Come on admins, have some common sense

[empty]

I just played on a server with HORRIBLE camos choices. The red team had the woodland camo and the blue team had Russian tan camo. It's almost impossible to see the difference between the 2. Furthurmore, friendly fire was on, which meant you can kill a teammate and not know it.

Please, if any admin is reading this. Have some common sense. Similar looking camos are NOT good. The following are extremely poor camo choices:
Russian tan/woodland
black/blue
black/grey
green/grey

The following are smart choices:
Arctic/dark camo
desert/dark camo
Urban/dark camo
Russian green/dark camo

 

[CrappyChan]

yes i do agree that camos can be bad but...

i don't see you putting up a server anywhere. Im just glad there are servers at all...

 

[empty]

The thing is that I hate being admin. For one thing, I hate running dedicated servers. On the other hand, if I create a listen server, then I'll have to run it for at least 3 hours straight for the players to have fun. And I usually can't run a server for 3 hours straight (I can on Saturday mornings). You can see why I never run servers.

 

[ecale3]

Doing that would give one team a tremendous advantage. Imagine being on a dark map and being in white so that you can easily tell the difference between your camo and the other team, who is in black.

 

[Exar]

Empty, our server (INForcers Euro server) has Russian Green vs Woodland camos. Those camos are both green, the woodland camo is darker. We use those camos, because they are fair. Artic vs Black is very unfair in all maps! If u can't see the differance between Russian Green and Woodland u probably are a newbie, need a better graphics card / monitor or u need glasses.

 

[empty]

Ecale3, doing that would NOT give a team an advantage if used correctly. In an Arctic map, using the Russian Green/black camos is smart, cuz they have HUGE contrast AND neither blends in with the environment. If you want to play a desert map, use Urban/blue. Again, no blending and sports a huge contrast.

[-I-]Exar_Kunn, the reason that sucks is that, who would want to look closely at a guy 1 foot away for 0 seconds to see if he's an enemy or not? I wouldn't. Actually, I died in the server I was playing in cuz I couldn't even make out the camo. It looked similar from where I saw; that green/brown/gray camouflage camo that the US Army uses most of the time. Yeah, I know the difference between them, but it's so small that I don't have ANY patience to make out the difference during the game. Nor time. Glasses won't help. It's not a matter of seeing a blur on the screen, it's a matter of seeing the pixels of that player. And, yeah I'm getting a better video card next month (and so I'll be able to run Wolfenstein), but I doubt that would help either.

 

[Mr. HotDog]

This thread made me remeber a server I once played on. Black VS Blue on Kosovo Night. Madness!

 

[<P^R>Imperial]

empty let me ask you something. In the military camos for many countries in the same enviroment are generaly the same. So now for the question. If you were in the military and you stumbled on someone what do you think would happen?
"who would want to look closely at a guy 1 foot away for 0 seconds to see if he's an enemy or not?"
Well if you did that and it was a friendly Ill be seeing you in the brig.

 

[Tiffy]

Similar or even the same Cammo on combats is a fact of life. If we're aiming for a realistic game then your just going to have to live with it like us RL soldiers have to. That's what team work is all about.

If you rush off to do your John Waine bit and bugger the other dumb idiots on your team, then your going to have accidents. Inteligent people work as a team, knowing where your team mates are, thus not shoting them.

Team work people its what makes any Military Great. No one won a war all by himself!!!!!!

 

[ecale3]

Empty, what would be the point of cammo if they don't blend into the environment? And yes a better graphics card will help alot.

 

[Farouk]

Funny, Woodland vs Russian_Tan is my absolute favorite combination on pretty much all maps (except desert and snow ones). Very good camo and fair IMO.

Woodland is noticeably darker than Russian_Tan. If that isn't the case you probably have to put your brightness onto a lower, more reasonable and realistic level.

Screenshots using OpenGL (same scene):
<a href="http://guerilla.bei.t-online.de/Shot0126.jpg">800x600x16 + low world and character texture quality</a>
<a href="http://guerilla.bei.t-online.de/Shot0127.jpg">1024x768x32 + high world and character texture quality + detail textures</a>

Low quality makes it even easier to notice a soldier in the environment. I wouldn't want to play like that but on some older systems you don't have much choice.
The difference in brightness (which is everything that counts at some distance anyway) between both camos in both screens is pretty much the same. I really don't see the disadvantage of low end users.
The difference between 640x480 and 1280x1024+ resolutions is something different, but these extremes shouldn't count when it comes to game balancing.

As for night maps: When you can distinguish the uniforms in darkness (without flashlight) something is really wrong IMO. (May it the choice of uniforms, your brightness setting or both.)

 

[empty]

Well, yeah this is realistic. But isn't some fun sacrificed for realism here? Don't get me wrong, Infiltration is fun, but this is really screwed. Dying because I didn't expect the player hiding there is fun, dying because I didn't know that player was on the other team is NOT my idea of fun.

Well, true realism does suck. If this mod is TRUELY realistic, everybody would be virtually invisible due to camouflage, guns would jam unpredictably, grenades would sometimes not blow up at all, you'll sometimes be blinded due to dust in the air getting into your eyes, etc. Those mentioned above are NOT fun, and I doubt any game/mod developer with a brain would know that.

Besides, this camo thing doesn't help unless you're running a mapcycle with only arctic maps, or only jungle maps, or only desert maps, or only night maps. The camos on a server is constant. It doesn't change unless you create a different server. Which means, if I have desert and black camo enabled on my server, which runs Bullecourt and ExtremePrejudice back to back, the desert team would have an advantage on ExtremePrejudice and the black team would have an advantage on Bullecourt. It's not like one team would always have an advantage no matter what.

And it doesn't really have to be that way. Like I said before, you can have Bullecourt and ExtremePrejudice running Russian Green and Urban, without any team ever having a camouflage advantage. It's all in the head.

 

[Kuroshio Apocal]

I remember holding a position with two other guys for like 3 minutes one time... then I saw both get shot, and a death message didn't pop-up... and I realized I was hanging out with two enemies.

D'oh!

 

[NotBillMurray]

First thing - Camos are not constant on a server. They can change with each map. If you look in your infiltration.ini, you'll notice that [INF_Core.INFc_SkinInfo] has selections for every defined map. If it doesn't find a listing, then it applies the server defaults.

Second, I think your mention that saying "Yeah, I know the difference between them, but it's so small that I don't have ANY patience to make out the difference during the game." illustrates the key problem. You have to take the effort to identify your target, and that is a feature missing from too many games. I find that I have problems identifying between teams, and I think that is a good thing. It removes the "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality that has become common place since the whole red vs blue team (or arctic vs black in this case).

In short, I'm just saying that not everyone wants combat to be a good guys vs bad guys/white hat vs black hat enterprise.

 

[St0rmcaller]

Originally posted by Kuroshio Apocal
I remember holding a position with two other guys for like 3 minutes one time... then I saw both get shot, and a death message didn't pop-up... and I realized I was hanging out with two enemies.

D'oh!

Now that's deep infiltration!

 

[MadWoffen]

Hehe, anyone remember this =>


Real Toons

 

[asmodeus]

Artic/urban

black/woodland

some of the best combinations with little chance to confuse...

 

[yurch]

Originally posted by empty
Well, true realism does suck. If this mod is TRUELY realistic, everybody would be virtually invisible due to camouflage, guns would jam unpredictably, grenades would sometimes not blow up at all, you'll sometimes be blinded due to dust in the air getting into your eyes, etc. Those mentioned above are NOT fun, and I doubt any game/mod developer with a brain would know that.

Are you kidding? That would kick ass!

And my favorite camo combonation:
Woodland vs Woodland, or Black vs Black.
Only possible when both teams have good communication, of course.

 

[-Snakebite-]

Was playing Black vs Black_tan earlier.. Interesting fun that was, I would get TK'd every round.

The problem is not with you identifying your target, but your team mate identifying you (seems rare in my case).

I think the speed of Inf (without RA) is mainly to blame, as the enemy can generally reach your spawn withing 30 secs, before you have time to get yourselves together.

 

[Scuddie]

Well, I must say that there are some camo combinations that can be changed without mis-balancing the whole map. On the AFA server, the camos for Khazakstan are arctic (or urban??) / Black, and both teams blend in well in their surroundings, just in different ways. Plus side is you dont need to be walking up to the enemy hezitating to shoot. My only real complaints are Peru and Cuban Dawn.