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Mass Effect 3 "exclusives" are starting to pop up.

Discussion in 'Games' started by JohnDoe641, Jan 1, 2012.

  1. dragonfliet

    dragonfliet I write stuffs

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    I don't think that, as a whole, most of the criticisms leveled at ME3 would reflect badly on 99% of the people that worked on the game (except for the animators, because, seriously, wtf? This game has some pretty shifty animations). It's a damned fine game with, simply, some glaring plot/story/narrative design decisions that really pull the gamer out.

    This is something that sticks in my craw so much because it has been that way pretty much forever. ME1, however, had one of the most wonderful and one of the most terrible moments of gaming for me. Let me lay it out for you:

    I enjoy playing an evil character because it's generally more gleefully interesting. So I was playing ME1 as a character choosing mostly renegade options. The thing was, I was also romancing Liara because I thought she was pretty cool. So, because I'm romancing her, I bring Liara on every mission, along with Wrex (who was just awesome). We kill Benezia and then there is the option to kill the Rachni Queen. I choose to kill her. But then there is a quick interlude, Liara tells me that I should stop and save the Queen, she deserves another chance. Wrex, of course, says to kill the bitch. I WANTED to kill the Rachni Queen, but I also wanted to get laid, and so, putting my extensive history of getting in trouble with girlfriends to use, I decided to spare the Queen to reap the rewards of my action with my gf. Only afterards, Liara didn't say anything acknowledging my decision. Certainly not the nookie I deserved. So I loaded up the save and this time ignored Liara's plea, killing the Rachni Queen. Nothing from Liara. She wasn't pissed at all, she didn't even seem to care.

    I had gotten, for one of the first times (and if something got their first, this was certainly more memorable) where I cared enough about a character rendered realistically enough that I was willing to change my mind about something based on them asking me to. That was huge. That was a giant, major deal. But then, almost as soon as that had happened, I learned that it was a game where choices didn't matter, that everything was an illusion and there was no accounting for these kinds of choices in ways that were powerful on a character level.

    ME3 is still making the same stupid choices, is still lacking the same basic understanding of how to integrate player choice in a meaningful manner--the game, however, has become more polished, more interesting and more expertly executed (except for the animations) around this. I can't help but feel that there needs to be a fundamental change within the writing/game design departments that revolutionizes their formulaic approach to handling character interaction, but most everything else is just gravy.
     
  2. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    To add insult to injury, the death of the Rachni queen has zero impact on ME3. Likewise, killing Wrex in ME1 has virtually no effect on ME3. It's frustrating how choices in the first game only change minutiae in any of the other games, and that the second game almost doesn't matter at all in the scheme of things.
     
  3. xMurphyx

    xMurphyx New Member

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    I don't know, guys, I'd like to have some more immediate consequences and I'd like to be more involved in things that happen right now. Often the description of my dialog line is so vague that I have no idea what I'm going to say if I pick this, so I just go with Good or Evil and hope for the best.
    As long as you don't pick a colored line or one on the right you can say whatever you want. Sometimes people act like they get pissed because you asked about something, but it never matters. In ME2 there is one dialog in particular where Tali tells you not to ask someone about the silly name of his ship. So of course you go ahead and ask about it, he gets upset, but it doesn't matter. None of these ever matter.
    Sometimes the option I would want isn't there at all. E.g. I wanted to tell Ash as she's coming on to me that I wasn't interested. At all. All I could do though was to tell her "not right now". Which is serviceable, but not what I wanted.
    Or the "Disingenuous Assertions" bit... What's wrong with Shepard? I mean, I see that it's Evil, but just knocking her down for being a scumbag journalist? I didn't know this was going to happen when I press that and I wouldn't have if I had known.
    What really pisses me off is that you can select dialog options with A and you can skip lines with X. But: you can also select lines with X for some fucked up reason, so you're hammering X to get through something you already know, but since you can select lines before they show up sometimes you sometimes chose things by accident this way! So while skipping you hold the stick towards the Good or Evil direction, just in case...

    The game is just full of fuzzy guesswork. Even though it stupidly points out which options are Good and which are Evil.
    Which brings me to the next annoying bit: I want to play my character as a reasonable person. Sometimes I pick Good, sometimes I pick Evil. Depends on which makes more sense to me at the time. ME is one of the few games where Evil isn't "eating babies" evil but just harsh and pragmatic evil anyway, so playing a more or less neutral character works much better here than in most RPGs.
    Why then, am I penalized for this? If I'm not "Good" (or Evil) enough some Good (or Evil) options are grayed out! Who thought that was a good idea?



    I don't really care if I'm shooting a brick into space and I get hit by it on another planet two games later... What I do care about is control over what's happening NOW.
    For example, I prefer going through a conversation in Baldur's Gate 2 where I can chose lines of dialog that reflect my attitude almost perfectly, even if it doesn't have huge consequences later on, but they matter in this conversation! Because at least I feel like I'm playing my character then.

    I enjoy minor things like running into a character you saved a game earlier or something. Mass Effect 2 had quite a few of those, for example, and it was pretty cool.
     
  4. Wulff

    Wulff Bola Gun fun anyone?

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    There is a slight change, if you save the Reaper Rachni queen, she'll turn on you, the real Rachni queen won't.
     
  5. dragonfliet

    dragonfliet I write stuffs

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    And by turn on you, you mean: you don't get the points for increasing War Assets.
     
  6. Wulff

    Wulff Bola Gun fun anyone?

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    Pretty much, kind of a dull thing, should have made it into another mission, where you have to go kill her.
     
  7. Mister_Prophet

    Mister_Prophet .

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    It's kind of like when I lost Mordin at the end of ME2. He was the only character I lost (I made the wrong decision to put him in the vents. He survived that but died closing the door in a cutscene). I assumed this would play a huge factor in how the Genophage sequence played out in ME3. But behold! A new Salarian character shows up and facilitates the role Mordin would have had in ME3.

    Now that I mention it, did anyone else feel that the Krogan portions were the best bits of 2 and 3?
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2012
  8. Jacks:Revenge

    Jacks:Revenge ╠╣E╚╚O

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    if by best you mean "least annoying" then sure.
     
  9. Kantham

    Kantham Fool.

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    Human Vanguard is gud.

    [m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzT7NBz8oE0[/m]
     
  10. Sjosz

    Sjosz (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

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    Yep, that's how vanguard is played. :)
     
  11. dragonfliet

    dragonfliet I write stuffs

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    [M]http://youtu.be/MmadibTVxdU[/M]
     
  12. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    Heh... sadly the best part of that video is the mockery of a conversation.
     
  13. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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  14. dragonfliet

    dragonfliet I write stuffs

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    Holy God that Shepard looks autistic
     
  15. Al

    Al Reaper

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    Last edited: Apr 5, 2012
  16. ambershee

    ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks

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    It means Bioware did an awesome.
     
  17. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

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    What "artistic vision"? Utter confusion and complete ignorance of dozens of events in the game leading up to that point?
    Edit: Can't read.............. April 12, 2014? That seems more like the date that EA will shut down online services for the game. :p

    Also, relevant.
    http://doycetesterman.com/index.php/2012/03/mass-effect-tolkein-and-your-bullshit-artistic-process/
     
  18. Sjosz

    Sjosz (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

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  19. Al

    Al Reaper

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  20. Sjosz

    Sjosz (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

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    So finish the game and form your opinion, dude. :)
     

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