Weapon switch speed

[Dark Pulse]

Meh. You can't directly compare them. UT3's rockets are more powerful and travel faster, and the lack of a dodge-jump makes them that much harder to dodge (and ends up making them overpowered). UT2004's are slower, less powerful, and much easier to avoid, so it's wise to not rely on them. The result is UT3 is a rocket spam fest while UT2004 is a pew-pew fest.

10 extra damage. It's not that much, but it does ensure a rocket to the face is something to be wary of. It's also quite a bit less than UT's 112. And in UT2004, rockets were damn near useless at any sort of distance and incredibly easy to avoid - TOO easy. That's why the lock-on radius was tightened, though removal of dodgejump might amplify that. Still, it takes the rockets from "not so useful" to "considerably useful", which they should be, because after all, they're ****ing rockets.

UT3's being a "spam fest" is also helped by the maps being smaller and more realistically scaled, which is pretty much a parallel of 2kx's maps being huge, wide open, and ideal for hitscan. It's like Vanilla and Chocolate.

Difference is, again, you can actually dodge the spam...

 

[Sir_Brizz]

The problem is, people got in the habit in UT2004 of never dying even once a whole match unless they made some grave mistake. Now that you actually can't survive that long, they whine. I shouldn't say that's the only reason though, no matter what would have changed people would have whined about it. If it were closer to UT2004? People would have whined. Closer to UT2003? People would have whined. Closer to Unreal? Whining. And it's closer to UT and people whine.

Personally, I found the weapon switch speed in UT2003 the most entertaining. In UT2004 I was so used to UT2003 that it just really aggravated me. In UT3, it's completely new, so I've just readjusted to it.

 

[Lostsoul]

I found the Rox to be incredible useful in 2k4 and I probably ranked as #2 in all of my kills.

 

[Renegade Retard]

It's a lot less fun.

That's one opinion, though certainly not shared by all.

 

[JohnDoe641]

That's one opinion, though certainly not shared by all.

Indeed, since you know, we had a full server for most of the night yesterday. Apparently not EVERYONE hates the game.

 

[Rujman]

It takes 3 seconds to switch away from the rocket launcher? wow I musta missed that!

Sorry my hyperbole wasn't hyperbolized enough.

 

[Rujman]

But it also really effs with weapon combos and potentially cool frags. There is no more bouncing someone with rockets/flak and then picking them off with sniper in midair. It doesn't work anymore because the switch is too slow. You pick a weapon and spam it until the other guy's dead.

This. I really miss cool frags. There's just no art in killing in this game, and that sadly takes a lot from the experience.

 

[-AEnubis-]

The weapon switch speed is in line with the gravity, air control, and average over all weapon damage.

You're not going to switch to snipe after jumping someone up in the air with a rocket, because the odds of you hitting him are tiny anyways. If you shoot them up too high, they are just going to strafe down at some ridiculous angle, and you landing a shot will be 50/50 luck.

As well, since rockets do a full 100 damage now, you usually kill with one or two, and if you don't, you're rarely leaving them low enough to warrant switching to link, or stinger anyways to finish, because they probably have enough armor another rocket is warranted.

The only weapon I really try to switch away from is snipe, and I find it's rarely worth it.

The overall weapon damage I think is the larger factor though. If you have that much damage you can quickly do, you should pay for not choosing the right method of delivering that damage ahead of time. Before, you could change guns faster on the fly, but you had to be hitting with all of them, and a fair amount, so the switch was just a small hiccup that could really only determine the out come of two more evenly matched opponents.

Now, because things happen so fast, and damage so big, you gotta go in to a fire fight with the right choice of weapon to really streak with it. It can be just as satisfying IMO.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

It's really just a different strategy you have to employ. It's been made quite obvious that people don't want to learn the skills associated with a game and would rather modify it to be what they want instead over the years.

 

[MonsOlympus]

Yeah either that or theyd be happier finger painting then playing UT3, I could give two ****s how I kill someone as long as they ****en stay down.

There are fast weapon switch mutators out there, so perhaps people should try those out and give some feedback on the timing instead of bitching... Oh what do you know I even made one myself even though Im happy with the stock switch speeds

 

[Rujman]

Unless they're popular, mutators are very weak solutions.

 

[unbecoming]

It's slow so the game can be made easier by eliminating weapon switching nearly altogether,because choosing the right weapon combinations per battle situation is just too hard for mainstreamers.

Multiple weapon frags (combo kills) are just about out in UT3.Epic deemed it too complicated for Johnny so they made that if u try multi-wep battles with UT3 you will take at least one hit while waiting on the long change.This encourages you to stick with one per battle which is retarded or just boring.

Weapon balance can be achieved without killing the speed like they did.Another thing they did to make the game easier imo.Like many of their other ideas it did nothing but slow once was the fastest shooter out there.

Flak was also made easier.Now u can just walk around chucking balls instead of actually having to lift your crosshair up (I like to call that aiming) to achieve that arc like in 2k4.

Watered down walldodges,huge bio secondary,no bio multi-kills,larger splash damage radii,huge hitboxes,and so on.Seems a pattern had developed and many of those made the game easier and took some fun with it.

Pulls fire extinguisher closer.

 

[UBerserker]

I ended up using the Shock Rifle in UT2k4 to pew-pew everyone. Really entertaining.

 

[MonsOlympus]

Unless they're popular, mutators are very weak solutions.

Well then dont play the game, its that ****en simple! Epic's not going to change the switch speed, especially after the game is already released duh!

What solution would you suggest? bitching about it on forums?

Honestly I think you got it though, fast weapon switch isnt popular, I havent seen any server running my mutator which to me suggest people like the game just how it is

Watered down walldodges,

Youre kidding right? I actually though wall dodging took more skill now because it has an apex!

 

[Tweakd]

Seen this CPM?

This encourages you to stick with one per battle which is retarded or just boring.

Couldn't agree more. It doesn't do anything for the gameplay Time to get experimenting

 

[Renegade Retard]

Differences of opinion.

Where you say that it takes more still to quickly switch weapons to get combo kills (are we playing Soul Caliber?), I call it less skill to have to rely on fast switching for your kills.

Where you say that using one weapon for a kill is boring, I way that it takes greater skill to play your kill ahead of time to know which weapon to use in the upcoming situation. Enter a firefight for the right weapon for the fight, then live to plan out the right weapon for the next fight.

Again, differences of opinion.

 

[MonsOlympus]

oh riiight all we have to do is add 'competitive' in the mutator name to make it hardcore, cause we dont like all that other mainstream bull****. Goes to show how narrow minded the competitive community can be at times

Oh well sounds like an interesting mutator, even if all it does is adjust the gameplay and not add features I would expect from a competitive mutator

Differences of opinion.

Where you say that it takes more still to quickly switch weapons to get combo kills (are we playing Soul Caliber?), I call it less skill to have to rely on fast switching for your kills.

Where you say that using one weapon for a kill is boring, I way that it takes greater skill to play your kill ahead of time to know which weapon to use in the upcoming situation. Enter a firefight for the right weapon for the fight, then live to plan out the right weapon for the next fight.

Again, differences of opinion.

I couldnt agree more, it leaves more room for error. One thing I saw very commonly in 2k4 was the old lightning gun, shock double tap and if the person wasnt dead by then the flak ball. It allows people to switch to which ever weapon suits that distance of fighting much easier without any forethought. Having the right weapon out before you need it is a skill indeed and suddenly being able to swap from rox to shock etc because you ****ed up should leave you at a disadvantage!

 

[Leo(T.C.K.)]

I didn't like the weapon switch speed in ut2004, as sir brizz said ut2003 perhaps had it better because of the overall faster pace of the game, which fit it much more than to ut2k4 deathmatch, hence why it was so boring in there.
UT3 speed feels ok contrary to everything else in there. The pace is faster than ut2k4 of the game I think, some things are slow like when you get shot down into floor etc or perhaps the weapon speed, but that also is some a bit of evolution in the UT genre, it can't be still the same.

 

[Dark Pulse]

Multiple weapon frags (combo kills) are just about out in UT3.Epic deemed it too complicated for Johnny so they made that if u try multi-wep battles with UT3 you will take at least one hit while waiting on the long change.This encourages you to stick with one per battle which is retarded or just boring.

The funny thing is, it seems to be nearly entirely only the people who started UT with 200x that think this is THAT big of an issue to complain about.

Also, how many of these combos don't involve shock or lightning? Odds are very few. Shooting a guy up in the air with rockets and then pegging him with one of two weapons can only be so entertaining so many times.

Frags can still be good without even having weapons like this. Look at a game like Team Fortress 2, where a good Soldier is considered SKILL. Here, it's just spam. This is despite the fact that, much like UT3, 1-2 good rockets will put most classes right on their back.

PS: If you really care all that much over not being able to kill someone as artistically as you like, you're probably playing the wrong game. As Mons said, who gives a **** as long as they're nice and dead. Are real sports about doing it in the most fancy way impossible? In American Football, do you see running backs take 3 laps around the field before scoring touchdowns? Do kickers make sure the football bounces off the uprights? In Basketball, is every shot taken from Half-Court? Does every team pass like the Harlem Globetrotters?

Those teams play the game to win. They could care less HOW they win, generally, as long as they win. It seems far too many people have forgotten to simply play to win and instead have to kill their opponents in the most artistic way possible, so that they can impress their friends... it's sad.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

I certainly think there is some entertainment value in faster weapon switching, but I think it is silly to think that a more UT game (that we were promised form day one with UT3) would have that kind of feature to it. UT was never about switching up your weapons as much as possible, that was something that UT200X added.

What I'm getting at is that this is just "another thing" for some people to find "wrong" with the game, rather than something that is actually a problem or makes the game more boring.