No, that´s not possible. Look at this thread.Wowbagger said:
http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=161881
They are incinerating Epic cause a concept model.
EPIC detached from the Unreal community?
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http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=161881
They are incinerating Epic cause a concept model.
fuegerstef said:
I was actually there when this happened. Epic had a few fansites post to be on IRC for a special announcement, and after modding the channel and taking some questions about UT2k4 and the demo (users would send messages to various moderators to ask questions), Rein ended it by first telling us that there is an announcement, then making us wait like five minutes so he could call a few people to see if he can make the announcement...then he came back and said, "the demo will be out in two weeks."
They unmodded the channel right after Rein said it, and all hell broke loose. Then, the demo came out, I think, 12 days later.
Persefone said:
I posted something about this in Epic's official forums. There's a few discussions going on over there where a couple of key people are regularly accusing Epic of ignoring the community and not caring about any feedback or input at all. They feel that the lack of posts (which is because of game development, by the way) is proof that Epic doesn't give a crap about any of us.
(Personally, I think that Epic isn't posting on their forums because they don't want the flamers to flame them when they post... that's what I'd do. I would have more important things to do than to contribute to flame wars.)
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Yah, I remember. It has lately become a joke, even to Epic themselves. But you're right, Rein usually never said that it would actually be released in two weeks. That's exactly why I think it's frivolous for them to communicate on a low level with the sommunity, which is what discussion on a forum is.fuegerstef said:
There is a serious problem where the gaming community just flood fora - making them unreadable and useless.
If epic just engage with the established, mature communities, the game might not be right for novices.
I think their current apporach of reading the fora, but not posting is the right one.
The only question that remains - which fora do they read?!
If epic just engage with the established, mature communities, the game might not be right for novices.
I think their current apporach of reading the fora, but not posting is the right one.
The only question that remains - which fora do they read?!
Oh, I'd guess at the very least the official forums, these, and probably a few peeks at some competitive forums (prounreal, etc). Most likely relative threads in Blue's, Shack, and maybe VE and /.
I guess they won't say which ones, because it will only attract even more wannabe-fanboys to a forum. Never mind the whining, when they find out that Epic 'stole' an idea that happened to be posted on one of them ...
// Fact : Epic wants our input
addendum : they read the forums and probably more websites than we'd even know ...
// Fact : Fact, It IS possible to have a working discussion between the devs and the community.
It's also possible to survive several gunshots. Most people aren't that lucky ...
I've seen the communities for a variety of games (IL2, Lo:mac, Sims, SH3, etc.).
You could practically count on flames and whining to begin as soon as one of the developers dared to post anything. It might help if you had absolutely draconic moderators, but that sort of thing tends to kill the community just as quickly.
// Fact : Epic wants our input
addendum : they read the forums and probably more websites than we'd even know ...
// Fact : Fact, It IS possible to have a working discussion between the devs and the community.
It's also possible to survive several gunshots. Most people aren't that lucky ...
I've seen the communities for a variety of games (IL2, Lo:mac, Sims, SH3, etc.).
You could practically count on flames and whining to begin as soon as one of the developers dared to post anything. It might help if you had absolutely draconic moderators, but that sort of thing tends to kill the community just as quickly.
Persefone said:
Have you even read that thread?
The only one thats "incinerating" Epic is the threadstarter the rest seems to be ok with it?
If thats the worst you could find we should consider us lucky
God i hope they dont read the Prounreal forums (they probably do tho)
That must be the unfriendliest and elitist forum ive ever read.
I got depressed just reading the first page.
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Theres way too many half glass empty people here
Ill try and skip the provocative topic next time and see if that helps the discussion.
Edit: reading some old link i found this QA that i really liked,
Gamecloud - The new game is likely due for release sometime in 2006. Why announce and show off plans for the game so early in development?
Jeff Morris - There’s a lot of excitement about UT2007 on the team and we wanted to start sharing that excitement with the fans. We also rely very much on the UT hardcore customers to make suggestions, spitball ideas, and in general get us thinking about what we’re planning from different perspectives. We need to tip our hand a little bit to get the most out of that feedback.
That must be the unfriendliest and elitist forum ive ever read.
I got depressed just reading the first page.
-----------------------------------------------
Theres way too many half glass empty people here
Ill try and skip the provocative topic next time and see if that helps the discussion.
Edit: reading some old link i found this QA that i really liked,
Gamecloud - The new game is likely due for release sometime in 2006. Why announce and show off plans for the game so early in development?
Jeff Morris - There’s a lot of excitement about UT2007 on the team and we wanted to start sharing that excitement with the fans. We also rely very much on the UT hardcore customers to make suggestions, spitball ideas, and in general get us thinking about what we’re planning from different perspectives. We need to tip our hand a little bit to get the most out of that feedback.
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That´s only marketing, Wowbagger, only marketing. They are making a game for Battlefield fans not for Unreal fans.Wowbagger said:
Wowbagger said:
Incinerating was a little bit too exaggerated, but that thread is a good example of how people can digress about nothing.
If Epic minions descend to this forum we will have infinite posts of digress, if not something more "incinerating".
I think you should not think in such absolutes.
There is a demographic of people in each ones of those categories, people who like the vehicles thing, people who like the sci-fi thing, and people who like the realism thing, as well as many others. Epic knows very well the won't/can't appeal to the realism crowd, and if the demographic of people who like vehilces is large enough, they will lean towards that. They aren't making their game to appeal "to battlefield fans".
More then likely, the change in gameplay (conquest with vehiles, and large player counts) is a move towards something that new tech is allowing, in hopes to provide something to the community that hasn't been provided before. That is how you stay on top of a market, especially an entertainment market. It has nothing to do with stealing a fan base from a game in a different genre.
There is a demographic of people in each ones of those categories, people who like the vehicles thing, people who like the sci-fi thing, and people who like the realism thing, as well as many others. Epic knows very well the won't/can't appeal to the realism crowd, and if the demographic of people who like vehilces is large enough, they will lean towards that. They aren't making their game to appeal "to battlefield fans".
More then likely, the change in gameplay (conquest with vehiles, and large player counts) is a move towards something that new tech is allowing, in hopes to provide something to the community that hasn't been provided before. That is how you stay on top of a market, especially an entertainment market. It has nothing to do with stealing a fan base from a game in a different genre.
To make a gametype that requires large player counts with the actual online players base is to have faith, but that´s other thread.-AEnubis- said:
Let´s star with UT2004.There are vehicles in UT2004 and that doesn´t appeal to many new players who buyed an UT title for first time, saw the game and now hate the game. For many veterans there were no problem with ONS, they can like it or not, but the fact UT2004 includes "classic" gametypes (DM,CTF,DD,BR,AS) don´t get UT2004 into something totaly different.
Let´s continue with UT2007 now. There is a new vehicle based gametype, Conquest, and there´s nothing wrong with that: new UT, new vehicle gametype. But Epic includes only DM and CTF as "classic" gametypes, like a candy for us, poor retards who still playing UT and don´t understand the future of FPS are the buggies.
UT is about dextery, reflexes, aim and strategy, UT2003 is a beta, UT2004 is a First Person Shoter and Double Jumper
(a good one, but not better than UT) and, what´s UT2007?Conquest (aka UT2007) is Epic´s hope to engage new customers, but in the way, Epic is looking down on some Unreal fans. I am not going to buy a game with only DM and CTF.
I admit I´m dogmatic, but there is no replacement for UT since 1999 (for me since 2001).
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Actually Persefone I think it's the other way round.
I think that new players (lets not use "newbies" please...it's a crap insulting word) were more attracted UT2k4 for the vehicles and that without ONS, I'm not sure whether it would have gained many new people at all. UT has much more sophisticated movement and weapon balance than the average FPS and the learning curve is very steep and intimidating to new players....The gap between a new player and an experienced player in DM and CTF is huge. In ONS, the gap is narrower, and many players (like myself) bought UT2k4 because they liked ONS, and further down the line got into other gametypes like AS, TDM and CTF.
As for Epic dropping BR, DD and AS, well it is a shame, but hardly surprising...the online figures for all of them are very very low...and DD has always been broken from the start.
I think Epic believe that it's better to concentrate the community on the proven successful gametypes (DM, TDM, CTF and ONS) and introduce a new one that will engage new players (CON), rather than having the community split across so many different gametypes...especially when UT2kx has a lot fewer players now than it used to back in UT days.
I think that new players (lets not use "newbies" please...it's a crap insulting word) were more attracted UT2k4 for the vehicles and that without ONS, I'm not sure whether it would have gained many new people at all. UT has much more sophisticated movement and weapon balance than the average FPS and the learning curve is very steep and intimidating to new players....The gap between a new player and an experienced player in DM and CTF is huge. In ONS, the gap is narrower, and many players (like myself) bought UT2k4 because they liked ONS, and further down the line got into other gametypes like AS, TDM and CTF.
As for Epic dropping BR, DD and AS, well it is a shame, but hardly surprising...the online figures for all of them are very very low...and DD has always been broken from the start.
I think Epic believe that it's better to concentrate the community on the proven successful gametypes (DM, TDM, CTF and ONS) and introduce a new one that will engage new players (CON), rather than having the community split across so many different gametypes...especially when UT2kx has a lot fewer players now than it used to back in UT days.
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Persefone said:
*butts in* (and here is as good as anywhere, really)
As far as "classic" gametypes go, I guess we ought to go back to the original which had 4 gametypes: DM (and variants), CTF, DOM and AS.
DOM was never popular to begin with (I thought it was fun, but I liked CTF way better) and DDOM killed it. AS wasn't really much on numbers either, though I say that cautiously because UT99 Assault had (and has) a vicious cult following who will likely cut my throat first chance they get if I say anything untoward -- and 2k4 AS went nowhere for multiple reasons.
But anyway. DM (and variants, lol) and CTF are pretty much the core of UT as it stands, so I don't think that cutting nonvehicular gametypes to those two is really cheating anybody.
Now, as to the other matter of the vehicles and the BF crowd. I just checked CSports.net's gametype stats for UT2k4, and ONS is still the most popular gametype -- which speaks for itself, I think. Now check this out:
CSports stats said:
Next highest is Assault at 21k and change, and it starts taking big steps down from there.
What surprised me was that ONS, while still most popular, isn't really blowing the other core gametypes away. It's got about 50% more players than TDM, but I expected a much wider margin than that. Good news for all, I'd say.
But anyway, there you go. That's the current "meat and potatoes" of the UT franchise right there. CTF, DM/TDM and ONS. I'd say ONS has earned its keep, wouldn't you? And if the next wacko, odd- man- out gametype happens to have vehicles in it, so what?
*edit* D'oh! Simulpost...
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It´s true UT2K4´s vehicles attracted new players but they weren´t enough to retain then.Israphel said:
As far the movement I think here is the reason of UT2K4´s failure: the fast movement and the translocator get the learning curve of UT series into a smooth wall. Epic must attack this problem with a training system, something better than a tutorial, instead of cuttting off gametypes. The gameplay is which people hate because they don´t understand it
Beware of the Cult Discord, don´t allow them cut your eyeballs out.Discord said:
I see the light behind your words, let´s make UT2007 a noobs game.Discord said:
CSports means nothing to me.Discord said:
Discord said:
The only good server for ONS is Titan, if only one server is a triumph, then yes, ONS is a hit
Discord said:
Like I said, there´s only a decent server for ONS. I can´t wait to see the 12 slots Conquest servers.
