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UT 3.5 (no trolls allowed)

Discussion in 'Unreal Tournament 3' started by RoninMastaFX, Feb 11, 2008.

  1. RoninMastaFX

    RoninMastaFX Unreal/UT Vet from Day 1

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    @Anuban
    I apologize. I'll try to keep my cool next time as best as possible. :)

    @Everyone
    Btw, I have slightly modifed the list, three of the suggestions are now highted with the word "Questionable" in brackets in the colour red. Those suggestions might make it to UT3.5, others will have a very high chance of being fixed or added in UT3.5. :)

     
  2. Anuban

    Anuban Your reward is that you are still alive

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    No need to apologize man ... though I appreciate it I already knew you weren't attacking me and you see I didn't get offended at all. You would know if I were upset or had been offended by what you said .. believe me and ask anyone around here or the Epic boards. I am not shy about defending myself when I believe I have been unfairly attacked. :)
     
  3. Trynant

    Trynant Manic Brawler

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    For UT3.5, if there was to be one, I'd love to see a full-fledged new gametype. Possibly the new full-fledged gametype being "Singleplayer" maps. I say that in quotes because a cooperative experience would be excellent to an incredible degree.
     
  4. T2A`

    T2A` I'm dead.

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    Fun facts concerning armor and high-power weaponry!

    Armor doesn't absorb the same amount of damage, which you probably knew already. Going from belt, vest, pads, and helmet, there give 100%, 75%, 50%, and 50% damage absorption respectively. However, what you probably didn't know is how little protection this actually gives you.

    Unless my calculations are flawed (which they may be), flak does something like 186 damage for a point-blank shot where all the shards hit. Besides, many weapons can do that kind of damage at once. Rockets have a maximum of 300ish, combos are around 200, and the goo is 206 or somewhere thereabout.

    That means if you have 100 health, having the vest, the pads, and the helmet and getting hit something that does 186 damage will still kill you! 100 health + 100 armor = death!

    Maybe I'm wrong, but here's what I think happens (haven't gone through the "take damage" code to verify yet):

    • To start, you've got 100 health, 100 shield, and we're taking 186 damage.
    • We don't have the belt so it can't take in that damage.
    • The vest is worth 50 armor points and absorbs 75% of that. 100 health - (50 * .75) = 87.5 health left.
    • The pads are worth 30 armor points and absorb 50% of that. 87.5 health - (30 * .5) = 72.5 health left.
    • The helmet is worth 20 armor points and absorbs 50% of that. 72.5 health - (20 * .5) = 62.5 health left.
    • Now, there's still 86 damage the flak has yet to deal, we we're left with 62.5 health - 86 damage = -23.5 health = death.
    See? 100 health + three of the four armor pieces and you still die! In fact, getting hit with only 163.5 damage at once is your only chance of survival (with 1 health).

    Conversely, having only the belt would leave you alive with 14 health (or 36.5 in the case of 163.5 damage instead of 186)! For this reason, UT3 1v1 is dominated by shield belt camping because it is head over heels better and more worthwhile than the other armor pieces! Even if you control all three but the belt, the other guy is still probably in a better position armor-wise than you. You may get more vials than him, but he's still got the easier job.

    So, yeah, I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that the weapons are a tad overpowered or the armor is underpowered. :p

    Also, I found this humorous.

    Code:
    /** GetShieldStrength()
    returns total armor value currently held by this pawn ([B]not including helmet[/B]).
    */
    function int GetShieldStrength()
    {
    	return ShieldBeltArmor + VestArmor + ThighpadArmor + [B]HelmetArmor[/B];
    }
    :)
     
  5. Anuban

    Anuban Your reward is that you are still alive

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    You are not taking into account that with all armor on you have 200 armor and if you have gone around and picked up either super health or bunches of vials you can still get to 199 health so 199 health and 200 armor = you can survive pretty much any handheld weapon (except IG of course) ... even 3 Rockets. Now obviously this isn't possible on all maps since not all maps have all the armor pickups but it just shows that you can still stay alive and the armor is not useless. Far from it. Plus on skill settings below Skilled the damage done is greater for the user and less for the bots. But even on Skilled and Adept I have survived a point blank Flak Cannon blast with 170 armor and 130 health ... I usually always have at least 130 health at all times on maps with health vials.
     
  6. T2A`

    T2A` I'm dead.

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    It's just an example! D:

    UT2004 had a similar issue due to varying absorption rates. 50 or less was 50%, 51-100 was 75%, and 101-150 was 100%. This meant the 50a wasn't all that great but 150 was awesome. Constant absorption rates (a la Q3) eliminate this problem.

    Remember, it's not the armor count that matters, it's health! This gives another advantage to the belt because even if you have 1 health and grab it, it's just like having 101 health. 1 health and 100 armor via the other pieces means you die no matter what hits you. :)
     
  7. RoninMastaFX

    RoninMastaFX Unreal/UT Vet from Day 1

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    I have updated the list, and gave it more of a reality check for the kind folks at Epic. :)

     
  8. RoninMastaFX

    RoninMastaFX Unreal/UT Vet from Day 1

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    I edited one of my posts from Page 2 of this thread, and I part of the edited version talks about something that Epic may want to read. A little bit of advice, and compilmetns from me, to you. :)

    That is all. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2008
  9. Anuban

    Anuban Your reward is that you are still alive

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    Only thing I would say to that is I don't think we the gamers rushed Epic at all ... they were other games around (CoD4 and the Orange Box mainly as well as Crysis and Gears PC) that would have tidied over most of us a bit longer while Epic polished it and released it around the same time this latest patched version will be ready. I think the culprit here is Midway being worried about their sales year and how poorly it had gone so far with Stranglehold and Blacksite basically failing and that WWII shooter they had that was complete trash which also bombed ... so they figured that UT3 could save their bad year and they pushed Epic to get it out and there was just nothing Epic could do. If only they could self-publish we would never have this kind of issue. They would be closer to Valve's model and we see how well that worked in terms of game quality. There is a reason it took HL2 6 years to come out and even now when it is years old people are still loving it on the PC and the Xbox 360 (I forget if it is on the PS3 as well).
     
  10. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    We did rush Epic, we wanted them to release the demo last spring. Well, as much as we can rush anyone. I don't think Epic released UT3 when they did out of love for the community. I'm sure it was more for business reasons than anything.
     
  11. Godfrey.Payans

    Godfrey.Payans Member

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    Very interesting. Someone should do a series of these. I'm not sure why someone at A isn't prey for a sniper, secondary flak, or rockets, but I'm crap at the game.
     
  12. B

    B Bee

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    Because by the time someone fires anything at the player on point A he or she will have a combo in his/her face. (that is if there is a good player at point A.)
    Removing the bars going to the minigun might solve this. As it is now it's way too easy to camp the shieldbelt.
     

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