1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Two Factor Authentication is now available on BeyondUnreal Forums. To configure it, visit your Profile and look for the "Two Step Verification" option on the left side. We can send codes via email (may be slower) or you can set up any TOTP Authenticator app on your phone (Authy, Google Authenticator, etc) to deliver codes. It is highly recommended that you configure this to keep your account safe.

M-4 Carbine Attachments

Discussion in 'New Version Suggestions' started by striderteen, Jul 31, 2001.

  1. Aldyon

    Aldyon Quiet Fo0!

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2001
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
    Fur relax, she's just answering your rants and raves..... And what you *aren't* taking into affect is if maybe the person DIDN'T look through the scope when firing the grenade? That would solve ALL our problems right there, make it so when you press the actived attatchment button, it automatically takes you to hip mode eh? And, err umm, don't flame me like you did with Countess jus because we replied to your arguement :(
     
  2. c+k|nEVeRmOre

    c+k|nEVeRmOre ~A.K.A. wesley_sniper~

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2001
    Messages:
    372
    Likes Received:
    0
    Save your breath, fur...he just does not get it. We have been trying to explain the rationale behind not using the two (ACOG+M203) for weeks now. Even my cat understands the logic. Countess, on the other hand, does not understand and will continuously bring up faulty evidence to support his claims. I was letting him make me mad, but, I solved that by using the message board's handy dandy ignore fuction. I don't know what Countess is saying, but, I would bet anything it is bombastic :) Do yourself a favor and ignore him.
     
  3. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    hes argument is "cant beat them ignore them"

    "That said, I have seen M16s with M203s and night vision scopes mounted toghether."
    well...? explanation?

    btw : thank you for giving us some more beautifull insights into your sad and twisted personnality :p

    why are you ignoring this ?
    you alsways ignore somethign you dont like dont you?
    if you know so much about it anser

    your almost as sad as c+k|nEVeRmOre in that respect
     
  4. St0rmcaller

    St0rmcaller [AFA]'s unoffical godfather

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2001
    Messages:
    1,690
    Likes Received:
    0
    The two lower rungs are for 50 and 100.
     
  5. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    thx

    could you use them while you look under the scope? (thats why i wanted a pic of that)
     
  6. St0rmcaller

    St0rmcaller [AFA]'s unoffical godfather

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2001
    Messages:
    1,690
    Likes Received:
    0
    No you couldn't. The scope is still in the way. In order to do that you would have to fire the M-203 while the rifle is perfectly level, and that means a range of less than 50m. A range of less than 50 meters is not a bright thing to do, seeing as you might be catching some of your own flack.

    No problem. I exist to educate!:D
     
  7. poaw

    poaw You used to sleep easy at night.

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2001
    Messages:
    1,512
    Likes Received:
    0
    The pot has just called the kettle black.

    It seems to me you're the one ignoring every argument thrown your way.
    A six year Marine tells you that it's not so. So then you say you can prove it. Except instead of actual proof, you draw a box with the word, "ACOG" on top of a M16. Your only argument is, "I can do it in INF, therefore I can do it IRL."
     
  8. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    they FIT!!!!
    ok?
    even the fur will say they both fit on the gun @ the same time

    we are now detemaning if you can actualy use them
    and someone posted he has seen a nighvission scope mounted on a m16 with a m203
    now i want a explanations why a nighvission scope is ok with a m16+m203 but not a normal scope

    is that so hard to understand?
     
  9. c+k|nEVeRmOre

    c+k|nEVeRmOre ~A.K.A. wesley_sniper~

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2001
    Messages:
    372
    Likes Received:
    0
    I wonder why Countess chose to omit this part from the quotation...hmmm...
    Seems pretty logical to me. At night time your use of the battle sight will be impaired by darkeness, so point fire is your only option, regardless...unless you are using NVG, which would obviate the NVS :D Either way, my guess is that you still would not use the scope for acquiring and enemy target and firing, or am I misunderstanding the term <i>point fire</i>?
     
  10. St0rmcaller

    St0rmcaller [AFA]'s unoffical godfather

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2001
    Messages:
    1,690
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have used the NVG scope on an M-16 with an M-203. However, considering. An instructor, a Gunner for 8th Marine Regiment, told us that the 203 should only be fired when a target appears, and is clearly more than 100m distant. Night time engagements are very difficult to gauge distance in, and firing any closer might result in causing death/injury to friendlies. The scope (I think it was a PVS-14?) was only to be used with the rifle. The 203 was for viable targets of oppurtunity.

    And no yurch, the scope did not zoom. :D
     
  11. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    sins there isnt any range sight in inf for the m203 probably
    and its not all too needed @ inf ranges

    ok how was the m203 aimed then if not throu the scope then there had to be some other means

    ok something else that just hit me
    about the_fur saying : you cant tilt the gun
    true if you only tilt the gun you cant see throu the scope
    but the inf soldier tilts his whole upper body, keeping shoulder and eye in allinement with the gun(you should be able to tild @least 25 degreas then(accounting for recoil))
    making it posible to tild the gun and hit targets @ small ranges
    ok you aim above the target and in no way on it and you dont have any range indication
    but i can hit why cant a trained soldier
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2001
  12. St0rmcaller

    St0rmcaller [AFA]'s unoffical godfather

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2001
    Messages:
    1,690
    Likes Received:
    0
    So the question is, can the M-203 be used if there is an ACOG attached. The answer is this. What you have in RL with this combo is an ineffective grenadier. True not totally ineffective. He would still be able to fire the 203 easily out to the 150-250 meter ranges. Each individual in a fireteam has to be 100% effective in the use of his given weapon. He will not be given something that he could only use, half assed. AN M-16A2 with a bent front sight post could still be fired. But since it is not 100% effective, it is combat deadlined, and the owner is issued another rifle until his original can be repaired.
     
  13. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    did you read my post above you last?
    i really want to know how the m203 was fired with the nightvission on it

    no offence ment but it seems i wasnt that far off with my "just not done" comment then
     
  14. Ishtvan

    Ishtvan Because it's cooler than "Steven"

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2001
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't think the night vision scope mentioned magnifies at all. And Shakken also explained that it limited the weapon to point shots, no indirect fire or really long ranges, which is okay in a low visibility situation. We're talking here about why a zooming ACOG can't work in most situations in which one would employ the M203.

    Again I'm just guessing, but I think leaning back with your body is a no-no... All I know is that a basic firing stance is relaxed, back straight, maybe 55% front 45% back weight distribution (just one example I'm sure there are a lot of variations). I think leaning back would shift weight to your back leg, and bring into play muscles that are more difficult to control (i.e., those required to stay leaned back the exact same amount).

    Maybe with a lot of additional training it could work, but it seems simpler just to use the aiming ladder. The simplest and most effective thing is usually what's adapted for use.

    "i can hit why cant a trained soldier"

    I think that was the point of StOrmcaller's post... you and a trained soldier might be able to hit at relatively short ranges (especially short considering the real shrapnel radius), but you should have a setup that allows you to hit at ALL possible ranges. This is what the aiming ladder does and a scope can't.

    Say for example you wanted to fire from one end of the map Remagen to the other. Weapon tilting scope alignment arguments aside, you could try it with a scope, but you'd end up looking at the sky with no way to gauge what range your nade will travel. With an aiming ladder you just tilt it until the appropriate rung lines up, look thru that one and fire (if that's how the ladder works), and it works just as well for short ranges.

    <img src="http://www.inforcers.f2s.com/sigs/uniformishtvan.gif" width="400" height="80" border="0">
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2001
  15. Puncher

    Puncher AFA member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2001
    Messages:
    629
    Likes Received:
    0
    You simply aim the weapon through the scope, the way it is done now in INF. However, even at the short ranges currently in Infiltration, you often have to aim quite high above your target, almost off the bottom of your scope. That something like that isn't very accurate is obvious. That's why only point-shooting works (in RL out to about 150m is considered that). At greater ranges you wouldn't even see your target through the scope, making accurate fire impossible.
    Additionally, one major hindrance in RL is unaccounted for, namely wind. Since the 40mm shell is relatively big, slow and lightweight, it is strongly affected by wind. This makes accurate fire at longer ranges very difficult in windy conditions.

    P.S. If anything I said is insulting, I take it back. It definately wasn't meant that way.
     
  16. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    "I don't think the night vision scope mentioned magnifies at all. And Shakken also explained that it limited the weapon to point shots, no indirect fire or really long ranges"

    how often do you use it any other way in inf?
    exept ep there is no map where you can see for over 150 meters

    and zoom or no zoom it would still block your view if you tilt it to high that would make no difference

    but stomecaller sayed that the nighvission was for the riffle only
    that imply's to me that the m203 was fired differently

    Puncher : so your saying you have to tilt your gun LESS IRL then in INF
    meaning i should have more range than i have now looking throu the scope

    btw over 150 meters you cant even SEE a target without a scope in inf (unless the camo he is using is really wronge for that part of the map and he is standing in full view)
    so the effecitve range of the m203 in inf is limeted to less then 150 meters with or without a scope
     
  17. yurch

    yurch Swinging the clue-by-four

    Joined:
    May 21, 2001
    Messages:
    5,781
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thats also why the M203 isnt used as much as plain bullets, countess.
    There is a reason.
     
  18. [L]the_Countess

    [L]the_Countess Novice

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    well then i play realisic in that respect:)
    sins i often come out with both nades still on me killing 2 or more ppl (RARELY do i kill less)
     
  19. Harpoon

    Harpoon New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    316
    Likes Received:
    0
    But Gholam, CS has a supressor on it's M4 and it's pretty quiet :confused:
     
  20. LoTekK

    LoTekK Peon

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2001
    Messages:
    1,385
    Likes Received:
    0
    CS?? CS?? you dare soil these grounds with that name? :con:

    okay, in cs we'll assume they were modelling subsonic rounds, which don't make the distinctive 'crack' that regular [supersonic] 5.56 rounds make as they leave the barrel and break the sound barrier... so subsonic rounds are quieter... but with reduced velocity, they're also kinda useless, comparatively...
    .45 rounds are already subsonic, so suppressing them isn't as much of a problem as 5.56, 9mm, and all the other calibres of ammunition...
     

Share This Page