full Voice Pack Support

Well, it will get back some of the players that left, I'll certainly play it more, and I think FragBU would benefit from more players as well. They'll probably release an updated demo and surely that will entice a lot of new players who weren't around during the pre-megapatch days. Now people can show their friends the game and they won't be worried that they'll hate it. :D

Besides, it'll give me more targets to destroy. :)

well you may not play as much as you used to but at least you never left completely like other llamas... i still would catch you playing online, takin names and kikin butts ;)

of course we will all benefit from this mega patch and the Titan release. all i'm saying is if they don't get the message out to the masses that theres a new UT3 in town, that a few BU players and others in the community coming back to play and bringin a friend or 3 won't mean a helluva alot to the online numbers unless there is mega hype and some advertising too.

we need Epic and or Midway to make a media push with this baby to have it be anything more than a footnote on UT3...
 
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Apr 11, 2006
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Yeah, that's quite interesting. Wonder how this will be explained away.

If you notice, they also had a line which indicates they are changing how all weapon pickups work to be based on the weapon locker model. In other words, you can throw your weapon now in all gametypes, but the weapon pickup itself will be disabled for you for a period of time [unspecified whether "weapon stay" affects this or not?] which means you won't be able to get infinite ammunition by camping a single weapon spawn and tossing the weapon (or, rather, that you can get infinite ammunition by doing this, but you will need to wait ~30 seconds in order to regain the weapon again).

What isn't made clear is how this will interact with people's perceived notions on "Map Control" and/or "Weapon Stay."

For example, if this Weapon Locker-like behavior is the default behavior, then competitive 1v1 and TDM players will no longer be able to deny their opponents weapons by taking those weapons.

On the other hand, if the behavior we're hearing about is what happens only when "Weapon Stay" is on, then ... Well, it's an improvement over the default UT3 behavior, and probably the best compromise. But it's still not providing the functionality that the vast majority of "weapon stay on" players have come to learn, play with, and expect.

My hope is that we'll see two options here (e.g. bNewWeaponPickupBehavior and bWeaponStay) instead of one single option that tries to force people to play in a certain way [again].
 

GreatEmerald

Khnumhotep
Jan 20, 2008
4,042
1
0
Lithuania
Yeah that's all totally wrong.

1) PhysX is the major Physics Engine of Unreal Tournament 3. Every map uses it. However -- the PhysX maps were the only ones to use it enough that it makes running it on the CPU pretty difficult. All the other maps keep the number of simultaneous collisions and stuff low enough that the CPU can kinda grind away at it and still accomplish the task.

2) Many programs write to C for APIs and such. That way -- you don't have 150 copies of DirectX (for instance, there are hundreds of others... PhysX is another example) in each application folder all at different versions.
Tell this to guys over here:
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/page-98856_25_0.html

I think the Linux installer will come with the expansion, ditto for the MAC version.

Linux install for UT2K4 was sweet. I still have it on my other machine. This is how I did it and why.

As root I mounted a seperate ata drive as /usr/local/games/ and then installed UT2K4 to /usr/local/games/UT2004/

Later, I copied the UT2004 directory over to a larger and larger drives and then to the current 300 Gb SATA drive. That allows for lots of disc space for maps and stuff. This is good as I do have over 700 custom maps.

For those who know about Linux, this also means I can do a fresh install of an updated Linux version without having to reinstall any of the custom content or patches. Before mounting the UT20004 drive, just reinstall UT2K4 from the DVD so the paths are OK. Then mount the drive and your good to go. Linux file system is very nice to deal with. I cannot even contemplate reinstalling >700 custom maps from like >650 zip files, OMFG, No Fracking way. I guess with windoze, your kinda stuck.
Yea, I have a feeling that they should work on more clients too, including a x64 client.. I never tried the UT2004 Linux installer as I have the Anthology, so I had to use really nasty ways to get it installed (basically extract files from DVD and simulate that I had an installer... Quite a lot of problems that way).

And yeap, having a partition just for the system is a good way to go. Reformatting is always healthy, and when all you want is to reinstall your system, this set up is very good, as you don't lose your own files nor preferences. You're right, if you wouldn't have moved the files onto a separate partition, you had to lose a lot of time trying to restore UT2004. That's basically why I'm saying that the way of separating games from your home isn't good - if they all were installed into My Documents on Windows, then it would be very nice :)

Though with Windows, you're not that stuck. You just have to zip all files (or RAR, or even 7zip), move them to another partition, reinstall Windows, unzip/unRAR/un7zip the archive to your new system, use a Reg Fix and you're good to go.
Though in Linux you don't even need to reinstall the game (I know because I can't without reextracting files, remember ;) ), all you need to do is create a file in your /home/user/.loki directory tat defines paths to your game and a cdkey file that, well, tells the game your CD key.

By the way, it's interesting to see how Windows and Linux can co-operate in solving problems. Just like with my UT3 demo install problem I mentioned, I tried installing it from WinXP, no luck, Windows 7, no luck, and only openSUSE with Wine saved me :) And I was right, UT3 really doesn't require a single byte written to C:, you can as well put all the demo files on a DVD (if they fit) or some USB key, and it will run perfectly off the disk. It automatically creates "My Games" folder for you.
 
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SkaarjMaster

enemy of time
Sep 1, 2000
4,870
8
38
Sarasota, FL
hehe, the Danish Bastard makes an appearance at BUF. I wonder what brought that on?;)

Anyway, 2 options for the weapons locker thing would work for me also. I guess we have to take the good with the bad; I'd prefer just to add weapons throw and leave it at that though.
 

BooGiTyBoY

The ImPaCt-DaMpeNeD BooGeRaToR
So the game was released last year and they are finally getting round to adding/fixing things that should have been in the game in the first place and they expect us to be happy and "YAY EPIC" about it.

Specially when half the list is menu/interface related which has no bearing on the crappy gameplay at all.

ugh.
 

FuLLBLeeD

fart
Jan 23, 2008
946
1
18
Kansas
awwsmack.org
So the game was released last year and they are finally getting round to adding/fixing things that should have been in the game in the first place and they expect us to be happy and "YAY EPIC" about it.

Specially when half the list is menu/interface related which has no bearing on the crappy gameplay at all.

ugh.

Let me guess, you thought UT2004 was the best in the series. D:
 
Mar 20, 2002
578
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Chica Go
Visit site
Yeah, that's quite interesting. Wonder how this will be explained away.

  • Weapon pickups now disappear for the player who picked it up, until it can be picked up again (now works like weapon lockers).
This seems to counter "weapon throw" from being any kind of exploit. Simple, but pretty ingenious.
 
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