Idea: I'm Hit! Man Down!

[{GD}Ghost]

Just to clarify, I never said that it should be the round itself that should knock you down. If you're standing and get hit by a three round burst from an M4, you're not gonna remain standing for whatever reason unless you just don't feel pain or are a dumb muther-****er. Most likely, you body will react in a way that will make it difficult to continue to stand....most likely the pain or the involuntary shut down of certain funtionability.

If someone can give me an example, that is the normal, where a combatant takes several rounds (armor or no armor) and continues combat, unaffected, I will discontinue my argument. Quite possibly my proposed idea of how to resolve this issue isn't the best, but something needs to be done or "As Real As It Gets" is a joke. I understand that this will never be completely realistic, but when other games have simulated this semi-effectively, I have confidence that our Dev team can match or exceed this feature.

 

[NTKB]

...most likely the pain or the involuntary shut down of certain funtionability...

Yea like the ability to hold in urine and fecal matter.

What I've always hated was the lack of penalty for locational damage.

I.E. TTR had it perfect I think. Say you got pegged in the leg with a 5.56, maybe 2. What are the chances that you'll be able to use that leg to move quickly?

Anyway, TTR had a simple system. Yellow meant light wound. Barely affects you at all. Orange means decent wound. It would affect you some. I.E. You can jog, but you can't sprint. Red means heavy wound. You can walk slowly, but you can't jog. One past that causes complete trauma (if you survive it). I.E. You can't even walk anymore, you're forced to crawl everywhere.

Another example, say you got a red wound on your arms. Good luck trying to snipe. It'l be swaying all over the place.

What this does is make it vital that you do not get hit, instead of just dying. Covering fire suddenly becomes much more important because no one wants to get hit.

That system kicks ass! As long as you can still die from a single hit I would be happy with that.

 

[{GD}Ghost]

A system like the one Lasersailor184 described would indeed kickass in INF.

Right now, alot of people's playstyle is slowly going the way of ****ass-game-name-that-must-not-be-mentioned, which is fine if you're playing ****ass-game-name-that-must-not-be-mentioned or another game like it, but this is INF "As Real As It Gets" or what would more accurately describe the goal and its outcome, "As Real As We Can Make It". The playstyle is heading that way more than we'd like to admit because of many factors; a few of which are the unnatural strafing ability, taking rounds doesn't have a realistic effect until you take catastrophic damage, and weapon balancing. Unfortunately, what will not change is the ignorance or willful disregard for the tactics that will keep players alive, if even the above listed game design flaws be corrected. What we should be going for is not a game that FORCES people to use realistic tactics to stay alive and support thier team, but a game that guides players in that direction if they want to be successful in this game.

Right now, we are no longer playing INF as special small unit operatives that are in combat against another like force. We are more like arcade gamers playing the flaws of the maps, the flaws of the game itself and the flaws or the balancing of the weapons. INF is still better than alot of similar LOOKING games out there, but I think we can do ALOT better in the realism department than we'd like to admit.

 

[-=]N[=-ZeuS]

reduce the amount of flaws ingame ^_^

 

[Crowze]

Who is this 'we'?

Relax. Obviously Inf 2.9 isn't As Real As Anything Else Gets Or Will Ever Get(tm) since it's so old (on a 5+ year old engine, and even Inf itself is over a year old now), but you can be pretty well assured that Sentry will do the best they can. You also have to bear in mind things that will never (i.e. not within a reasonable number of years) be fixed, such as lag, and sometimes game developers have to compromise on the realism a bit because of such things.

 

[{GD}Ghost]

I say "we" as in the INF Community because even after an S.S. release of INF, the game is rarely played, on many servers, "as is", due to community created mutties and what not.

I'm sorry to inform you that this is no longer just S.S.'s game/project.

Also, the understanding that INF will not ever be !00% realistic does not mean one shouldn't try to get it as close as reasonable possible.. It is when one attempts to meet standards far above what is believed possible, that breakthroughs, inovations and masterpieces occur. This is were genius exists.

 

[Lasersailor184]

TTR's on the same engine.


But TTR also has random damage and random health. Each time you spawn, you spawn with random health anywhere from 75-150 points. And each gun has a random damage mod to it. I.E. The K98 does anywhere from 100-150. It's also set up so that it isn't completely random, but it focuses towards a certain point much like a Bell Curve (I forget what it's called). So it's not an equal chance of getting 150 health as it is getting 100. Same thing with shooting 120 damage compared to 150. It's a small chance a bullet will do 150, but it's still a chance.

In summary, most likely, if you get pegged in the chest, there's a good chance you're going to die. If you get pegged in the arm, you can kiss your sniping skills bye bye.

Of course TTR has bleeding effects too. If you get too low on blood, the screen flashes in and out from darkness. I.E. It automatically dims and comes back.

 

[Nukeproof]

It's called normal distribution. You could achieve that by adding several independant random numbers instead of creating one in the entire range. (Basically like rolling 10 regular dice instead of one 60 sided dice)

 

[- Lich -]

We HAD something similar in INF once...there was a mutator, with hit location system (think it was that one with the smoke nades from 2.86). When you were hit in the arm, recoil was increased, leghit reduced speed or no sprinting. And hit in the side made you turn, loose your aim.

 

[keihaswarrior]

R2 mutator Lich

Also, Rav3 made you lose your aim. Strafewhorenomore made you bleed.

And TTR's system sucks. People get shot in the leg and they get instantly put into the prone position with their gun aimed.... which means they usually kill the person who wounded them. It's also another one of those 'bandage your huge gaping gunshot wound in 10 sec sort of systems'... bleh.

 

[Prowler]

The system I like is in Operation Flashpoint where the creators of the Marine Pack modification made it so that if you where shot and wounded enough to the point of coming close to death without an instant kill shot, you would black in and out as you loose blood. Then after you have lost too much blood you would then die. How long untill death reaches you is based on the severity of the wound receaved. Death could come anywhere from 5 seconds to 5 minutes.

In my own opinion, if you should receave fire to your lower arms/hands then you should drop your weapon and be forced to pick it up again. Also your aim should be dramatically reduced if you recieve fire to any part of your arm or upper body. With the legs, maybe we can design a system that would determine if you should be able to walk based on how serious your leg wounds are. I also believe that shooting your arms or legs should not be so fatal. Two bullets to your leg should not instantly kill you.

Bleeding could then be added to those types of injuries but like you guys suggested, I think self healing is not a good idea and should not be added for healing serious wounds. Though it would be usefull to get some stamina back somehow. Theres nothing I hate more then being shot at when I am forced to walk at a very slow pace and I know that in that situation I would not give a **** if my leg was half blown off I would move my ass out of the line of fire.

 

[{GD}Ghost]

BAH! Not a big fan of the bleeding system myself. ...and the prone with weapon thing doesn't sound any good either. Why can't a player fall over on their side or back when shot?

Also, if you sustain a serious enough wound, it doesn't matter how fast you WANT to get out of the line of fire, if your body does not respond, you're S.O.L. unless you've got some buddies there do lay down some covering fire while you either drag yourself to cover or they drag you to cover.

 

[Lasersailor184]

If TTR's system sucks KW, how come no one has topped it yet?

Btw, TTR 1.3 is out. Join us!

Btw, the aiming thing is caused from the fact that you can aim going into a prone. I never liked it, but it doesn't mean you have to put it in.

 

[cracwhore]

Btw, TTR 1.3 is out. Join us!

Btw, no.

 

[NTKB]

Crac you dont have to be so rude TTR took alot of effort to produce and has a small community like ours. What is your goal? To piss everyone off till they want to kill you? Suicide by society?

 

[keihaswarrior]

If TTR's system sucks KW, how come no one has topped it yet?

I don't know, and it makes me sad.

Btw, TTR 1.3 is out. Join us!

Ya, I need to go install another version of UT first so I don't mess up my INF install. I am going to definately try it out though. -- I am doubtful that it will have much on RO though.

Crac .. What is your goal? To piss everyone off till they want to kill you?

Pretty much, yup.

 

[DEFkon]

Since INF (or whatever it'll be called) is moving to the HL2 engine, i think this could be one of the area's that could take advantage of the better physics available.

In an ideal world i'd suggest that an incoming projectile impart some level of force (taking into account all the aplicable variables - type, range, body armor if any, ect) on that part of the body that it hit. The resisting force, ( your ability to recover and try to return the apendige to it's "correct" position) would be relative to your "health condition" The better your condition, the more likely your body would be able to "recover"

an example would be getting shot in the leg, while running.

Your avitar's leg would be shot by a rifle round. (in addition to whatever "damage system" was in place) the part of the leg hit would be moved out of position relative to the force imparted (think realistic ragdol) . If it was great enough the leg would be not be postioned correctly, and model would stumble and fall flat on it's face. And depending on the damage he might not be able to get up.

But that's the ideal world

In reality it might be simpler to have the First person view react in a more realistic manner. As someone mentioned earlier in the thread there was a mutator that simply made someone go prone, or crouch when hit, and that it was a failure. If we ask ourself what would likely be our reaction to be shot, the real answer would probably include losing your focus for a moment at the very least. I think a good study on watching people fall, or even better being hit while not expecting it in relation to where they look would be a strong basis for future "realism" games.

 

[G36]

Ummm...what the hell is TTR? The only acronym I know of is Toyota Team Racing which seems to exclusively make stickers for people to put on their stock Corollas.

Also if we could somehow shamelessly steal the brilliant tinnitus and hearing loss effect of F.E.A.R (seen in the long preview video) I would wet my pants.

 

[NTKB]

TTR is The Third Reich. Its an iron site mod like INF for UT but based in WW2. It never grew as popular as INF, but its execution and systems are very nice and well worked out. A very nice mod, but not enough player base to have taken off. It was released at the wrong time for the wrong game IMO...

 

[Nukeproof]

Actually they just bought a commercial engine license, continue developement and consider to go retail...

http://www.thethirdreich.com/forum/portal.php?article=0&sid=

Edit: At least there was an announcement last time I checked