I Say No To Knifes!!!

[phatcat]

INF is a realism mod right??

well I am personaly sick of the default "realism" melee weapon! the KNIFE.

Most people don't whip out there knifes in a combat situation, unless it was for sentry removal or they dropped there gun.

if you get into a situation where you are out of ammo, you are told to use your gun. and or bayonet

END OF RANT

I would like the option for a melee attack in INF with your gun! a bound key where if the weapon has the ablity, to use it as a close range melee weapon. for example, if you sneak up behind a guy with your rifle. your not going to plug him at close range with your m16! your gonna wack him down to the floor with your gun but and stomp his ass.

also if I'm out of ammo I'm not gonna waste time whiping out my short range knife, I'm going to use the end of my shot gun, m16.

here are my examples for melee attacks with the current guns

bretta = swing fireing hand accross, or down. in a swinging acction, but still holding the gun correctly (real people don't hold the gun by the barrle and "pistol whip")

DE = same thing

M16 = bring butt of gun down on them.

mp5 = thrust barrle forwrd (since the colapsing butt of the INF's version of the MP5 is not bade for bashing, and would probably break)

FNP90 = same as m16

shotgun = same as m16

grenade = ok this is tricky, I think they would just swing with a fist

grenade launcher = ehh... phehaps just swing with fist.

this is just some vauge examples...

tell me what you think

 

[DarkBls]

The knife is still realist..
But yes I think using your empty weapon is realist too.

swing fireing hand accross, or down. in a swinging acction, but still holding the gun correctly (real people don't hold the gun by the barrle and "pistol whip")

You're right, we teach/learn to use the barrel to strike someone.

I think it could be automatic. If you are out of ammo and you are close to someone to hit him, pressing the fire buton start the strike..

 

[phatcat]

I was thinking along the lines of a button for "melee" attack, so you could do it when felt the need

sometimes a good wack over the head with a butt of a gun is all you need

 

[DEFkon]

i Kinda like the idea of a melee attack.

But i wouldn't remove the knife. I've killed a couple of people with the knife in some tense situations. Nothing says "the man" like a knife kill against an armed party.

My "mod" to your suggestions would by in implimentation. For the most part i'd agree with your weapon - melee combo with exception to the Mp5 and FN P90. The i have a hard time thinking of an effective attack with it. The P90 would be similar.. because of it's ergonomics and small size other than holding it like a 2 X 4 i dont see how it could be wielded in a threat'n manner.

now.. as for my ideas..
Rather than complicating INF further with more and more controls, i think that things should be more "automatic" or to quote from another game have "Contex sensitive" controls and items.

For example, in order for a weapon to be used in a mele function, it must not have any ammo in it (haveing extra mags doesn't count), and it must be capable of melee attacks. (not all are in my opinion)

If the weapon isn't bladed (like a knife or a bayonet) when someone is hit with it, it causes only mild damage, but it knocks the wind out of him, forces their weapon to be unshouldered, and possibly prevents them from firing for a half second. If the blow is hard enough maybe you could knock the weapon out of someones hand... ( a M16 but making full contact would be more likely than a "pistol whip" )

 

[jaymian]

I like the idea but...

you have to look at it from the INF teams point of view. They would have to animate all of this, and I assume it would be a lot of work. I love the idea of bashing someone's brains in with the butt of my weapon, or stabbing them with it's bayonet. I could see it being for a few weapons, but for every weapon? I'd rather have them work on more important things like bugs.
Jaymian

 

[phatcat]

yeah...

 

[Ferd]

Throwing the knife to the enemy´s throat hmmmm sweet

 

[Mad_Dog]

for now, i just want the knife to be optional in your loadout, i hate cycling through it. but the ability to lay some smackdown with the butt of my robar sounds very sweet....

 

[The_Fur]

My beef with the knife is the lack of range, you practically have to crawl up your oponents but in order to hit them with it, and I am quite positive my arms reach at least a bit further then that.

 

[LordKhaine]

The knife does have too short a range really, but the machete will in some way make up for that.

 

[DredDamo]

Maybe, but I won't waste my bulk with putting a freakin' machete in there. Especially if I could take my SIG and, w/o wasting ammo, stave someone's head in. Especially useful for testing death-feigners! You wouldn't have to switch to anything, just change your grip and BAP! to the head.

As cool as this sounds, I want all the other stuff in INF first, before this is even considered. Melee occurs so rarely (as well it should) that it's not an issue.

Of course with the propagation of weapon sounds working correctly, it might be more of an issue due to increased noise.

A solution to that is a suppressed weapon. Can we have the SoCom next, please? Since nothing else is suppressed, that is...oh wait, the FN P90 is, isn't it? So that's 2. Not bad, but more needed...the SoCom will be great in maps like Kosovo when you're sneaking around and trying to avoid making noise, ehh hehehe...

As for melee: don't get into it! You can always pick up weapons from the field...

Damodred

 

[Dr.Dase]

The problem with Hand to hand attacks is that they are VERY difficult to model in a game, most turn into a running around eachother trying to get a hit in. (anyone played Fantasy Quake?) Try it in any game/mod, most hand to hand combats are conducted in a very Q3A way, meaning you run like hell, circle strafe and just try to hit the enemy with your knife or whatever, not very much like anything you'd see in RL. Since there are not technique involved, or any skill, just run and hold left mouse button......

I've said this before, but the only hand to hand i can see that fits this mod is a thing i saw in a Warhammer 40k Mod for Quake, when you whip up a hand to hand weapon, and strike at an opponent, you and him get locked in hand to hand combat, noone can actually do anything, you can't move or fire or anything, then the computer "rolls" dice, as in the tabletop game, and the winner gets a number of hits on the enemy, possibly killing him. This could be done in Inf, as a Melee key, when pressed near an enemy, you were locked in hand to hand combat, with whatever weapon you have in your hands, thus making the knife somewhat useful, and you don't have to run around trying to hit the guy. Possible even if you were running, you might tackle the guy, with you two ending up on the ground, battleing out like in Saving Private Ryan, when that Waffen SS guy kills the jewish guy, whatever his name was. This would be highly realistic, since most hand to hand is not made running and strafing, but close and dirty....

And hand to hand would get used when you're in CQB and run out of ammo, you can just charge the guy and kick his ass basically. As it is now, the guy can just strafe and run backwards and there's no way in hell you can hit him, with lag and low FPS....

 

[MorphineAlien]

I like the knife. Not only will I shove it up yer fat keester if I get the opportunity, but I also use it to pick my teeth and scrape dog s_ _t off of my boots.

 

[Ferd]

The knife should kill with only 1 hit.... and then it would be worth to have it as a weapon.

 

[Aequi]

"the knife should kill in one hit?"

...uhm? it doesn't? ...try secondary attack (the aim button).

 

[Dr.Dase]

That would not be very realistic, in that case, it would deal more damage than the 7.62mm NATO cartridge, and it most probably doesn't. But when the advanced damage models is implemented, it would be dangerous...

 

[The_Fur]

Well a 7.62mm hole could be fatal, but i think a 15cm gash in your neck will put you out of your miseries ASAP

 

[DarkBls]

Slash are often less dangerous than strike...

I know someone who survive and keep figting with more than 20 slash on his body !

 

[The_Fur]

I'm quite positive those slashes were not in his neck area
It's simply very hard to fight if your blood simply doesn't reach your brain

 

[Dr.Dase]

Yeah, but placement is key, if you slash someone over the arm, very little damage indeed....a 7.62mm NATO round in the arm, party over.....