Ask a Union Gov't Worker.
- Thread starter ZenPirate
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1- nope, working
2-The Union tried to silence me
3- yup
4- 1 bottle water. Alcohol gets you instafired these days
5- nothing, cameras everywhere = instafire
6- boxer-briefs
7- 12
Side note, gg Wisconsin. When the State starts cutting back benefits and the insurance companies start losing profit I'm sure they won't raise everyones rates to make up for it... I know in NY employees already pay 10% pension contribution for life, and 25% for health care for life. Is that how it is in private companies these days as well, or are we still getting it too good?
Honest question for you non gov't workers- Do you think tax payers in Wisconsin will actually see any direct tax break benefit for this decision, or is it all political grandstanding?
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America was made strong by it's industrial base, and globalization has removed said industry. Wall Street, and the wealthy have benefited greatly, but America as a whole has eroded.
Lizard Of Oz
Demented Avenger
Walker gets "pranked" and reveals his true colors:
[M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBnSv3a6Nh4[/M]
[M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBnSv3a6Nh4[/M]
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^ They really won't be happy until *none* of the working class has anything. Corporations are posting record, again *record* profits (looking at you again IBM), while using the recession as an excuse to make cut backs to make even more money while the worker suffers. I call bull****. Sorry American car companies couldn't figure out how to compete Midwest peoples, but why screw the rest of us?
Corporations? 
Yes, now the voters/tax-payers are the evil corporations holding down the "working class"?
Oh, and btw, did you know that ~95% of nea's dues go to the Democrat party? Do you have any idea how much "stimulus" money went to them? Talk about screwing the middle class. But, hell, it's all for the kids' education...
[m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-piPkgAUo0w[/m]
Yes, now the voters/tax-payers are the evil corporations holding down the "working class"?
Oh, and btw, did you know that ~95% of nea's dues go to the Democrat party? Do you have any idea how much "stimulus" money went to them? Talk about screwing the middle class. But, hell, it's all for the kids' education...
[m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-piPkgAUo0w[/m]
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The average income of the top 5% of earners has increased by 50% in the past 25 years. During this same time period the average income in the US only increased by 13%. There are always winners and losers in any economy. This ones rigged toward the top end.
Unions were born out of the dark days of the past when child labor, sweatshops, company stores, and company towns treated workers like slaves. There would be no reasons for unions if the greed of men was not involved. History is full of union busting, the fascists did it, the communists did it, and the US capitalists did it. Read your history and maybe history will not repeat itself.
Unions were born out of the dark days of the past when child labor, sweatshops, company stores, and company towns treated workers like slaves. There would be no reasons for unions if the greed of men was not involved. History is full of union busting, the fascists did it, the communists did it, and the US capitalists did it. Read your history and maybe history will not repeat itself.
And now the unions are the greedy ones that make more than their bosses (tax payers) don't give a **** about education. This has nothing to do with corporations but you guys couldn't care less about the truth, voters/taxpayers or education
Let's go a different route here.
I worked as a heavy equipment mechanic for a private company, making a good wage in a bad working environment, no retirement, crap health care, etc.. I was, and still am top of my game. I'm the guy they turn to when the poop hits the fan.
When I was interviewed for my current job I was offered a starting wage of $10.00 per hour, and required to be able to perform all phases of repair to cars, trucks, construction equipment, small engines, boats, anything they operated. Before I was able to laugh at them and walk out, like the previous two people that interviewed before me, they pitched "the package". The promise of regular raises, good health care, and a pension plan. I decided to take the chance. The Union...the same Union I hate for protecting useless workers that should be fired... the Union made that package possible. 12 years later I finally make what I did before I went into civil service, and have pretty good benefits (even after concessions).
I ask this. In Wisconsin benefits will get cut, and salary increases will never happen (hey, what tax payer in his right mind will vote for workers to get raises? really?) How are they going to attract valuable employees like me?
*edit* BTW- Unions are greedy, but I do have some contention to the "times are tough" mantra being chanted by the media/
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/business/economy/24econ.html
I worked as a heavy equipment mechanic for a private company, making a good wage in a bad working environment, no retirement, crap health care, etc.. I was, and still am top of my game. I'm the guy they turn to when the poop hits the fan.
When I was interviewed for my current job I was offered a starting wage of $10.00 per hour, and required to be able to perform all phases of repair to cars, trucks, construction equipment, small engines, boats, anything they operated. Before I was able to laugh at them and walk out, like the previous two people that interviewed before me, they pitched "the package". The promise of regular raises, good health care, and a pension plan. I decided to take the chance. The Union...the same Union I hate for protecting useless workers that should be fired... the Union made that package possible. 12 years later I finally make what I did before I went into civil service, and have pretty good benefits (even after concessions).
I ask this. In Wisconsin benefits will get cut, and salary increases will never happen (hey, what tax payer in his right mind will vote for workers to get raises? really?) How are they going to attract valuable employees like me?
*edit* BTW- Unions are greedy, but I do have some contention to the "times are tough" mantra being chanted by the media/
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/business/economy/24econ.html
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I think you answered your own question
Let individuals bargain for their salaries based on their performance.
again, we're talking about public sector unions, which even FDR was opposed to.
How can individuals bargain salary in a public job? Salary will be set on public vote, and political motivation, not individual performance. Private sector, no problem. There's a lot of politics and favoritism in civil service that has nothing to do with performance, or Unions.
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just like any other job? based off their credentials and negotiated with the dept. that's hiring them. There's many ways, but the monopoly of the nea and dem party surely isn't working.
again, what about multiple unions or letting teachers opt out of the union?
I think if there was more accountability and results, ppl wouldn't mind paying teachers well. Hell, I think (as most would agree) really great teachers should get paid very well.
Politics and favoritism is what we're doing right now
nobody's saying the right to unionize should be taken away, but since almost all private sector jobs aren't unionized and are above minimum wage (over 90% in both cases iirc), I think we'd do just fine.
As a matter of fact, I think we'd stop bleeding jobs to China and other places if we did away with minimum wage, or at least drastically reduced it (not to mention regulations etc.)that. Hell, you can't hire teenagers to do $5/hr jobs anymore. Right there you're killing many jobs that their completely willing and wanting to do.
When you speak of greed, you need to differentiate between a greedy teacher whi earns $60k a year and the wall street scum who make $60M a year while the economy tanks.
Your looking in the wrong place for greed.
60k is high. Why on Earth *anyone* would waste a masters degree for such little pay is beyond me.
http://www.payscale.com/research/US/All_K-12_Teachers/Salary
My wife is a public school teacher (1st. Grade). 60k is a dream amount. Try 45 as a more realistic number. Oh and add the supplies we personally buy to stock the classroom. Oh and add the food we buy to put in the kids backpacks so they eat over the weekends. I'm lucky that the postal workers pitch in on the cost. You guys have no idea the kids not eating. I could empty a grocery store in a week and not feed the kids in the local district.
Greedy? Hardly. No single person aside from a parent does more for those kids than my wife and her co-workers.
Greedy? Hardly. No single person aside from a parent does more for those kids than my wife and her co-workers.
good god, I wonder if you guys even read anything I post. I'm talking about the union's greed, not the teachers. and yet again, we're talking public sector, not private.
And in Wi, they make around $60k for salary + another $30k or so in benefits, which puts them above the average private sector worker
And in Wi, they make around $60k for salary + another $30k or so in benefits, which puts them above the average private sector worker
Corporations?
Yes, now the voters/tax-payers are the evil corporations holding down the "working class"?
Oh, and btw, did you know that ~95% of nea's dues go to the Democrat party? Do you have any idea how much "stimulus" money went to them? Talk about screwing the middle class. But, hell, it's all for the kids' education...
[m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-piPkgAUo0w[/m]
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