1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Two Factor Authentication is now available on BeyondUnreal Forums. To configure it, visit your Profile and look for the "Two Step Verification" option on the left side. We can send codes via email (may be slower) or you can set up any TOTP Authenticator app on your phone (Authy, Google Authenticator, etc) to deliver codes. It is highly recommended that you configure this to keep your account safe.

Epic commitment to UT3

Discussion in 'Unreal Tournament 3' started by BawaBawa, Apr 24, 2008.

  1. BawaBawa

    BawaBawa New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    I saw this thread a couple of times by ZorroGris at the epic forums but they keep deleting it so i guess ill help him out by posting it here .

    I don't want to start flame to epic about the support on his UT3 game, is more like a question to all the UT fans out there that have contributed to make UT one of the best and most anticipation franchises in video game industry.

    As a first time buyer of the UT franchise i would want to know how good is the commitment of epic at UT games; seen companies like steam/valve with CS or Team Fortress, Blizzard with Starcraft and Warcraft series; and how they keep updating those game pretty fast when a bug, glich need it or when enhancing something for a long time.

    It makes wonder how was the support for UT99 UT2k3 UT2k4 how good was the patching for those games and how long they keep em alive.

    Thank you for reading this and posting your opinions.
     
  2. paradigm

    paradigm Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2008
    Messages:
    24
    Likes Received:
    0
    please define support.
     
  3. N1ghtmare

    N1ghtmare Sweet Dreams

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2005
    Messages:
    2,411
    Likes Received:
    12
    Although the release was shaky, Epic has supported the game a lot. We have had two large patches, a third one is being developed, and we have gotten a bonuspack with 3 new maps.
     
  4. toniglandyl

    toniglandyl internal data fragmentation : 62203480%

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2006
    Messages:
    2,878
    Likes Received:
    0
    EPIC has always done an excelent job at supporting their games after their release.

    the patches may take time to come (oh the fun with the flying levi bug at UT2004's launch) but we usually get what needs to be fixed.

    an unreal franchise has always been alive for a long time. hell, there are still mods coming out for UT and UT2004 !
     
  5. Trynant

    Trynant Manic Brawler

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2002
    Messages:
    2,017
    Likes Received:
    0
    Answer: lots of support.

    Epic not only supports UT with patches, but they have always made free content releases with a relatively large number of maps in ratio to the amount of effort it takes to make one map (i.e. less maps for UT3 than UT due to amount of detail required).
     
  6. Phopojijo

    Phopojijo A Loose Screw

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2005
    Messages:
    1,458
    Likes Received:
    0
    Epic is known for their support above and beyond almost all other companies.

    UT3 hit a rocky start, but they're supporting it and making it better.

    They're just a little slow because they're spread out amongst several games right now (technically 5), a few dozen licensees, and their core development staff (excluding Epic China) is about half the size of Bungie's... who is working on 2 games and no licensees. (Albeit Epic's employees are head-and-neck above the competition person-per-person for skill... so it weighs out; just ask anyone attempting to work there :p. I have... and I hear the words "Fort Knox" float around)
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2008
  7. JohnDoe641

    JohnDoe641 Killer Fools Pro Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2000
    Messages:
    5,323
    Likes Received:
    49
    Epic has a track record of keeping up with patches and fixing the bugs that really need ot be addressed.

    Unfortunately UT3's support hasn't been nearly as well as I remember the other games being. They're just now implementing the player names on the server browser list and this is going to be in patch 3. And there's no word on whether they're going to fix or even acknowledge the Demo Guy problem.

    I still have faith that they're do what's right and the patches will keep on coming so the general populace accepts the game instead of shunning it. I'm tired of not seeing more than three servers with players on them. :/
     
  8. Mr. UglyPants

    Mr. UglyPants 2007 never existed, it was all a dream.

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,984
    Likes Received:
    0
    Remind me, but what is the 'Demo Guy' problem?
     
  9. JohnDoe641

    JohnDoe641 Killer Fools Pro Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2000
    Messages:
    5,323
    Likes Received:
    49
    The Demo Guy problem is when you or all the players appear as Demo Guy when you join the server (sometimes)/switch teams/change game types/reconnect mid-game regardless of how your/the servers settings are.
     
  10. Mr. UglyPants

    Mr. UglyPants 2007 never existed, it was all a dream.

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,984
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ah. Thanks.
     
  11. WHIPperSNAPper

    WHIPperSNAPper New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2003
    Messages:
    444
    Likes Received:
    0
    If you're new to the UT series, you should know a little bit about the history of the series.

    The original UT, sometimes called UT99 or UT-GOTY (game of the year edition) was a smash hit and by far the most successful game of the series. Players made thousands of custom maps and mods for it, clans and leagues were formed, thousands of people could be found playing the game 24/7, and people still play it greedily and competitively to this day.

    Then Epic released UT 2003, which, if I understood Hal from the Beyond Unreal community correctly, was essentially a console port. Floaty-dodgey movement was added and most people hated the game after large amounts of hype had been built for it. Some people who'd purchased it even felt that they'd been robbed. The UT99 clan community despised it.

    Epic then fixed many of the bugs and some of the game play from UT 2003, and added some new game types, especially Onslaught, and then released it as UT 2004. Although it still had floaty-dodgey movement and thus an emphasis on hitscan weapons and fast aim, the game did well and was carried by the Onslaught game type, which introduced vehicles and was a great game in itself.

    With UT3 Epic did a decent job with the feel of the game play. The game play feels more like the tried-and-true UT99. The game play was good and many UT99 players who'd rejected UT 2003/2004 style liked the game play of the demo. But...and here's where Epic ****ed the duck...everything else about the game was god-awful. Everything surrounding the game play was rotten! Epic consolized the user interface and server browser and then hopped into bed with Gamespy. The user interface is clunky and slow and requires people to have to wait to load the main menu constantly and it offers few settings tweaking options and you cannot keybind taunts and communications comments. ("Cover me!") The server browser, at the game's release, barely functioned and was featureless. In fact, it wasn't even possible to make a list of server favorites. People are also required to log into Gamespy which can sometimes cause a number of problems. The retail version of the game was also released as an unfinished, buggy beta and it was released when other more polished, big name titles were being released. Hence, the game sold poorly and now has low player counts and few custom, user-made maps and mods.

    The UT 2004 user interface and server browser were pretty good and the UT99 UWindows user interface was good also. People were expecting that for UT3, but when they saw just how crappy it was in UT3, they lost enthusiasm for the game. UT3 also has fewer game types than the other games, few player skins, and awful, awful taunts.

    It's very sad when a sequel pales in comparison to what previous versions offered, but with UT3, that's what happened. Hence, UT3 has proven to be an Epic Failure.

    Can the Unreal Tournament franchise be saved? Yes, and Epic could do it and might even be able to figure out what to do. However, the problem is a lack of desire on Epic's part, not ability. Having been infected with an awful case of consolitus, it seems doubtful that Epic will ever make another game for the PC that will rival the greatness of the original Unreal Tournament.

    In the meantime many of us will continue to play the original UT in clanner-style pickup games (PUG) matches for as long as such activity continues to last, maintaining fond memories of how much fun the game was years ago when thousands of people could be found on the public servers 24/7 and when custom map aficionados eagerly awaited seeing new maps.

    Whatever amount of activity and community UT3 has, it's merely a faint shadow of what UT99 had and even of what UT 2004 had. Will the real story about what led Epic to kill the franchise ever come out? Did Midway force Epic to release an unpolished, unfinished buggy beta with a consolized user interface and server browser months before the game was really ready for the PC? Or did Epic really believe that PC players wanted a consolized, clunky and slow user interface with a featureless server browser? Or did Epic make a conscious business decision to kill the UT franchise on the PC? Perhaps, one day, the real story will come out.
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2008
  12. evilmrfrank

    evilmrfrank Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,631
    Likes Received:
    0
    UT2003 isn't exactly what I would consider a console support. UT games have always been known for aweful taunts(even though I don't agree with that) It was never a console port. Anyone who loses interest in UT3 because it had a bad UI needs to stop playing games entirely because they are obviously having fun in the menus more than having fun in the games.
     
  13. hal

    hal Dictator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 1998
    Messages:
    21,397
    Likes Received:
    13
    I think what he means by console port is that UT2003 was originally designed as UC for the Xbox.
     
  14. brdempsey69

    brdempsey69 Original UT Owns !!

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2003
    Messages:
    362
    Likes Received:
    1
    Great post WHIPperSNAPper. You hit the nail right on the head. I do mean that sincerely.
     
  15. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    25,970
    Likes Received:
    66
    I don't understand how the UI is all that consolified. Is it because it can be navigated with a controller? I'm sure you could make Uwindows navigatable with a controller. Is that one consolified? Why wasn't Unreal blamed of being Consolified? These are serious questions!
     
  16. Sijik

    Sijik Snagged an item.

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2004
    Messages:
    516
    Likes Received:
    0
    With the exception of getting to the player config screen, I find the menu can be very swiftly navigated using both mouse and keyboard. I find it easier to get through than UWindows, which typically requires a lot of mouse travel, especially on higher resolutions.
    Regardless, the consolization of the menu started with 2k3, stylistically, it's not new to UT3.
    Just gimmie an .ini file. That's all the UI I need for the most part, and what I've been using for all but setting up a game and character since Advanced Options in Unreal... :p
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2008
  17. MonsOlympus

    MonsOlympus Active Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2004
    Messages:
    2,224
    Likes Received:
    0
    @WHIPperSNAPper
    Strange, on one hand you say how decent the gameplay is then declare the game an Epic failure. Sounds to me you wouldnt have been pleased with it either way, I mean you said it yourself people were expecting more in the UI department. I mean should we blame Epic for raising expectations in the first place? I dont remember them hyping the UI for one minute, infact the first time I even heard anything about the UI was what the demo.

    It was a mistake but Epic have admitted it, give it a rest already. Its been what 5 months of the same damn complaints?!


    As far as the actual topic goes, commitment to UT3, I think Epic is doing pretty okay. They have been active in the forums answering questions, the patches have slowed but will be steady, no doubt there will be alittle more bonus content on the way through the year.

    Onto next year and I have no clue, I mean with 3 Epic titles on 360 Im alittle worried Gears 2 and UT3 on that platform will get all the attention. Especially with the response of the community to UT3.


    Now let me expand on that alittle bit, having bought the game and played it you can certainly talk on what you do and do not like about the game. If you dont play it regularly since buying it, or have given up on it whats that say about your commitment and comments on this thread. Now sure you dont really owe Epic anything but if you think abadoning a game is the best way to guarantee a companies commitment to it, you might be in for a shock, Epic are doing all they can I would hope (In the back of my mind I still think Gears gets in the way of UT though). That doesnt stop me supporting UT3, by playing it online/offline and modding for it, infact I think it helps UT as a whole.

    Reading over the closing of CPL thread the other day over there, it makes me wonder on the state of competitive gaming. Alot of people were saying that since they dropped CS 1.6 or something it killed them, even though they supported it for so many years. Honestly commitment is a 2 way street, so its just as much in the hands of the fans as it is Epic.

    Welcome BawaBawa, enjoy your stay :)
     
  18. Sir_Brizz

    Sir_Brizz Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    25,970
    Likes Received:
    66
    What makes it that way, though?

    The Unreal menu was stylistically similar to it, but nobody whined about it being consolified back then.

    I do agree that the UI needs a bit of changing, but not because it's consolified, but because it has a poor design flow and less options than previous games expectations were set.
     
  19. hilo_

    hilo_ New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2008
    Messages:
    108
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think what he meant is that although the core gameplay is very well constructed, the game as a whole (due to factors other than the core gameplay) wasn't up to standards set previously by epic.

    I think that's what people mean by "consolified." Advanced video options, for example, aren't usually included in console games because they're developed and optimized to work on a certain set of hardware with constant settings.
     
  20. MonsOlympus

    MonsOlympus Active Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2004
    Messages:
    2,224
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well thats what I dont get is how you can declare the game as a whole a failure while saying Epic got things right even more so than UT2003. Just comes across as very hypocritical to me, I mean who set those standards in the first place? Oh Epic thats right :lol:

    Ive been over it though and while the interface might not share all the functionality of other UT games its certainly not a worse design. I just think people like to critize but lets not let anyone actually shed any light on how dodgy 2k4's interface was, I just cant sit here and say one is definitaly better than the other. What I can do is show the strengths and weakness' of both (oh I did that already http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=175046).

    I mean if interfaces were that important to me there I wouldnt be playing many games at all because alot of companies dont get it right. I just think its funny that when ever someone wants to complain about something they bring it up like its a wildcard, when its not, you aint gonna bluff anyone if thats the only card you got up your sleave. Lets not forget UT2003's UI got criticized and I still think in a few ways its better than UT2004's.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2008

Share This Page