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God orders murder: Insanity in the USA, Barbarianism in the middle east?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by phil, Apr 4, 2004.

  1. W0RF

    W0RF BuF Greeter, News Bagger

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    must have happened while I was typing.
     
  2. tool

    tool BuFs #1 mom

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    Sheesh how long does it take you to type man? :p

    Read the real long post I made on the last page. I may not have explained it as well as you, but I still got the same point across that you just did.
     
  3. W0RF

    W0RF BuF Greeter, News Bagger

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    Well I'm at work so it takes me about 5 times as long because my time is split about 80/20 in favor of work.
     
  4. tool

    tool BuFs #1 mom

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    aah ok, understandable, I was just joking anyways, carry on. :p
     
  5. Hadmar

    Hadmar Queen Bitch of the Universe

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    And if I choose not to belife in him I'm still going to hell? "Just" is subjective, and that's not my definition of it.
    So, what am I missing here? I don't think the answer to that question is context as (8) seems quite straightforward and universal to me.
     
  6. W0RF

    W0RF BuF Greeter, News Bagger

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    Good news:
    Bad news:
    Good news:
    So believe, don't believe, that's up to you, but it's plain that salvation is not an act of separating good from bad. What I don't understand is, if you've heard what the Bible has to say, choose not to believe it, then it turns out He was real and all the stuff in there was true, why would you gripe about the judgement that comes with it? I mean, it's not like you didn't choose that path. I imagine that apart from the mercy of salvation, you'll be judged by your life on earth, but I don't know how favorable that would turn out. i doubt even a real theologist could tell you that with any great measure of certainty.
     
  7. MÆST

    MÆST Active Member

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    God's justness is not which determines entry into heaven. It would be perfectly "just" for us all to go to Hell. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The punishment for sin is death (Hell). It is only through Jesus that those who believe go to heaven.

    And that verse is about the second coming of Jesus.
     
  8. tool

    tool BuFs #1 mom

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    Pretty much what Worf said. I really don't get why you guys keep trying to find faults in the Bible. It doesnt exist. Just when you think you found a verse that counterdicts the entire bible, another verse later in the book explains everything and makes it more clear.
     
  9. W0RF

    W0RF BuF Greeter, News Bagger

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    We are meant to question, that's why we're not programmed to blindly believe. In other words:
    [​IMG]
    "I can only show you the door, you're the one that has to walk through it."
     
  10. tool

    tool BuFs #1 mom

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    Hmmm.... I never thought of it that way. That makes sense. :tup:
     
  11. Hadmar

    Hadmar Queen Bitch of the Universe

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    Do you know how many religions are out there and claim they are the one true one? We life in an age of science, not blind faith in magic, gods or whatever the first one we meet preaches. If somone tells me 'heya, there's a god and he created the world and his son died for our sins" reasoning kicks in, rates the probability somewhere around "uh-hu whatever" and dismisses it as not worthy of my time. See, it's not as if god creats a huge picture of himself on the sky every other month to prove he exists. It wouldn't be "just" to blame it on anyone if he decided not to belife and in the end it turns out, against all chances, that it actualy is true.

    I have better things do do with my time than to search for faults in the bible. And I guess you could continue to search and find another part of the bible that contradicts the one that explains the one before, and so on and so on.
     
  12. W0RF

    W0RF BuF Greeter, News Bagger

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    ... because naturally, if someone believes God exists, it can't possibly be the result of any thought or sound reasoning on his part.... :shake:

    ...here we go again, dividing the world into "smart" and "religious"...
     
  13. tool

    tool BuFs #1 mom

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    All I know is that science hasn't shown that God doesnt exist. Most things they teach you in school are theorys, not straight up facts. Until some scientist comes out with a report that says for a fact, without a shadow of a doubt that God doesnt exist, I'm going to keep being religious, because that is what I believe to be true. Since that is never going to happen, and for tons of other reasons that make me have faith that there is a God, I'm going to continually to believe what the Bible and Book of Mormon teachs to be the truth.
     
  14. Dain75

    Dain75 I am the lizard queen!

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    Yay for Pascal!! He was a philosopher that said you are better off at least pretending to believe in case god is real. He viewed the question basically as a cost/benefit analysis. If you believe you stand to gain everything, if you don't you stand to lose everything. Ha.
     
  15. Hadmar

    Hadmar Queen Bitch of the Universe

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    That's not what I said, thank you. That was my very personal thought process on the matter of god or not and I posted it to answer your question, to make it clear why _I_ would gripe about the judgement. I have no problem with other people coming to different conclusions and I don't automatically think they should be put in a mental hospital for believing in god. :shake:
     
  16. W0RF

    W0RF BuF Greeter, News Bagger

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    I'm sorry, I was confused by the inclusion of the pronoun "we" and the phrase "blind faith" with gods thrown in the pile with magic and the generic "whatever".

    And Dain, my answer was not Pascal's Wager. I was saying that I'm not the one who does the judging.
     
  17. Hadmar

    Hadmar Queen Bitch of the Universe

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    Think about it for a second if you manage to come out of the sarcasm mode for a while. The "we" that confused you: "We" as in humanity - or maybe western civilisation is better - live in the age of science. At least that's what everyone tries to tell me. As science advanced, more and more of what was once in the realms of "x happens becouse god/ghosts/magic/black cat y does z" was explained in a way that didn't include anythin mystical so excuse me if I put ghosts, magic, superstition and gods in the realms of the mystical and not reality in my decisions *apply apearently nescessary emphasis on "I" and "my decisions"*.

    You don't seem to like "blind faith". Hmm.
    Faith:
    "Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence."
    I don't see how blind faith is any different from faith apart from the negative touch that swings in it and I didn't think about that when I posted it since I saw christians use it when they where asked to explain why they belife in god even though there's no proove he exists, sorry.
     
  18. tool

    tool BuFs #1 mom

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    How is science any better then faith? Science is mostly based on theorys and educated guess. Faith is the same thing, just worded differently. Most of science isn't proven fact, it is what scientist believe to be true. Faith is the same way. Science has never shown that God doesnt exist.

    And you can prove that God exists, read up on what the Holy Ghost is, and how it works. You'll never fully understand God, but you know he is there. God has ways for us to know he does exists. Prayer is one of them, there are many other examples too, but prayer is the one that comes to mind the most, and is the best example.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2004
  19. Hadmar

    Hadmar Queen Bitch of the Universe

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    Science: Observing phenomena -> formulating hypothesis -> experiment proves hypothesis to be true or false -> conclusion
    Faith: God created the world
    ---Later---
    Science: Combining conclusion with conclusion from different experiment -> If conclusions fit together: party. If not, new hypothesis -> new experiment -> new conclusion
    Faith: God created the world

    Science has the potential to show the truth(TM) one time and heads thowards that goal. Faith remains at the same point without providing evidence for what it claims. (Before somone points out that faith itself dosn't claim anything: I know that. It's late and I can't think of a way to word it differently) And unless science reachs the final goal and explains absolutely everything it's impossible to proof that god dosn't exist. On the other hand God never proved that science dosn't exist either...

    Since you say it's the best example, how is having a monlogue with myself proof that god exists?
     
  20. Dain75

    Dain75 I am the lizard queen!

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    Yeah i know, it just made me think of him.
     

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