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My Guns

Discussion in 'Infiltration Development' started by XClutchX, Jun 12, 2008.

  1. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    As some of you know, I modeled a Walther P99 a while ago. At that point I only knew how to model. Well, I've figured out texturing and I'm fairly certain I can figure out UScript with a little bit of help. I'm not sure about animating yet.

    As for the title of this thread being plural, I've also begun making an H&K UMP .45.

    My projects:

    Walther P99 (Work in progress)
    [​IMG]

    H&K UMP (Work in Progress)
    [​IMG]

    H&K G36c (Work in progress)

    -----

    I have some questions, though.

    1. How many faces should my models have (Max and min)?
    2. Do all of the faces have to be triangles?
    3. What size should the textures be?
    4. What parts (if any) need to be separate for the animations?
    5. How would I go about adding attachments?

    If you have any suggestions, please feel free to post them.

    Note: I doubt these will end up in Infiltration unless I have help. So, if any animators and texture artists want to try to get these guns (and possibly more) into Infiltration, then great, but the main reason I'm making these is to get some experience modeling, texturing, animating, and coding.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2008
  2. Snakeye

    Snakeye Mk82HD

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    Nice work so far.

    While I'm pretty new to UScript myself I'd think coding the P99 shouldn't be much of a problem, since you can use the M9 as basic - both being 15rd 9mm sidearms they are similar enough IMO. That doesn't mean it'll be a piece of cake but if you don't have any attachments it's a nice start.

    I'm not sure on point 2 but I remember reading somewhere that UT supports only triangular polygons (don't bet on it though). As for 3 IIRC any 2^n texture size should be possible; standard for UT is 256x256, although I'd suggest going to at least 512x512 or 1024x1024. In doubt you could always check what the INFMOD team used - their weapon textures look pleasent enough.

    I don't have any answer to that except to make the first try a gun WITHOUT any attachments - or if it has to be something as simple as possible (supressor?); wait with the fancy stuff until you have more experience.

    I suppose getting someone to animate it is the hardest part - there might be the odd texture artists around who might be willing to help and there also are a few people around with more or less UScript experience. If no one else is willing to, I may be able to help you a bit with coding - as mentioned I'm fairly new to UScript, but I guess a bit of experience is better than none - or was it a little knowledge is a dangerous thing :D.

    Also be sure to check out the Beyondunreal development sections and these two places:
    http://udn.epicgames.com/Main/WebHome.html Sadly only UE2 and higher, though much of it (coding wise, don't know about modeling, animating etc.) also applies to UT99.
    http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/ A bit tricky to navigate around at first, but they do have some good answers.(Note that most UT stuff is in the "legacy" section).
     
  3. Carpetsmoker

    Carpetsmoker Nexus-6

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    Yes.

    Animating isn't that hard, it's easier than modeling IMO.
     
  4. theRoadStroker

    theRoadStroker A Dickcheese Faggot

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    1. How many faces should my models have (Max and min)?

    Well how much do you want it to lagg? the more triangles to more lagg, but about 1-1000 triangles are what you should be aiming for. Remember to always keep in mind what you see of the gun and what you dont, lets for say your UMP, the stock looks nice but do you actually see the stock while playing with it ? or during reload or any other animation? if not id go and make it less "nice" or just remove it altogether if i can get away with it (atleast for the 1st person model) so i can make more eyecandy on the stuff I see.

    4. What parts (if any) need to be separate for the animations?

    Well um I guess all the parts you want to move lets say the clip/mag, switch for semi/auto(not necessary), bolts, attachments*, triggers (if you see them) and so on.

    *Well this would answer 5 too so ... You see about attachments if i got everything right while listening to Geo and others is that for every attachments you have to make a new version of your weapon lets say you create a suppressor, red dot right,and a m203.
    You have to export (from maya/3dMAX)....sup+iron, sup+red, sup+m203, sup+red+m203, m203+iron... i think you get the picture. Well im not sure about if you attach the attachments to the main mesh or if you just link em.

    Well good luck

    Road
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2008
  5. Psychomorph

    Psychomorph  

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    But if you want to use the 1st person model in the 3rd person, than you need to model it completely. If I'm not mistaken I think the M60, M14 and some others use the 1st person model in the 3rd person.
     
  6. theRoadStroker

    theRoadStroker A Dickcheese Faggot

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    Its not necessary better to use the 1st person model as the 3rd person model, I think that a better optimized 1st/3rd models look alot better its alot less lagg without losing quality(if your good at optimizing that is). Besides what model are you looking at most of the time? id say the 1st person model , sure i look at the 3rd p model as well, but it wont make up for the time I look at the other one. Also i rather have a really nice ironsight then a stock i dont see or look at 1min in 5h or to put up with lagg, just because it HAS to have the 1st p as the 3rd p model. In the end its Clutch or anyone else who makes the weapons who decides.

    EDIT

    To sum it up for Clutch

    1. Up to 1000( 1400 if you really need it )
    2. Yes
    3. Up to 1024x1024 (512x512 is the best if you ask me) you can even use multiple textures like (2) 512x512.
    4. All the moving parts
    5. Attach/link/add them to the bone(s) or attach them to the main mesh( not really sure play around with it )
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2008
  7. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    Alright, thanks for the help. I appreciate it.
     
  8. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    I got the UMP model down to 794 triangles (Almost half of what I had before) with the magazine, but without the bolt and selector switch; so, probably no more than 850 triangles total.

    If you see any inaccuracies in the model (especially the sights, I want them to be as close to the real thing as possible, but I can't find a good shot of them) or you think it needs more or less detail in certain areas, please post your thoughts.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Am I able to use Blender or any other free program with the inf hands (.3DS) file? It won't work with the version of Maya I'm using.
     
  9. Psychomorph

    Psychomorph  

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  10. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    Thanks for the compliment and the link. Those pictures will help a ton.
     
  11. Kueltag

    Kueltag New Member

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    I'm looking forward to use this weapon. Will its power be somewhere between the MP5s' and the AKMSUs'?
     
  12. Snakeye

    Snakeye Mk82HD

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    You might be a tad disapointed, but to cite Clutch himself:
    I still hope he'll make them appear in Inf, but I wouldn't bet on it.
     
  13. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    Well, I'm actually going to try to get it in the game. I'll be going into the video game industry and I'll need all of the experience I can get; modding will help. Unfortunately, I don't have a good enough PC to run the newer 3D modeling and animating programs (specifically 3DS Max), so I can't get them in the game alone. My main concern is the coding part, because I'm going to school to become a game programmer.

    So, basically, whether or not these guns get into Inf depends on how much help I can get in what's left of this community (so far, so good). The only thing I can see really preventing these guns from getting finished is animation.

    Inf needs a new mod team. :D
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2008
  14. Carpetsmoker

    Carpetsmoker Nexus-6

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    What do you mean?
    I make models with Blender, export them to 3ds, and then with 3ds2unr.exe to Unreal format ... It's probably possible to do something like that with most modeling programs...

    You can import (and export) 3ds files with Blender, it's in the scripts menu.

    As I said ingame a few days ago, I can help with animating and scripting the weapons, just PM or email me with any questions and I'll do my best to help you.
     
  15. Carpetsmoker

    Carpetsmoker Nexus-6

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    btw, Why The G36C? We already have a G36K, and the G36C (And I believe G36K too) is mainly used by police, not so much military ... I would love to see a regular G36 or G36MG ... N'kEnNy said he would make models, but he's been deadly silent for a few months :(

    In general, Assault rifles/Carbines are much more useful and realistic than SMGs IMO ...
     
  16. Kueltag

    Kueltag New Member

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    I used the SMGs against monsters, and the MP5A2 for example has such a low recoil that I could fire on their head more or less continually. That means 4x damage. I almost started to think such a stupid thing that SMGs are better for midrange monsterfight because of their low recoil than ARs (sorry, assault rifles :) ).
     
  17. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    I'll have to try Blender for animating, I guess.

    I know, I'll probably be sending a bunch of script questions soon. For now, about how much time goes into animating a weapon total?

    I like the G36C and I'd probably not commit to making a weapon I don't like. Plus, I can make attachments for it since the G36K doesn't have any (same gun with less bulk as well).

    I'm not quite sure what that's directed at. If it's about the UMP, I have an SMG as a backup weapon for almost all of my loadouts and the UMP is cool; especially the .45 version. :)

    Like Kueltag said, SMGs are easier to handle. If you go to the Inf shooting range and you have an assault rifle and an SMG, on full auto (at 100m - 200m) the SMG with easily hit the target a bunch while you have to struggle with the rifle. So, SMGs do have their uses.

    You know what? I forgot about sounds. I definitely don't have a clue how to do that. Someone please tell me it's easy. :hmm:
     
  18. Snakeye

    Snakeye Mk82HD

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    @Clutch: good to hear, I really hope you'll make it - while I don't know shit about animating I might be able to help a bit with coding, if necessary - I've done my fair share of mistakes in my UnrealScript coding career to be a bit of help avoiding those :D

    To add a bit to the OT part of the discussion, I've always thought Inf slided a bit too much into the "special" portion of firearms - short ARs, SMGs and pistols are not standard issue and therefore mainly used by SWAT, SpecOps and the like. Since I prefer a military perspective I'd like to see more ARs, carbines, LMG/SAW/FSWs than the bunch of more or less unused (IRL that is) exotics as the MAG7, DE, UDAR. I don't mean any offense to the INFMOD team, it's just that my selection of firearms would be more on what standard and perhaps SpecOps military forces actually use - L85, SIG550, G36, Galil, AK74 - hell even an AUG *shrug* if need be - or a PK, RPD, MG3 (or any MG42 successor).

    The point is not even if a SMG is better at killing monsters - it's the feeling to have a weapon as used by a normal infantry trooper, having a standard loadout and not some fancy stuff a low double digit number of people in the world use - let's be honest: how much info can you even find on a UDAR? (and how much of it do you actually believe..)

    Inf to me always will be a military simulator (if such a thing can actually be done), so I refrain from using UDARs, MAG7s etc. - I carry an M9 as sidearm; not only because I like the M9, but because it's standard issue.
     
  19. XClutchX

    XClutchX New Member

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    Aww, but then I don't get fun little surprises when I run my scripts. :mad: :lol:

    That was bound to happen with the small maps, small teams, and inability to create a truly realistic combat environment with UT.

    The MAG7 and the UDAR are poor choices of weapons. I had never heard of either one of them before they were put in Inf, so that tells me that they aren't used much. As for the DE, you can't have a shooter without a DE. It's just too awesome to exclude. :)

    We could use a couple more LMGs and a Galil, but I still think that the smaller weapons (maybe not SMGs, but small rifles) work better because of the size of UT. If we had maps like the Battlefield games, then it would open up the game for snipers and LMGs. It's hard to find a good compromise, though.

    The UDAR... Ugh. We're on the same page. :lol:
     
  20. Carpetsmoker

    Carpetsmoker Nexus-6

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    Do what IMT did, just copy the INF sounds :D
    Reload the UDAR, then reload the 40mm, spot the differences ;-)

    Some sounds were modified, but I believe most (If not all) are based on original INF sounds.
     

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