UT3 is the best of the series

BlackCheetah · Mar 18, 2009

I never experienced ut2004 shield gun annoyance...

I never finish a ut2004 game without 40-50 deaths

UT04 good players know how to own me.

Its floating like a pigeon but I find Gorge sexy with wings.

Theres lots of hitscan mostly because of MAPS rankin is a example of good equality of weapons. If played team arena gametype thats where youll see the extremely deadly hitscan but play regular dm game everyone wants the flakcannon.

The flying pideons still have a extremely unique gameplay movement.

The models make not look "UT" as what people wanted from ut99 but they do cause alot intimidation (Almost always the person with Gorge model will own everyone)

Dark Pulse · Mar 19, 2009

FuLLBLeeD said:
UT3's vehicle balance is also much better overall than 2k4's.

It is... until you get those Axon vs. Necris maps. Those are always a farce.

N1ghtmare · Mar 19, 2009

Dark Pulse said:
It is... until you get those Axon vs. Necris maps. Those are always a farce.

Yep. As I said earlier, suspense necris is terrible. Whoever decided to give the necris side TWO nemesis'...

Edit:
Played another match of Suspense Necris.

Da-yum.
Not only did they give the necris side TWO nemisis' they removed the Axon's hellbender. WTF? And I also noticed something in general...the darkwalker turret can aim completely upward. The goliath kept on getting attacked by he fury. So I took the raptor over to the enemy DW to see what I could do. It looked directly up 90* and blew me away.

Now there are many things they could do to suspense necris:
A) Give Axon side Hellbender Back
B) Give Axon side Hellbender and replace SPMA with Paladin(Paladin might not be too bad in Suspense actually) or another Goliath
C) Give Axon two Hellbenders, remove one Necris Nemesis but give Necris a scavenger.

The list could go on of the things they could do, but jesus the current setup does not work. The nemesis just isn't a equivalent to the hellbender, therefore the Axon side must have at sightly more vehicles than the necris to balance it out.

Dimes · Mar 19, 2009

Plutonia_Experi said:
- Weapon balance UT3 weapons are the best balanced so far. Never had a game where there is no dominance of a single weapon. Each weapon is different and has it's use, each weapon is lethal in its own way.
UT2004 had dominance of hitscan (or we'd better say, shock rifle) and all the floating pigeons and huge mapscale rendered the non-hitscan pretty much useless.
And don't let me started with UT, because its weapon balance was a complete crap (e.g. shock rifle primary that delivers 60hp, who needs sniper rifle? Ah sorry, you need sniper rifle because it shoots faster LOL - biorifle useless - ripper was good only to spam, with headshots included -flack didn't allow for a good bouncing hit - pulse gun (for the new players, that is the predecessor of the link gun) had the exact same use of the minigun - etc.)

c'mon dude the bio rifle wasn't useless (if you knew how to use it) and ut1's flak cannon was IMO the best. dude you say that the ripper is spamming? c'mon dude almost every weapon in ut3 is spammed. but i agree ut3 is awesome.

Evill_Bob · Mar 19, 2009

Huh, I never had any problem fragging the Hell out of Necris vehicles with the Goliath. Of course I've never fought any team that seemed to know which way to point the gun yet...

GreatEmerald · Mar 20, 2009

Hmm, I'd say to keep true to the original, it should be like this:

1. Give Axon side the Hellbender back.
2. Change one Nemesis to two Scavengers.

That would even the odds more. Oh, and don't forget to change your preferred team to Blue the next time you play

shoptroll · Mar 20, 2009

N1ghtmare said:
B) Give Axon side Hellbender and replace SPMA with Paladin(Paladin might not be too bad in Suspense actually) or another Goliath

Is the SPMA even useful on the normal version of that map? Outside of the whole "hey demo kiddies check this out" aspect of the map's vehicle selection, the SPMA is practically useless due to the fact there's too many obstacles. Plus the main traffic area is fairly narrow which further limits the SPMA's usefulness.

Poker · Mar 20, 2009

Dark Pulse said:
FuLLBLeeD said:

UT3's vehicle balance is also much better overall than 2k4's.

Click to expand...

It is... until you get those Axon vs. Necris maps. Those are always a farce.

Indeed. Although I also suspect this is due to poorly chosen vehicle selections by the LDs (for which btw Suspense Necris has set the new wtf record).

I think by now it should be a consensus that at least in the hands of players of any appreciable skill, the Necris vehicles are pound-for-pound more powerful than Axons, Levi excluded. Which is fine, but for some reason the LD of each Ax/Nec map seems locked into the notion that there has to be a 1-to-1 pairing of vehicles per side, which IMO is precisely what phuxup the balance in those maps. Giving the Axon side just one extra Hellbender or Manta or whatever would be just the trick in many cases.

I like many of the alternative ideas here for Suspense Necris also ... two Nemi and a DW is just silly in terms of how much high powered hitscan dominance it gives blue, and I agree that one of the Nemis could have well been replaced with two Scavs. Paladin would have been a great add too. Gol-Rap-Pal-Scorp-Manta-Spma vs DW-Fury-Nemi-Scav-Scav-Viper ... that seems much more equitable.

Plutonia_Experi · Mar 21, 2009

Poker said:
Indeed. Although I also suspect this is due to poorly chosen vehicle selections by the LDs (for which btw Suspense Necris has set the new wtf record).

I think by now it should be a consensus that at least in the hands of players of any appreciable skill, the Necris vehicles are pound-for-pound more powerful than Axons, Levi excluded. Which is fine, but for some reason the LD of each Ax/Nec map seems locked into the notion that there has to be a 1-to-1 pairing of vehicles per side, which IMO is precisely what phuxup the balance in those maps. Giving the Axon side just one extra Hellbender or Manta or whatever would be just the trick in many cases.

I like many of the alternative ideas here for Suspense Necris also ... two Nemi and a DW is just silly in terms of how much high powered hitscan dominance it gives blue, and I agree that one of the Nemis could have well been replaced with two Scavs. Paladin would have been a great add too. Gol-Rap-Pal-Scorp-Manta-Spma vs DW-Fury-Nemi-Scav-Scav-Viper ... that seems much more equitable.

Vehicles are balanced to fight among each other in the battlefield.
They are not required to be balanced with the other faction's counterpart!

Some maps are flawed, I agree. I've already said in another thread that Suspence-Necris is a joke. Nemesis are really powerful, they should be balanced with tanks ! Also the particularity of the map is people standing on the bridges raining down avrils and other stuff; as the Nemesis is the only vehicle able to resist these attacks, becomes a lot more useful than a tank. Goliath just get destroyed by avrils or air attacks, while nemesis can 0wn both things.

You said: Gol-Rap-Pal-Scorp-Manta-Spma vs DW-Fury-Nemi-Scav-Scav-Viper and i agree it would be balanced.
Or it could be more interesting with:
Gol-Rap-Rap-Scorp-Manta vs DW-Nemesis-Nemesis-Scav
And that would be air-superiority vs hitscan dominance (the bridges full of Avrils will advantage Necris side).

Another map that is stupidly unbalanced is Onyxcoast.
And that is, simply because there are 2Manta vs 2Vipers+Fury.

Epic has this strange idea that the Levia is powerful, while in reality it's just scrap metal.

Plutonia_Experi · Mar 21, 2009

N1ghtmare said:
Because it was slow moving it rarely ever hit anything; skilled enough players could easily dodge the bola and/or then dodge jump over the scorpion if it tried to rush the player. It was at most a decent transport. The new scorpion is much more deadly and feasible as an offensive weapon.

Not to mention that Manta driver now dies instantly, while with the UT2004 the green web left plenty of time for him to jump out and 0wn the scorpio on foot. Just use shock rifle to bounce it back, or hey, in UT2004 you can kill a scopio with a single Avril (if you know the trick).

GreatEmerald · Mar 22, 2009

Yea, the Leviathan with 1 person in it is useless. Stinger shards never hit anything and have a particularly high spread, while when deployed, all enemies have plenty of time to avoid you (plus your gun rotates like a snail).

N1ghtmare · Mar 22, 2009

Plutonia_Experi said:
Epic has this strange idea that the Levia is powerful, while in reality it's just scrap metal.

It is powerful when everyone on the team uses the turrets. The same can be applied to the Cicada and the Hellbender. They are only effective if everyone occupies the other seats, which never happens.

GreatEmerald · Mar 22, 2009

N1ghtmare said:
if everyone occupies the other seats, which never happens.

Quoted For Truth

LivingPuppet · Mar 24, 2009

Plutonia_Experi said:
Another map that is stupidly unbalanced is Onyxcoast.
And that is, simply because there are 2Manta vs 2Vipers+Fury.

Epic has this strange idea that the Levia is powerful, while in reality it's just scrap metal.

Idk, from the online games I've played in Onyx it seems almost about even between the 2 sides winning a game but a poorly manned Levi can result in the Axon's quick demise. It isn't perfect but it probably the best Axon vs. Necris map out there.

With regards to balance you can't get worse than the necris version of Islander, that map is pure lol.

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UT3 is the best of the series

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