Sniper Camping

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MorphineAlien

Galactic Junky
Mar 17, 2001
65
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Any player that uses a bug to win is a "Low rent CHEATER", and they should have their spleen gouged out with a plastic fork.
 

BlueSniper

if today was yesterday, what's tomarrow?
Mar 6, 2001
1,283
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I must speak

I am the sniper of all snipers. but I'm NOT the camper of all campers. I would consider myself a walking armory. I have waited over 20mins in one spot on EP. I think that sniping takes skill, camping does not.

One of my favorite quotes from me:
"to aim is one. To wait is annother. To snipe is both."

You see; Sniping isnt all about hitting a target from a distance, Its a form of art. a good sniper will NEVER give away his/her position willingly. a good sniper not only hides from vision, but hides from hearing.

a sniper w/ a grenade launcher is using a wide spread wepon, hes giving away his location more and more after every shot. it doesent require ANY aiming skills. that is what you call a camper.
 

itskeiagain

Adept
Mar 12, 2001
1,119
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Although I'm for snipers camping, I seem to have made a wrong comment "jokingly" calling snipers 'campers' in my original post. I'm trying not to call camping snipers "campers" as they are not the same.
However, if a sniper can take out the whole platoon without changing the position at all, that's just as good as moving after each kill.

I thought the term "camper" was used for those who do NOT wish to fight, and hide in corners until the game's over. Those grenadiers hiding and waiting for opportunity to kill is a valid tactics, and I wouldn't like to call them "campers".
 

vincenzo_og

teh INFlirtationist
Apr 2, 2001
185
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UK>Scotland>Hell
so are u all sayin that sitting in a strategic position with a wide view is good, but sitting at an easily defencabe position with a limeited killing ground is bad?!
Both are fine sniping and camping are different and neither term is and insult.

The only bone anybody has wiht snipers/campers is when one round takes way to long and neihter (when there are 2 left) does anythin.
I dont even mind sittin out for agaes as long as my team wins the round... i dont like havin to play the round over and over because of thecountdown.
 

SoSilencer

Harry Goz (1932 - 2003)
Nov 27, 2000
834
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unrealdev.net
I agree that anyone who purposely exploits a bug to be a cheater and I treat them as such. Although I'm against TK I have no trouble doing it to somebody who is playing unfairly by exploiting bugs. Whether it's purposely hiding behind something that makes you invisible, consistantly firing 40mm grenades closer than 46 feet, or exploiting any of the other bugs, your cheating plain and simple and don't get mad if people start complaining or killing you.

About sniping... I think there is one major problem in INF right now. You could be the best sniper in the game. You can quickly and covertly get to an amazing spot that provides you a huge field of view and provides the enemy with virtually nothing. You can take out an entire group of enemies and never be seen or heard (luckily 2.86 will fix sound ranges). Next game you go back to the same spot only this time you are killed with a strafed 40mm grenade because one of the people you killed found you while flying around in ghost mode.

Sure some people will say "just think of it as a spy plane". I say what if your in a building? Or under a tree or bush? How does the spy plane see you then? You would be invisible. The enemies on the ground didn't see you and a spy plane sure as hell isn't going to see you either unless it's using infrared or other such technolgies, and you know what? Although I'm no expert I'm pretty sure they don't dedicate each 6-12 man squad with a high tech spyplane cus if they did they could just send up a c130 gunship and have them take out the enemies with the gun on the side. It's accurate enough so why not? Cus there are no spy panes or support to begin with.

Until they remove the free-fly ghost cam (you should always be stuck to a living teammate) finding a good sniper spot just isn't worth it. All the time and effect spent both finding and getting into that spot is lost as soon as the first enemy flies around and finds you.
 

Luminuis

Herald of the Newest Dawn
Silencer, I agree, the free-floating ghost cam is a bunch of horse ****, but then again so is being pinned to one teamate, why not remove the whole thing and make you be forced to watch in one direction untill your body disapears, then once it does so you only get a black screen, in real life dead people don't become ghosts and find out info for the next battle.
 
Mar 19, 2001
731
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San Diego, CA
How would you know, have you ever died? I personally think the ghost cam should be taken out and you should be locked into first person view of your teamates. That way there is no way you can give away something they dont already know.
 

Nanodragon

I love you Lord Daftwager
Feb 24, 2001
33
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Why is shooting a 40MM grenade at someone at less than 46 feet a cheat? What would happen in real life if you did that? I don't do it on purpose, but it happens to me very often...
If someone gets hit in the face by a 40MM grenade, it wouldn't be good for his health, not even in real live...
Dragonfly
 

SoSilencer

Harry Goz (1932 - 2003)
Nov 27, 2000
834
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unrealdev.net
All the information I've seen says that in real life the arming distance of the 40mm grenades used in INF are 14-27 or 14-34m (give or take on the max arming distance). Currently in INF 40mm grenades arm between 10 and 20 feet. This means if you run into a building and fire a grenade at the far wall it will almost always explode. This of course kills anyone in that half of the room. In real life such a shot would bounce off the wall and do nothing but put a small dent in the drywall.

People make mistakes but when somebody consistantly fires grenades well within the 14m (roughly 46ft I believe) it's quite obvious they are purposely doing so. Since the arming range is obviously a bug anyone who repeatedly fires at close range is exploiting a bug and I consider that cheating. It's the same as the invisible-player-in-window and other bugs of that nature. If it happens every once in a while it's an understandable accident, it happens to everyone at times, but if somebody goes back ot the same invisible location time after time even after you've pointed out they are invisible there and other locations nearby which provide the same cover without any bugs than there is no explination but the person purposely exploiting bugs to benefit their game (ie cheating).
 

Uppity

New Member
Apr 17, 2001
454
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NE England (We hang monkeys)
Visit site
Originally posted by Hadmar
"number one rule of not being seen in inf. find a waist high ledge and crouch behind it. even if it's in the open, no one wil see you. try to take advantage of it now before 2.86"

"hehehe that's a good tip LB"

No, it isn't.
Abuse of a bug is equal to cheating. I was killed many times by guys who where not "there" as I checked the area bevore I moved in. It just sucks. Don't do it.

Can somebody please explain this bug to me? Does crouching behind a wall make you invisible or something?

I'm not asking because I want to exploit it - just the exact opposite. A strange thing happened to me last night on EP and I was wondering if I was unintentionally using this bug. Basically I was at the battlementy bits in EP, crouching behind the wall with my RC.50 and and enemy ran straight past me (and behind) without firing. I guessed that he must have got the uniforms confused (both green-ish) so I thought 'I'll let him go - it wouldn't be nice to pop him in the back after he's so blatently let me live.

But a few minutes later he was still hanging around the battlementy bits (but a bit further along and out of my sight) as I came up behind hime while I was changing my position. Couldn't resist it so I shot him in the back.

Question. Was I cheating? What happens when you crouch behind a waist hight wall? I just don't want to be accused of cheating as I often crouch rather then prone as I am scouting around for targets or getting into position.

Uppity
 

DredDamo

New Member
Nov 30, 2000
591
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www.damodred.net
The 'visible distance' in Unreal is being drawn from waist to waist. If someone crouches behind a waist-high obstacle, the 'line of sight' that is drawn from an observer's waist to the crouching guy's waist becomes obstructed and the object (the crouched guy) is not drawn.

This is indeed a bug and some people exploit it. However, there's no way of being able to tell if you're being drawn or not, so I figure anyone that runs by is fair game...you can always apologize and mention the fact that you just can't know. I found an apology cools tempers...

I think it's very high on the priority list of the INF team, if not already fixed (I forget).

Damodred
 

Hadmar

Queen Bitch of the Universe
Jan 29, 2001
5,557
42
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Nerdpole
I heard it's fixed in 2.86.
And it not only happens when you crouch, but also when you stand e.g. behind the Sandbag walls(right word?) on Sicily for some time. I saw people dissapear before my eyes as ghost.

And all of you extreme-realism fans don't care about the bouncing grenade issue?
The reason, why I posted this here is that it's not mentioned in Warren's Weekly Update.
Still not interested?
 

SoSilencer

Harry Goz (1932 - 2003)
Nov 27, 2000
834
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unrealdev.net
Uppity I don't know about anyone else but I wouldn't consider that cheating. Like the other guy said you don't really know when your invisible or not. If you killed me from that position I'd point out that you are invisible and ask you to not sit in that same spot, or to stand up or slightly change your position behind the barrier so you are visible (but still behind cover).

What really bothers me is when somebody goes to the same spot game after game even if they know they are invisible there. A few days ago on Sicily I was on the blue team. I was taking the left flank and had a very light loadout which allowed me to get onto that ledge behind the building at the far left corner. Upon coming around the corner I was shot and killed from the window across the street. I pointed out that the person in that window was invisible and asked them to stop. They did it again and I clearly saw the tracer fire coming from the window. This time I told them to stop. They told me that they were going to keep using it because it was a good place to defend from. They said that just because it was bugged was no reason to not use it. As far as I'm concerned that person is a cheater. They could have crouched on the couch in that building and had just as much cover WITHOUT exploiting the bug but they didn't. They could have backed up a little with only a slightly reduced view and be just as effective a defender without being invisible. They COULD have done things only slightly differently to avoid the bug but they choose not to, they choose to purposely use that bug to gain an advantage over the other team.

As far as I know this has been fixed in 2.86.

As far as grenade bounces go I think it most definitely needs to be fixed. Like the other thread said after a single bounce the grenade would have lost virtually all of it's energy.
 

Luminuis

Herald of the Newest Dawn
I think the best way not to be seen in INF is not to be playing, if your gonna cheat and ruin the game ofr other players then please remove your sorry self from any servers you wish to play on, I have found bugs on accident, and have always appologized, and ceased to use them, however, if you wish to use bugs and abuse them to become invisible or invincible, or any other thing that makes the game unfair and debases gameplay I must state now that you should be thrown off of a tall building for cheating in a game...It's just a game, I rarley win in INF but I always have fun, and to me cheating in INF cannot be fun.


Also, a Sniper that hides somewhere where there is only a small view area and few people can see him is in my consideration, camping.
 

itskeiagain

Adept
Mar 12, 2001
1,119
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Originally posted by Gabriel
a Sniper that hides somewhere where there is only a small view area and few people can see him is in my consideration, camping.

Yes, and that's how snipers should be i.e. not be seen by everybody in the town:)
 

Luminuis

Herald of the Newest Dawn
Hiding deep in a crevice, not moving at all, and having a field of view less than 10 degrees is to you good sniping? I suggest you try that in a game where sniping is really a big thing, Rogue Spear, because do that in a untimed RS game with everybody else sniping, waiting for someone to do that and you get games that go on quite literally forever, now, if you wanna say that that is good sniping in real life you're wrong, you should go read documentaries of snipers in aany war you can find, in the American Revolutionary war, they stood near trees and in forests, hiding, taking shots as they could then moving, because the British would lay waste to anyone that stood still for too long, In the american Civil war the same thing happened, once you took a shot you moved, or else you were cannon fodder, in WWI the germans had snipers that set in the crevices and waited for Allies to poke their heads over the trenches, it was considered a suicide mission because once you took a shot whole machinegun nests came down on you at once, in WWII american soldiers would be shot by a sniper and would send a two man team to put a grenade inside the window the shot came out of in cities, or out in the fields they had tanks overun known sniper positions, in the pacific the Japanese snipers where a real suicide mission when you took one shot sitting on a tree lik they did then you were dead, the americans took flame throwers to the trees and burnt them to crisps, in the vietnam conflict american snipers got incredible bounties on their heads, and they sat in the middle of plains and swamps watching whole sections of terrain, in desert storm so that the snipers could get maximum visibility of the area they sat on high sand dunes with Barret .50 calibre rifles to take down Iraqi truck colums!

Snipers have always had a job where you may sit to take one shot for a long time but once you've shot once from that spot then you move, of course in INF no one does anythign about snipers, I personally have never stayed in one spot for more than 20 seconds when sniping, and I always use GOOD sniper positions that are in places no one would think of, like out in the middle of streets, because when you think of a sniper spot do you think of the middle of the street or a small window on a third story building? I pick places that are totally out of the way for a sniper, as a real sniper does.

So a sniper can still camp, because if hes' sitting in one spot for the whole game waiting for more prey to come then that is all he is doing, would you let someone with an SMG do that?
 

itskeiagain

Adept
Mar 12, 2001
1,119
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WELL, since you elaborated more on what you said before, it makes more sense. I assumed you were just saying that the sniper in that case had a very small field of view. But you didn't state that he had only one way out. I was imagining maybe an old building with holes on the wall and looking through there, and he has several exits.

In INF, you CAN take out the whole platoon sitting in one spot. I don't know about the real war since I haven't read any of your mentioned readings. You can't hear the sound of a gun shot from a distance, so it's a very difficult task to determine where the shot may have come from. Although I don't snipe in INF(since I'm a CQB freak), the one-spot camping strategy works in INF, and it's a valid strategy.