Post 2.9 Official Weapon Suggestions Thread

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Gnam

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Feb 13, 2002
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Yes, please.
I guess the problem with the SIG is that no matter how you cut it it's a redundant weapon in the armory. The 551 is basically the same as the M4A1 but without an M203 or SOPMOD kit. The 552 is basically the same as the G36C (same barrel length, same see-through, clip-together mags). The 550 is basically the same as the M16A2, but with the minor advantage of full auto.

I suppose if the M4 was switched to the CAR-15 the 11.5 inch barrel would atleast be somewhat different from the 14" SIG and the 9" G36C, but I assume most people would not want to lose the accessorization and modernity that the M4A1 brings. I personally wouldn't miss the M4 since I've used it in every other shooter out there, but I assume I'm in the minority. Shame to see the SIG go, but unless people consider full auto on a 20" AR a big difference from the M16, I don't see how it'll make it to the next version of Inf.

Oh yeah, and as far as mil-specness goes, the SG 551 is not a non-military weapon, just the 551-SWAT is. But besides that the G36C was designed as a Law Enforcement weapon as well, so I don't think it's a big issue.
 

Lasersailor184

The_Punisher
Aug 21, 2000
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USA, and damn proud
They don't call it a "Shi*t hit the fan" situation because the balloons roll out.

YOU DON"T HAVE TIME TO FIRE SINGLE SHOTS! The situation is that desperate that you need to put as much lead down range as possible.
 

jaunty

Active Member
Apr 30, 2000
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Gnam said:
WTF are you talking about!!? Just what do you think "the point behind full auto" is!? You're talking about it like it's a secret weapon on some bad mecha anime...

"OK TEAM, SINGLE SHOTS AREN'T WORKING! WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO USE...FULL AUTO!!!..[fade in cheesy guitar music here]...GO GO FULL AUTO!!!!!...GO GO POWER RANGERS!!!!"

If the situation is dire you better give a **** about controlability. Cause if you think the situation is dire now, it's going to get a hell of a lot more ****ing dire when you lose all control of your weapon, failing to hit any of your targets and emptying your magazine instantly in the process.

So yeah, controlability is ****ing important in "dire" situations. Unless your idea of "dire" is a herde of bulldog demons charging out of a moon base to get you, or getting warped back in time to WW1 where your enemies are charging bayonets at you shoulder to shoulder making it impossible for you to miss, and all you have to defend yourself is your anachonristic M14 and a magic box magazine that never run out of cartridges. Christ...


ANYWAY...Rostam is right. The current armory allready has everything we need except for perhaps a battle rifle of some sort. I think OICW's main point in this thread was altering some of the individual weapon choices in those "needed" categories for more realistic and preferable alternative. For example, changing the AKMSU to an AKM or AKS-74U.

With pistols, we don't really need any more since pistols are no really used that much anyway. The DE is just waste of space, and as soon as it requires more actual work to keep in Inf (ie making a new model for Inf2k3) it should get ditched. Since 9mm is the most widley used type of pistol, it wouldn't hurt mind seeing 1 more 9mm (I suggest Sig P228), for the same reason 5.56mm is the most common caliber for assault rifles and we have 3 of them (with 5 total in the armory). The Walther P99 is in there, but it doesn't seem like anyone would miss it.

With SMGs, I don't think we really need the MP540 if we're going to have the MP5N. The Mini Uzi will make a nice alternative SMG. The MP5 PDW and P90 are personal defense weapons rather than infantry combat weapons, so I don't think they're mandatory, but they could make a good sidearm for grenadiers and snipers (particularly the MP5PDW).

For assault rifles, I don't think we need the G11 any more than we need the DE. I also don't think we need 2 14" 5.56-ers, either the M4 or the SIG should switch to a 10" barrel variant.

For the machineguns, the M249 is enough, but since there's atleast 2 alternatives for everything else it wouldn' hurt to have 1 more.

As Rostam said, 2 shotguns is more than enough, but I'm still eager to try the Remington 870. Shotguns are just fun weapons, and sometimes I like to just load up some bots and blow them away, or see how far I can far away I can spray at them from and still put em down. Besides, 2 is a nice round number.


First of all, I love you.

Second, we already have an AKS-74U. Just need to change the name of the AKMSU in game, and change the caliber listing.

The Sig fills an interesting role, really. It's a not-quite-full-length-but-not-quite-carbine full auto rifle, but with a piss poor 20 round mag, so you can't really go nuts with the auto setting. Once an M4 gets introduced though, it'll be obsolete. It's there now, no point removing it. Though I am more than happy to remodel both the MP5 and whichever Sig version to include a decent set of diopter sights, but I'd rather not. The animations and all that is already done for them, so it'd be alot of work for very little gain.

Don't get caught up in the myth of snipers carrying automatic sidearms. This is the sort of thing that comes from the gaming world. Military snipers usually work in teams, with one of them being equipped with a sniper rifle, and one with a carbine or assault rifle. The whole Sniper + PDW thing really comes from people being super practical in games, but it's flawed since I'm yet to see a game where "sniper" doesn't mean "single person acting on his own thinking he's ultra cool because he can shoot people in the balls WITH A SCOPE!!!1" Real men use iron sights.

I think a heavier, 7.62mm GPMG would be a good thing. It'd basically act like a portable M2HB emplacement, seeing as how it'd fire a heavy round, but couldn't be fired from the shoulder. Of course, a weapon like the MAG has a carry handle that sort of half allows you to fire it from the hip, but I wouldn't. I'd make it alot like the RC-50 in that it can't be fired unless aimed, and only aimed when prone, or maybe prone and crouched for practical purposes.
 

SaraP

New Member
Feb 12, 2002
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Lasersailor184 said:
They don't call it a "Shi*t hit the fan" situation because the balloons roll out.

YOU DON"T HAVE TIME TO FIRE SINGLE SHOTS! The situation is that desperate that you need to put as much lead down range as possible.

All the lead in the world won't do a thing if none of it hits the target. You've been watching too many action films.
 

Lasersailor184

The_Punisher
Aug 21, 2000
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All the lead in the world won't do a thing if none of it hits the target. You've been watching too many action films.

And you've been reading too many books.


I don't know what's going on in your head, but to me, i'd rather not be charging the people who are putting so much lead in the air that you'd get poisoning just from breathing.

I also suspect that this is the way with most of the rest of the world. We prefer not getting shot.


It also makes sense logically. People are shooting at you. You are picking them off one by one. This mentally gives them more confidence. Hence, more people shooting at you.

Now you are going fricking nuts with the shots. Bullets are landing all around the enemy. **** is flying up everywhere, dust in the air, ricocheting bullets.

This isn't a happy mental environment. I wouldn't be happy if this was happening.

Ok now, what's the difference between the two. In one, you are taking them out one by one, but there are still a lot of bad guys firing at you. In the other, you are barely hitting anything, but no one is shooting at you.

Which is more appealing to you when you are trying to escape?
 

RedMarlin[MERLIN]

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Jun 4, 2001
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Lasorsailor... shut up please. Your making your self look like a dumbass. Why use full auto??? Your going to miss way more rounds and not hit ****. Oh!!! THEY ARE LANDING ALL AROUND THE ENEMY AND SCARING THEM!!!... No they are ****in going into the air or as you say landing all around the enemy and not hitting them... OOPS YOUR OUT OF AMMO YOU DEAD! You act as if a battle rifle is like some little weak thing so you have to put a full mag into the enemy. One shot one kill, not 20 misses you dead.

The worse thing about this is I'm telling this to a M14 fanatic... holy **** man its 7.62 :y5:
 
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jaunty

Active Member
Apr 30, 2000
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For the first time in your life, a post of yours made something resembling sense. Well done.

The M14, like the Garand and M1 Carbine, are designed with the intention that the firer actually be aiming his weapon. I.E the emphasis is on marksmanship and not "LOL SPRAYING WILL SCARE THEM LOLOLOLOLOL"

Idiot.
 

spm1138

Irony Is
Aug 10, 2001
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Oh please stop it. This is at least twice as stupid as anything else you've ever posted here. We've all agreed that battle rifles should be in the next version of Inf (for all the good that would do) so please stop making my brain hurt. Please?
 
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jaunty

Active Member
Apr 30, 2000
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He's just pissed because the only way he's getting an M14 is if the team makes it, or if he makes it himself.
 

Meplat

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Dec 7, 2003
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*Shrugs* Full auto from a MBR is neither controllable, nor reccomended when all the ammo you have is upon your person, in small metal boxes. These are known as "Magazines", and their capacity is limited.

Full Auto fire with a rifle calibered firearm is best left to those devices consuming their ammo from belts, or large drums in a prodigious fashion. Unfortunately, these devices tend to be a bit more unweildly than a MBR, and left to their own devices, will consume significantly more ammunition than one would wish to carry.

Again, having fired a number of the discussed MBR's, both in semi, and full auto, I cannot more highly reccomend the FN MAG, or the above mantioned PKM for the purpose of ejaculating rifle calibered slugs in quick like order.

Thank you.

Meplat-
 

SaraP

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Feb 12, 2002
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Lasersailor184 said:
And you've been reading too many books.

U.S. Army Field Manuals >>> Hollywood action movies.

I don't know what's going on in your head, but to me, i'd rather not be charging the people who are putting so much lead in the air that you'd get poisoning just from breathing.

I also suspect that this is the way with most of the rest of the world. We prefer not getting shot.


It also makes sense logically. People are shooting at you. You are picking them off one by one. This mentally gives them more confidence. Hence, more people shooting at you.

Now you are going fricking nuts with the shots. Bullets are landing all around the enemy. **** is flying up everywhere, dust in the air, ricocheting bullets.

This isn't a happy mental environment. I wouldn't be happy if this was happening.

That is because you are a civilian, not a trained soldier. The whole point of training is to replace natural instinctive reflexes with reflexes designed for combat. Ergo, a soldier doesn't run from wildly inaccurate full-auto fire; he takes cover if possible and eliminates the enemy with aimed semiautomatic fire. That is the difference between a trained professional and an ignorant civilian.

Ok now, what's the difference between the two. In one, you are taking them out one by one, but there are still a lot of bad guys firing at you. In the other, you are barely hitting anything, but no one is shooting at you.

Which is more appealing to you when you are trying to escape?

No, the difference is that in one you're using ammunition efficiently and taking the enemy out one by one while they shoot at you, and in the other you're wasting ammunition and accomplishing nothing while they shoot at you. Automatic fire from a select-capable battle rifle is totally ineffective except at spitting-close range; even as close as twenty yards, the third bullet in a dead-on-chest three-round burst from an FN FAL is more or less guaranteed to miss as the rifle jerks up and right from the recoil.
 
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Specter

Infiltrator
Jul 17, 2002
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Here is a link to some Army Field Manuals:
http://155.217.58.58/cgi-bin/atdl.dll?authentic=y&type=fm

According to the FM 23-10 SNIPER TRAINING field manual, sniper teams consist of two people. The sniper carries the M24 SWS, while the observer carries an M16A2 rifle with an M203 grenade launcher. Both also carry either an M9 pistol or .45 caliber pistol. The M24 SWS can be equipped with iron sights.
 

jaunty

Active Member
Apr 30, 2000
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Specter said:
Here is a link to some Army Field Manuals:
http://155.217.58.58/cgi-bin/atdl.dll?authentic=y&type=fm

According to the FM 23-10 SNIPER TRAINING field manual, sniper teams consist of two people. The sniper carries the M24 SWS, while the observer carries an M16A2 rifle with an M203 grenade launcher. Both also carry either an M9 pistol or .45 caliber pistol. The M24 SWS can be equipped with iron sights.


I fail to see what this has to do with anything.
 

Rostam

PSN: Rostam_
May 1, 2001
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What is your point, Specter? IIRC alot of british sniper teams move out in pairs, both carrying a sniper rifle with enough ammo. That being final.
 

Soul Assailant

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Dec 7, 2003
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Well Jaunty, I can kind of see your point. The recoil is great with a 7.62 round in full auto, but most of the time I dont even use the full auto option on the gun. I use burst or semi auto, tending more to double tap on the semi auto option. Why not let the recoil do the aiming for me? However, I do think there are a few things that you ought to know. The first being that I havent played Raven Shield in some time before INF 2.9 was even released, and I totally uninstalled it when I DL-ed 2.9. Secondly, I have always been a fan of the G3A3 since before I ever play a Rainbow 6 game of any kind. And last, but certainly not least, this is a thread asking for new weapons ideas. I dont see why you have to get so defensive over my suggestion.

And I apollogize for the first part of this post as well. The recoil being great came from SaraP, who is quite right I might add. You had nothing constructive to offer at all Jaunty.
 
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Lasersailor184

The_Punisher
Aug 21, 2000
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No matter how much training you've had Sarah, if you're getting shot at, you're going to get under cover.

U.S. Army Field Manuals >>>

I meant talk to people! You know, the living, breathing, thinking things?

Btw, I'd take the US Army field manuals with a grain of salt because the army blows.


No one ever said you have to hold down the trigger for effective suppressing fire.

Ergo, a soldier doesn't run from wildly inaccurate full-auto fire; he takes cover if possible and eliminates the enemy with aimed semiautomatic fire.

As much of a soldier that he thinks he is, he's still a Human. And a human getting shot at is going to get some cover.