Mutator/Gametype idea
- Thread starter I_LoveToKill
- Start date
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I'm on board with anything and everything stated above. I like the idea of personal scores not being tracked, for obvious reasons. 
As far as statistical categories, too bad you can track "human sheild." That's my specialty!
As far as statistical categories, too bad you can track "human sheild." That's my specialty!
Code:
[FONT=Courier New][b]Event
Player(0) dies because they get in the way of a shot
that was heading directly for the flag carrier[/b]
Player(0).HumanShield++[/FONT](I'm just kidding)
IMHO no system in the world can get rid of the glory-hounds & stat-whores in the games on public servers.
The stats as they are were invented so the stat-whores could find a reason to defend once in a while as well as attack (ie : to play as a team for once) ...
// no stats, only the actual amount of flag-caps shown
While such a system looks fine at the start ... it runs into the problem that the 'flag-carriers' effectively get all the glory, while the defenders get nothing.
What stat-whore would want to defend under these circumstances ?
// detailed (personal) stats
It probably would help a bit ... especially if the only frags that were counted were the 'assists'.
Without any kind of sorting it would make it more difficult to claim to be the best, but people would still see the people with the most flag-captures as being 'the best'.
Perhaps what could reduce the immediate threat would be a system that only showed the detailed stats for the player while those of the rest would be hidden.
That way the only 'star' that could brag about his 'skills' would be the ones that scored the majority of the flags in the game ...
Maybe what really is needed is a system that gives more immediate rewards for 'good behaviour' ?
What if :
-a- anyone near the team-flag would get a health/shield/adrenaline/accuracy/-boost (what and how big those bonus would depend on time spent in the situation) ...
-b- anyone near the FC would get similar advantages as well ...
-c- teammates near each other would get some minor bonus as well ...
-d- anyone fragging an enemy in situation -a- or -b- would get some kind of instant-bonus
(thus the lone wolf would only gain something if he assisted his team in some way instead of fragging random targets ... )
Of course the problem would be determining what kind of bonus is appropiate and what distances / time-factors to use.
The stats as they are were invented so the stat-whores could find a reason to defend once in a while as well as attack (ie : to play as a team for once) ...
// no stats, only the actual amount of flag-caps shown
While such a system looks fine at the start ... it runs into the problem that the 'flag-carriers' effectively get all the glory, while the defenders get nothing.
What stat-whore would want to defend under these circumstances ?
// detailed (personal) stats
It probably would help a bit ... especially if the only frags that were counted were the 'assists'.
Without any kind of sorting it would make it more difficult to claim to be the best, but people would still see the people with the most flag-captures as being 'the best'.
Perhaps what could reduce the immediate threat would be a system that only showed the detailed stats for the player while those of the rest would be hidden.
That way the only 'star' that could brag about his 'skills' would be the ones that scored the majority of the flags in the game ...
Maybe what really is needed is a system that gives more immediate rewards for 'good behaviour' ?
What if :
-a- anyone near the team-flag would get a health/shield/adrenaline/accuracy/-boost (what and how big those bonus would depend on time spent in the situation) ...
-b- anyone near the FC would get similar advantages as well ...
-c- teammates near each other would get some minor bonus as well ...
-d- anyone fragging an enemy in situation -a- or -b- would get some kind of instant-bonus
(thus the lone wolf would only gain something if he assisted his team in some way instead of fragging random targets ... )
Of course the problem would be determining what kind of bonus is appropiate and what distances / time-factors to use.
JaFO said:
hmm... interesting idea and might even work
It seems it would depend on the true nature of stat-whores. Are they so focused on playing for something, i.e. somekind of personal reward, where good behavior rewards might take the place of points in this or are they just seeking some form of concrete/permanent bragging rights or glory.
I can't speak for Brizz, but I'm not going to be very open to ideas. Too many people want too much stuff. Too many cooks.
When this gets done, we'll just run it at FragBU and see what happens
When this gets done, we'll just run it at FragBU and see what happens
WebSlinger said:
This is a good start, but I think it should still list frags and flag touches.
Frags
Captures
Flag Touches
Flag Assists
Cover
Flag Carrier Kills
Flag Carrier Returns
I think it would work best to just list these. No overall player score. You could also go all TTMish and start doing stuff like how much damage you have done on enimy flag carriers (hence it shows stats for doing damage against an efc even if your teammate gets the kill).
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JaFO said:
It should not even show who capped, only thing should be the number of
caps each team have at the top, who capped should not be shown either,
no scores at all, anyrything else can still be whored, and this was what I
wanted to avoid, so a game would be 100% based on capping that flag.
Aye, what ILTK said. Yea, they could keep track in their head, because it's an easy, usually relatively small number to remember, but with assists and hand changes, the proof is hardly worth digging for or arguing about. Only scores or stats shown would belong to a team, no individual. It shouldn't be about personal reward, but whether or not your team wins. That's what team games are all about. If they want personal reward, tell them to go play FFA DM, and see their name at the top of that sheet.
I Almost wouldn't mind seeing TDM without an ingame score sheet with individual player stats. Maybe just show you your own, and have a way to view it overall (text file style as mentioned before) once the game has finished.
Unfortunately, when you want to change someones attitude towards something, especially in cases like this, you can't give them insentive to do otherwise, and expect it to work as well as taking away insentive to do what it is they currently do that you don't approove of. Possible, but not probable.
I Almost wouldn't mind seeing TDM without an ingame score sheet with individual player stats. Maybe just show you your own, and have a way to view it overall (text file style as mentioned before) once the game has finished.
Unfortunately, when you want to change someones attitude towards something, especially in cases like this, you can't give them insentive to do otherwise, and expect it to work as well as taking away insentive to do what it is they currently do that you don't approove of. Possible, but not probable.
I'm going to make an option that lets the server admin have personal stats turned on or off. Personal stats will show under the scoreboard for you and you alone if personal stats are enabled. We are still discussing whether or not you should be able to view others' stats.
I guess I shortened too much as you seem to think I said something else.I_LoveToKill said:
What I meant was that if the game only shows the score (ie : it's 5 - 3 ) the ones that made those 8 caps will know how many they've made.
They probably will also know if they've made the most caps for their team.
However as I said : the rest of the team (whether they be defenders or 'assists') won't even have a clue as to how much they've managed to do for their team.
Or in other words :
whatever system is used ... those that want to play for points will find a way to do so
It's the reason why the formula used in CTF is tricky to balance as it dictates what someone will do.
For example :
Giving points for flagreturns means that a real stat-whore will let an enemy take the flag and *then* shoot him ...
In the end any system is an excercise in futility as the ones that don't want to learn can't be forced to do so. One can only hope that somehow the new players can be taught 'proper' behaviour.
And as I said the best way probably would be a (personal) stat-screen that showed the things that can be done.
I would like a stat-screen/scoreboard to show the number of teamkills anyone has. Because UT still misses an obvious indicator whenever friendly fire is enabled.
Wow! What a GREAT example of teamwork! ILTK gives the premise for an idea, other forumers help give suggestions, Webby compiles the ideas and works with Brizz on producing the product!
Great work to everyone involved! If I get this management position at work, you're all hired!
Great work to everyone involved! If I get this management position at work, you're all hired!
Renegade Retard said:Wow! What a GREAT example of teamwork! ILTK gives the premise for an idea, other forumers help give suggestions, Webby compiles the ideas and works with Brizz on producing the product!
Great work to everyone involved! If I get this management position at work, you're all hired!
Sweet! Can I have a raise?