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Unreal Tournament 2007 Preview

Discussion in 'News & Articles' started by hal, Jan 5, 2006.

  1. SimplyCosmic

    SimplyCosmic ERGO. VIS A VIS. CONCORDANTLY.

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    That quote strikes me as an incorrect assumption.

    If anything, I'd make the claim that UT2003's biggest fault was that it was "more of the same" deathmatch gameplay, all in a gaming world that had already started to grow to include team goal-based gameplay such as presented by games like Battlefield 1942. One of the biggest complaints against UT2003, in fact, was that it no longer included Unreal Tournament's Assault gameplay mode.

    I strongly believe that both Doom III and Quake IV have shown that, outside of Counterstrike, online players aren't drawn to old-school deathmatch in the ways that they used to be.

    So, no, I disagree with Shacknews. I do not believe that a "focus on multiplayer deathmatch competition" will give UT2007 success.

    If you really look at what Epic is saying about the game, even in that same article, they seem to agree.

    Deathmatch (and even CTF) are great fun, and should never be completely eliminated, but they should only be one of several features any future Unreal Tournament offering should have.
     
  2. T2A`

    T2A` I'm dead.

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    That may or may not be true, but you're basing that off of the worst DM games ever created on the worst engine any company has every released.

    Note: I may be exaggerating slightly for effect.

    The point is still the same, though. D3 and Q4 have bad MP and are running on a bad engine. Maybe the community has shunned DM as of late because the games that are based on DM aren't good. Given that most games nowadays have moved away from "killing is the only way to win," it would be very stupid of Epic not to include "other" forms of entertainment with gametypes like ONS. That shouldn't, in my opinion, be their focus, because that's not what UT was founded on. Of all the complaints I've heard about UT2003/4, the one that pops up the most is, "Waaah, I suck at this game because it's all long-range combat with lightning guns and shock rifles and I wish it were more like UT so I could hide my lack of skill behind a barrage of rocket fire and flak spam!" Bringing UT3 back to the feeling of the original UT probably won't draw in too many new players, but it doesn't have to - ONS, whatever that other new gametype is, and the graphics will do that (and their piss-poor marketing strategies). Bringing back "real" DM will help the community by bringing back those players who turned away from UT when the nature of the game changed in UT2003, and it will help the longevity of the game. Right now there's a pretty distinct and unbreakable line between TDM/CTF players and ONS/VCTF players, and it really shouldn't be that way.
     
  3. hal

    hal Dictator Staff Member

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    While I applaud Epic for trying the vehicle-based gametypes, I think there's still an audience for a quality DM/CTF game. Just add UT2004 and UT gamers and you've got a decent sized base. Throw in a few others from [ insert failed series here ] and you've got a reasonably good sized community.
     
  4. EggBoy

    EggBoy New Member

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    heh, but I still think the way to really make UT popular is set it in Iraq or WWII with current military weapons and all of the noobs will look at the box with Malcom wearing cammo and holding an M4 and say "wow this looks so awesome and realistic!" and buy it and tell all their noob friends LOL ;P
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2006
  5. edhe

    edhe ..dadhe..

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    SC has the point, and made it well.
     
  6. MuLuNGuS

    MuLuNGuS New Member

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    it takes some time 2 make a quality game, especially with a complete new tech.
    i can't understand these "damn i can't wait release it now" statements, when it's done @Dezember 2006 then it's done @Dezember 2006 not earlier not later.
     
  7. hal

    hal Dictator Staff Member

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    It's all relative though. What is a success? I think uniting the Unreal community and growing it by a modest percentage could be considered a success. While I admit that the "classic" game modes no longer dominate the interest of the casual gamer, there is a solid niche there to be won. It hasn't been done exceptionally well in a long time.

    Developing larger scale combat in the same game is a mistake if it compromises the integrity of the niche core. Then you just end up gaining only parts of both audiences... a lot like UT2004. There are inherent balance problems with the weapons, movement, and netcode when trying to please both the vehicle/warfare and "classics" crowd.
     
  8. KDR_11k

    KDR_11k [make art]

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    Turn2Ashes: I wouldn't call the Doom 3 engine bad, it's just too advanced. If any UE3.0 game was made to run on the same range of PCs as Doom 3 it would look just as bad. The biggest issue is that normalmapping is slow and gets worse with more lights so games have to be dark. Normalmapping is pretty much at the level that 3d was at with the PS1: It's possible but very limited and doesn't look as good as what was before it. At least yet, it will become better in a few years when PCs are powerful enough and the new consoles hit full swing.
     
  9. Plumb_Drumb

    Plumb_Drumb yumb

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    well honestly, DM is the core of every gametype.
    If fragging sucks, then the whole game would suck.

    They should focus on that, then build around it.
    ________
    Headshops
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2011
  10. edhe

    edhe ..dadhe..

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    Yes, and build a game that will compete and that people want to play.

    Not much point in having fantastic DM components if they're not used in a way that people want to play.
     
  11. Pxtl

    Pxtl Lord of the Files

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    Hover boards with grapples?

    YT approves of grapples on hoverboards. Whoever keeps thinking "Back to the Future" needs to read more Stephenson. I hope that hovers allow you to use your hand firearms - a problem that bugged me in UT was how all the vehicles overrided the player's weapons - even modded ones like the StrangeLove, where using the good old fashioned shock rifle or rocket launcher would be much nicer than the simple vehicle weapons.

    As for "warfare" - it sounds like it involves multiple games of AS and ONS. This sounds like one of those "takes hours to play a single round" games - fun for tourneys and LAN parties, not fun for casual online play in pubs.
     
  12. Plumb_Drumb

    Plumb_Drumb yumb

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    true.
    ________
    Web shows
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2011
  13. edhe

    edhe ..dadhe..

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    The hoverboard/hook are instead of using a gun at the time, otherwise you'd be flying about faster than infantry and able to blow away vehicles with ease.

    Ever thought about balance?
     
  14. Selerox

    Selerox COR AD COR LOQVITVR

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    He screwed up. End of story.

    He said that to a community that was in a state of near-frenzy over a possible demo release. A community who were going to grab hold of any implied statement as pure fact. Suprise suprise, the community took the ball and ran with it.

    Fair enough, it wasn't technically an inaccurate statement, but it was badly worded, misleading and thoughily ill thought out. Saying something is "more than two weeks away" when he knew that it was months away was true PR incompetance that was bound to insult and annoy the community, and guess what? It did.

    Besides that, Mark Rein should have known damn well that UT2003 was months away from release, yet he somehow thought that a post E3 demo was a possibility, something that was complee fiction. That suggest that mark Rein didn't have a clue as to what was actually going on in his own company as to the development of the game. A general rule of thumb in situations like that is don't say anything if you don't know. Unless you know about the exact information, you don't guess, and you don't speculate, not unless you genuinely do know the likely release date. Sadly, Mark Rein couldn't keep his egotisical mouth shut and made put his foot in it quite spectactularly.

    No matter the explicit phrase he used, no matter if it was deliberate or just incompetance, it didn't (and doesn't) make Mark Rein look anything other than an embarressment.

    I'm not against adding stff to the game, far from it, I think that the new gametypes have definitly added to the game's appeal. What I am against is taking away things from the game. Keep what works, drop what doesn't and add new stuff that will add to the game as a whole.

    I think one of UT2003's main problems was not that it was nessesarily simply "more of the same", but that it was "more of the same" and at the same time very poorly made. If it had had the design quality of the original it would have been a much bigger success.

    I think the mention of the concentration on the orthodox gametypes of DM/TDM/CTF has more to do with fixing the core gameplay. The basic mechanics of player vs player cambat are the core of UT, the rest of the game simply adds to that. Take a look at ONS, a lot of the combat around nodes is still dependant on player vs player combat. UT200x's core gameplay mechanis have a lot of flaws (mainly inherited from UT2003), if Ut2007 fixes those by adding more of the proven gameplay of UT99 (as well as adding new features and styles to the gameplay), then the entire gameplay experience will be improved, including the vehicular gametypes.

    I think the addition of the upxdate ONS and the new gametype (whatever the hell they end up calling it) can only help UT's appeal. I just hope they don't remove anything to make that happen.
     
  15. Pxtl

    Pxtl Lord of the Files

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    I wasn't meaning specifically the hoverboard had to allow players to use their rifles - just that having any vehicles that did would be nice - for example, the turrets on the Levi would've been much nicer as normal guns.

    Alternately, the hover board could allow use of rifles only when ungrappled. Something like that. Anything.

    And it's not like vehicles are well-balanced anyways. Try fighting a tank at long range on open ground with any land vehicle or infantry other than a levi. Vehicles have to be balanced carefully specifically to the map no matter what - their nature is unbalanced, and it's up to the mapper to make sure that they don't screw up the gameplay with that unbalance.
     
  16. Caravaggio

    Caravaggio Custom User Text goes here.

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    "the new hoverboard is quickly becoming a play test favorite. Instead of your trusty rocket launcher, hoverboard riders have a grapple that they can use to latch onto other vehicles. It's quite a sight to see a Hellbender towing three hoverboard riding teammates into the fray behind it."

    I am SO starting a ROCKET JOCKEY mod!
     
  17. Pxtl

    Pxtl Lord of the Files

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    Nice

    Good classic. Nothing like surf music, aviator hats, and beating other racers to death by dragging them from a vehicle with the mass-to-power ratio of a hand grenade.
     
  18. T2A`

    T2A` I'm dead.

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    Yeah, it's advanced if having no such entity representing a static mesh and no high-res textures constitutes having an advanced engine. D3 engine is all lighting; it has no other detail anywhere else. Without the lighting, which makes up the bump mapping, that engine looks as good (or bad) as Q2. Well, I guess it also has a decent particle system, but whatever. The engine is bad. Just because something runs poorly doesn't mean it's advanced. I'm sure UE3 will run slowly on quite a few people's systems, but the difference is in what's there. In UE3 there will be lush environments and tons of detail. In D3 there's some flat, square rooms with a bunch of faked detail done totally by bump mapping.

    As far as the hoverboard is concerned, there's no reason to believe Epic haven't thought to put limitations on how many players each vehakal can tow. Naturally, a lightweight like the manta shouldn't be able to drag the whole team around, and I'm certain they won't have overlooked this. Have some faith, people. :p
     
  19. R.Flagg

    R.Flagg New Member

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    Actually, it's only because the weapons wouldn't work while on the HB. But the grapple would..., so that's what they're doing.

    "Balance' had nothing to do with it.
     

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