This Mod is Superb

[yurch]

2 things Uziyahu... before someone that isn't as controlled flames you...
1, you don't have to use a new post for each idea. That just floods the forums, and bumps the response counts up.
2, You don't have to use a full quote, or one at all. We know what the topic is. Use the quote for re-referencing something posted a few thoughts back, or to point out someones miswording...

 

[Uziyahu]

Originally posted by yurch
Upleaning? you mean holding a gun up with one hand? (or two, that would be even more hilarious)
Try holdin a full auto gun anywhere level like that.
Better yet, just hope you don't slip and shoot yourself.

Whaddya suppose those vertical foregrips on the newer subguns and on the M4 SOPMOD are for, Yurch?

They come in handy in the Land Warrior program when shooting around corners, and obviously the M16A1/A2 doesn't recoil so much that they decided it was impossible to fire accurately without having a good cheek-to-stock weld. (Drill Sergeants firing the weapon off of their dicks are ample demonstration of the gentleness of the Armalite's recoil.)

--Uziyahu_IDF

 

[Uziyahu]

Originally posted by yurch
2 things Uziyahu

I am not new to the web, nor new to forums. I am ALREADY trying to keep only the relevant parts of the quote in my replies. I see that this is necessary because it is obvious that some readers conveniently have their trains of thought derailed, at times, and I'd rather make it clear what I am talking about rather than to have to spend 4 more posts telling someone that what they are arguing about is NOT what I meant.

As for having a new post for each reply... Sorry, but I'm not taking the time to COMPILE one big post when the interface doesn't make it convenient for me to do so. Program in a floating window that does the compiling for me, and I'm "down wit dat".

--Uzi

 

[yurch]

rrrgh...

First of all, we don't have a "land warrior" system.
And I "suppose" the foregrips certainly are not for accurate shooting, or shooting at all.
The full auto was removed from the m16 to conserve ammo. The gun certainly is not for spraying bullets blindly.

 

[Zundfolge]

Okay, but what does "derived" mean in this case? Are they actual recordings that have been turned into .wav files?

Or did they listen to actual recordings and then try to create sounds from scratch which sound like the real thing?

--Uzi

IIRC the gun sounds are either directly recorded from the real weapons by members of the INF team (or someone they know), or they are recorded from video footage of the real weapons being fired (I'm sure there's a little post production processing). But for the most part, they are the real thing I may be wrong, but I think the sound for the M-16 is a recording of Gillian (Gryphon's AR-15).

If you have any more questions about the sounds in Infiltration, try to contact Neo. He's the INF team's sound guy (contact info is available on the INF homepage)

 

[McMuffin]

man... I thought I abused the Quote feature...

Uzi ya gotta cut that out

 

[Uziyahu]

Read My Lips

Originally posted by yurch
First of all, we don't have a "land warrior" system.
And I "suppose" the foregrips certainly are not for accurate shooting, or shooting at all.
The full auto was removed from the m16 to conserve ammo. The gun certainly is not for spraying bullets blindly.

Yeah, see? You lost the train of thought. That's why I quote!

You were asserting that it was impossible to fire controllably (not necessarily "accurately") from over the head while holding with two hands.

My point was that the vertical foregrips come in real handy in the Land Warrior program, where they do the very thing you are ridiculing. (I wasn't saying anything about Land Warrior being in this mod. In fact, at the beginning of this thread, I suggested Land Warrior be implemented. I also read the response explaining why it would not. I accepted the response as well-reasoned. I don't need you to repeat it. I can read just fine.) Yes, of course, the vertical foregrips are used for shooting! They weren't added for opening coke bottles!

Yes, I was in the United States Army when they phased out the A1 and phased in the A2, and you know what? If the F.B.I. hadn't found an old A1 that belonged to our unit and sent it back to our arms room, the OPFOR would have cooked our goose one day at JRTC. Because the A1 had full-auto, one of our Sergeants who had inadvertently stumbled through the night into the OFPOR squad was able to switch to full auto and spin 360 degrees, lazing all of the enemy troopers.

And you know what they're learning now? True professionals don't use 3-round burst. They learn to squeeze off their own disciplined bursts.

And you know what else they've learned? A soldier with an A2 who wants full-auto will still go through a ton of ammo by repeatedly firing 3-rnd bursts in quick succession. So what really has been accomplished?

Any gun with any kind of sighting system isn't meant for firing blindly, but did you know that soldiers will do it, anyway, when they see their buddies dropping from head shots after they take a peak from their foxholes to take disciplined aimed shots?

Your assertions are about what is professional. Sim development is about providing realism. Professionalism is to be developed by good squads and mediocrity is to be perfected by fools. In a sim, it isn't realism that isn't fun. It is realism not realized! (blah, blah, blah, soldier bleeding in a trench... how about that same soldier watching the awesome battle as he desperately tries to give one of his compatriots a letter to his girl back home while they're all too busy being distracted by the oncoming wave?)

Killjoys like yourself who want to steal the potential from a project are what keeps a project from achieving its true potential.

For example, Jamming. Where has it been since Electronic Arts' "SEAL Team"? Jamming is one of the reasons you would choose the recoiling AKMSU over the M16A2. (Blah, blah, blah, cleaning, blah, blah, blah, maintenance, blah, blah, blah, A2 improvements... I know better, boys.)

--Uziyahu_IDF

 

[Evil Joe]

I'll agree about the 3-round burst mode... I don't use it, [in RL], I think you have more control in RL and in the game by using your own controlled burst which is what they STRESS. Although blind fire has its merits. rather then stick your head up and aim... my old man said they would use to stick the rifle up over their head and fire a spray patter or two and then would come up and put down some controlled fire. He walked out of Vietnam so **** you guys. You know where your guys are in RL [to an extent] its not like this game where people run around doing their own thing.

About the jamming... considering the low probability of a jam if you take good care of your weapon and fire like you know what you are doing you could play this game feasible and never have a jam. I'm in the Army still and plan to stay in especially after college. Although it might be interesting to include some code that increases jam probability with misuse... ie extended firing in full-auto etc. based on the actual characteristics of the weapons... the m16[period] isn't that great when you fire in full-auto or like you say burst after burst after burst

 

[yurch]

yeah, alright. "Killjoys like myself". So if I do not believe in something, or see the point of, I automatically am killing it for all.
You can say that for almost everyone here on one point or another.

Keep in mind that this aiming system would apply for every gun. This includes the many guns without foregrips.

Alright, fine, I always thought the foregrips were used for carrying. That combined with the no full-auto... Leads me to believe that the original intent of the m16 gun designers was not for spray and pray.
Yes, what soldiers do with the guns on the field may be different. It would be nice to have all of those things in the game.

I am questioning the need to put such a feature in the game right now. Sure soldiers fire rounds blindly over trenches. But how many hits/kills actually occur with such a tactic?

 

[ShakKen]

Actually, vertical foregrips are detrimental to small arms handling. They shift the center of gravity of the weapon higher up and away from the users hands and place the user's supporting arm at a weak angle (lets see you try to bayonet somebody like that). They also impede aiming over and around cover.

In the case of the Land Warrior system, the foregrip is a necessity, simply because the system is so rediculously bulky it would be impossible to wield efficiently without.

Vertical foregrips are useful for only two reasons otherwise; to distance one's hands from a hot barrel and to facilitate a relatively firm grip in a small envelope (in general, in the event that a full sized horizontal grip cannot be facilitated). As in the case of the Steyr AUG and the MP5K.

As far as the LW system goes, no we will not be using it in the mod. Mostly for 2 reasons;
-This mod is not just about the US. It will take too much time and effort to implement a whole system that is primarily used and designed by the US alone with too little gain.
-Too little data about the techical specifications of the Land Warrior project to work with.

 

[BlueSniper]

If yurch didnt have the self control he has, that guy would have been burned, half eaten and sent via Fed Ex to his family members...

 

[Uziyahu]

Originally posted by ShakKen

As far as the LW system goes, no we will not be using it in the mod. Mostly for 2 reasons;
-This mod is not just about the US. It will take too much time and effort to implement a whole system that is primarily used and designed by the US alone with too little gain.

For the second time, I recognize the fact that you won't be simulating Land Warrior (something that NovaLogic bombed at, and something which Rogue Spear will also bomb at), but similar systems are in various stages of development in several NATO member countries.

As concerns foregrips, I did NOT say that it was impossible to fire controllably (not necessarily "accurately") in full auto unless you had vertical foregrips. My point was that vertical foregrips are being added to the newer weapon variants to aid in control when firing the weapon around obstacles (and thus, off the shoulder) without aiming.