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Minecraft guy: Piracy is not theft

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Sir_Brizz, Mar 5, 2011.

  1. Darkdrium

    Darkdrium 20% Cooler

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    You misunderstand his point. He meant in in the way that as piracy is a problem on PC, used game sales is seen as a problem on consoles.
    He didn't say that piracy was absolutely and exactly equal to used game sales, because it isn't. He just said that both are problems of the same magnitude for each type of platform. Publishers need to learn how to deal with both.
     
  2. Twisted Metal

    Twisted Metal Anfractuous Aluminum

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    WAT.

    If I steal a Toyota Camry, there are 3 kazillion others in the world. :con:
     
  3. Benfica

    Benfica European Redneck

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    Ok, I see
     
  4. DarkEmperor

    DarkEmperor Buried By The Dead

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    Actually it is more complicated. You buy the license to use it, you don't own the product.
     
  5. -Jes-

    -Jes- Shreddin'

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    Well, as said he's chill. But then, why wouldn't he be, considering:
    1) he's a millionarie,
    2) he can't do **** about it
    3) minecraft is a builder survival evolution of a cancelled team dig-for-gold competitive indie game effectively being a unique title on it's own, while fortresscraft will be a complete and utter minecraft clone for about a year (according to the episodic design currently announced) with especially ****TY parallax and hdr 'graphics' on top. Guess who wins points for originality?


    Also, piracy != theft, but = copyright infringement. Legal precedent says so.

    Of course, that won't stop big publishers from tooting the "OMFG PIRATE THEFTS" horn whenever their sales are less than projected.
    Which, of course, is wholly unrelated to their games actually sucking in some form or other. No game ever failed economically because it was BAD.

    Gotta stifle the used games market too, can't have people saving money through good old fashioned supply&demand.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2011
  6. Kantham

    Kantham Fool.

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    I considred that before you mentioned, but perhaps he could have been resentful (Maybe he is, but yeah, point 1 and 2 covers that well). Of course, the replicas won't hit the million mark, but it's still annoying and unoriginal to see.
     
  7. -Jes-

    -Jes- Shreddin'

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    Everything gets copied. :eek:
     
  8. SleepyHe4d

    SleepyHe4d fap fap fap

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    Yeah, there's a difference, but it's just semantics and there's no point in pointing it out unless you want to be a giant douche bag. Which apparently all copyright infringers like to be to justify their actions. :rolleyes:

    For all intents and purposes, which would be the ethics of it, it is the exact same if not worse than theft.

    Actually, if you want to argue semantics, according to wikipedia, "In some jurisdictions, theft is considered to be synonymous with larceny; in others, theft has replaced larceny." and larceny is, "a crime involving the wrongful acquisition of the personal property of another person."

    Copyright infringement is also, "a crime involving the wrongful acquisition of the personal property of another person."

    Therefore copyright infringement = theft. (Disclaimer: in some jurisdictions)

    Owned bitches. :lol:
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2011
  9. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    You can't really justify piracy. There is no good excuse to do it.

    But it doesn't mean the publishers should be focusing all their time, attention and money on that crap. I talked to one of my buddies ion the industry the other day and he told me that the copy protection on their last PC game (which was a few years ago, he didn't mention what it was) cost nearly 1/4th of the development cost of the game in the end between licensing and unit royalties. That's just ridiculous.
     
  10. Kantham

    Kantham Fool.

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    eehhhh. Technically, yes. There are a hundred typical CS:S-like shooters out there for free on the net. But seriously, a game as unique and original as Minecraft? People could compare Minecraft to Lego's and farmville, that's probably the best similarities.

    There's being inspired, and there's the copy-paste.
     
  11. Capt.Toilet

    Capt.Toilet Good news everyone!

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    Bad example

    You sell 1 copy of that game and 25 million pirate it. You go bankrupt because you didn't make back any money, and thus no second game.
     
  12. dragonfliet

    dragonfliet I write stuffs

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    It's a difficult situation as far as definition goes. To say that it is theft is, strictly speaking, inaccurate, as, which has been said a number of times, nothing is actually being removed from one person's possession. On the other hand, to say that it is copying is to almost necessarily deny that there is a crime being committed and that this type of crime does deny the ability of the devs/publishers to make money they otherwise would have (obviously there is no 1-1 ratio, or even, probably, a 1-5 ratio, but there is still a large amount of money that would have been made had the copy not been pirated).

    I don't agree that publishers need to find a way to ignore piracy, and I support DRM, but far too much time has been spent thinking how to punish violators and far too little time on thinking about how it affects legitimate customers. A service like Steam works, in my opinion, as the benefits provided far outweigh the annoyances (that you have to validate it online, even for retail copies), a service like what Ubisoft tried, on the other hand, doesn't, as it punishes people for an ISP outage and provides them with no actual benefits. Obviously, anything can be cracked and broken, and for anyone to insist that there is a way to stop that is silly. All that can be done is to make it enough of a hassle that casual pirates will buy the game out of annoyance and that won't make paying customers have to undergo the same trials.

    Pricing is an avenue to pursue, but I wonder how feasible it is to price a AAA game at a lower level and hope for more sales. What is the drop off point with that? Unless non-casual gaming reaches the numbers of casual gaming, I just don't see the kind of sales base to support that, as much as I wish it existed.

    ~Jason
     
  13. N1ghtmare

    N1ghtmare Sweet Dreams

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    Stealing digitally vs stealing from a disk in the sense that they are both just copies and therefore is not actual theft argument becomes flawed when viewed in the sense of intellectual property.

    Is it not theft if someone pirated a copy of the UE3 source code? It is only ones and zeroes is it not?

    Clearly it is that the billions of ones and zeroes of the game are organized in a fashion that makes it a game. It is the blueprints for your computer to process and render the software. In linking it to car example, it would be if everyone owned a car factory (computer), and people stole the blueprints for how to assemble the car (software).

    It may not be loss of a sale in that respect, but it is still IP theft.
     
  14. -Jes-

    -Jes- Shreddin'

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    True piracy in action! :eek:
     
  15. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    I think, as others have said, that copyright infringement is probably a more appropriate term given the context. I do agree that a crime of some kind is certainly being committed.
    When I say "ignore it" I mostly mean "stop putting so much focus on it". I don't think that the increase in sales is worth what is done to combat the problem. I still think that a CD Key (that is validated for online play) and simple disc-based or Steam-alike DRM is plenty of protection against casual piracy.

    Mainly, publishers need to stop looking at pirates as lost sales and start looking at them as potential sales. They need to figure out how they can turn them into customers, not how they can stop them from doing something they are going to be able to figure out how to do eventually anyway.
    I don't know how they compare. I think a game like Bulletstorm just doesn't have enough content or enough so-called "hype" to justify anything more than $40. I don't think it has enough of either of those things to convince people to ZOMG BUY at $60, certainly.

    I would say, in that specific case, the "theft" part would be what you would have to do to get the source code and start distributing it.
     
  16. Agent_5

    Agent_5 Replica?

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    Actually, if you want to argue semantics...

    note 'real property,' and 'movable'

    To further clarify, let's go to 'chattels'....

    Software doesn't qualify as personal property, bitch.
     
  17. SleepyHe4d

    SleepyHe4d fap fap fap

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    internet sers bizniss

    Also, you aren't allowed to directly insult, only indirectly insult on this forum! :mad:
     
  18. BITE_ME

    BITE_ME Bye-Bye

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    But he is right.
    PayPal will not give your money back for crappy software.
    They say it has no value....You can't hold it, or put it in a box.
     
  19. Crotale

    Crotale _________________________ _______________

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    Not so fast. Copyright laws give the copyright owner sole authority over how, when, where, why and to whom the copyrighted property is distributed. On that same token, patents can be considered personal property.
     
  20. Balton

    Balton The Beast of Worship

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    exactly, I think if publishers started pricing more appropiately we'll see more sales and less pirating. You see similar behaviour when, e.g. gas prices skyrocket the incidents of people siphoning gas or even stealing it from gas stations(one of my neighbours had his license plates stolen, which were used to gas up at several stations the next day).
     

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