Is the retail editor in the works at last?
- Thread starter Wanderer
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With UT done, I wonder if Epic's now finally going to start working on the retail editor. Sure hope so. And I sure hope the retail editor will not end up a false promise. I still remember, after playing the 3DRealms title Shadow Warrior (dated engine but I still love it), I got so excited about the coming add-on Wanton Destruction -- only to have my heart broken later when the folks making the add-on said they decided to shelf it.> /~unreal/ubb/html/frown.gif If the same happens for the retail editor, I'm going to hate Epic.
Also wonder what games the editor will be able to edit (if the editor does come out, that is). Not just the original Unreal, I hope!
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Creme du Cammy. For soft, tender skin.
Also wonder what games the editor will be able to edit (if the editor does come out, that is). Not just the original Unreal, I hope!
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Creme du Cammy. For soft, tender skin.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><HR>Yep, I'm pretty sure that the retail editor has been shelfed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
F*** it.
F*** it.
On the bright side, when 3d Realms will release DukeED with Duke Nukem Forever when it comes out. It should be more stable the the current UnrealED and will definitely have waaaaaaay more options.
If the above offended you, you shouldn't have read it.
If the above offended you, you shouldn't have read it.
The retail version of the editor is something I have been following for more than a year now.
If you remember the original Unreal had a picture of a retail editor mock-up box in the catalog. Then it was decided that the effort to do a commercial editor was not worth the return finacially, as it would have a narrow market. That and the beta worked well enough, so why bother.
Well, many time I have started threads about why a commercial editor was a necessary and good thing. Many people want it to remain free, but there will ALWAYS be a free UnrealED so that arguement doesn't wash. They need some free editing support to foster a user community.
As for UnrealED now, it is going to get a C++ rewrite but I expect that to get pushed back many times as it has already. Tim is really going to lame out on this, because Mark will tell him there is no financial interest in spending time rewriting the editor when they have one that works fine. The funny thing is that Tim is willing to look at UnrealScript and see the need for rewrites when it works so well already. Why not the editor? If he waits to get more of the structure and new engine done first (which of course make sense from one angle), the new C++ rewrite will wind up only working with the new engine, and still they won't see the editor as a potential commercial product.
Basically, I think we are stuck with this editor for the duration of these products. The only hope is if the new editor has the promised plug-in modular architecture and they take the time to make it backwards compatible. Tim once said that the current version was very tightly coupled to the engine thus making improvements without a total rewrite difficult at best. My point is I don't think they will focus on a C++ rewrite for Unreal/UT editing, only one for the future needs of the new system.
I think Tim really wants UnrealED to be the true interface to the Unreal system, but he needs to waken to the fact that UnrealED is the real product and the games are just content packs. Make a commercial version fully enhanced and a free version that can do simple editing and scripting and both camps will be happy and the project paid for. And it should work with any Unreal product to support the most customers, which is what we all are after all.
If you remember the original Unreal had a picture of a retail editor mock-up box in the catalog. Then it was decided that the effort to do a commercial editor was not worth the return finacially, as it would have a narrow market. That and the beta worked well enough, so why bother.
Well, many time I have started threads about why a commercial editor was a necessary and good thing. Many people want it to remain free, but there will ALWAYS be a free UnrealED so that arguement doesn't wash. They need some free editing support to foster a user community.
As for UnrealED now, it is going to get a C++ rewrite but I expect that to get pushed back many times as it has already. Tim is really going to lame out on this, because Mark will tell him there is no financial interest in spending time rewriting the editor when they have one that works fine. The funny thing is that Tim is willing to look at UnrealScript and see the need for rewrites when it works so well already. Why not the editor? If he waits to get more of the structure and new engine done first (which of course make sense from one angle), the new C++ rewrite will wind up only working with the new engine, and still they won't see the editor as a potential commercial product.
Basically, I think we are stuck with this editor for the duration of these products. The only hope is if the new editor has the promised plug-in modular architecture and they take the time to make it backwards compatible. Tim once said that the current version was very tightly coupled to the engine thus making improvements without a total rewrite difficult at best. My point is I don't think they will focus on a C++ rewrite for Unreal/UT editing, only one for the future needs of the new system.
I think Tim really wants UnrealED to be the true interface to the Unreal system, but he needs to waken to the fact that UnrealED is the real product and the games are just content packs. Make a commercial version fully enhanced and a free version that can do simple editing and scripting and both camps will be happy and the project paid for. And it should work with any Unreal product to support the most customers, which is what we all are after all.
I suppose what I'm actually really interested in is some body of literature that comprehensively covers every aspect of Unreal editing, from brushes to UnrealScript. (They said they're gonna let a complete manual come with the retail editor, and that's actually what I'm eyeing.) If a retail editor isn't forthcoming... ah, well, perhaps some people can write a book on editing Unreal and Unreal-engine games? (Wolf's tutes come close but there are still quite a number of things they don't cover...) And perhaps Epic can at least release some sort of patch to improve the editor's performance and even make some of the not-yet-working functions workable?
My, do I love GT. First they promise an add-on for Shadow Warrior only to break their promise, now they repeat the same with the Unreal editor... Hmmm, I think next time they promise another wonderful add-on or product, I'll just shrug my shoulders and take it with a pinch of salt.
Creme du Cammy. For soft, tender skin.
My, do I love GT. First they promise an add-on for Shadow Warrior only to break their promise, now they repeat the same with the Unreal editor... Hmmm, I think next time they promise another wonderful add-on or product, I'll just shrug my shoulders and take it with a pinch of salt.
Creme du Cammy. For soft, tender skin.
Cammy is right. A manual would be nice. How about a proper help system (I know there is a file)?
Just as Tim can find ways to improve UnrealScript there are tons of tool improvements, etc. that could be made with a new editor.
Everyone seems to miss the point that the editor HAS to be rewritten anyway for the next engine. It WILL be in C++ (or maybe the new UnrealScript /~unreal/ubb/html/wink.gif). So why not release a commercial version with proper documentation and some textures, models, and the like? A ton of the best user added levels so you don't have to download? How about tutorials? The user community is great but an official product would be polished and retail sales would help pay the extra costs.
Anyway it won't happen, but that is not a reason why it shouldn't.
The times article says they have made $14million+ (figure the math) on Unreal pre-UT and you have to wonder why they couldn't pay someone for a year to do this.
Just as Tim can find ways to improve UnrealScript there are tons of tool improvements, etc. that could be made with a new editor.
Everyone seems to miss the point that the editor HAS to be rewritten anyway for the next engine. It WILL be in C++ (or maybe the new UnrealScript /~unreal/ubb/html/wink.gif). So why not release a commercial version with proper documentation and some textures, models, and the like? A ton of the best user added levels so you don't have to download? How about tutorials? The user community is great but an official product would be polished and retail sales would help pay the extra costs.
Anyway it won't happen, but that is not a reason why it shouldn't.
The times article says they have made $14million+ (figure the math) on Unreal pre-UT and you have to wonder why they couldn't pay someone for a year to do this.
A few tool improvements would be nice. I loved the way Worldcraft allowed you to resize your brush(or whatever it was). You just click and move it exactly how you wanted it. I just found it a little easier that the way Ued does it but thats just me. Oh well...