DTAS Gametype?

[shan]

Anyone having any luck getting a DTAS Gametype put together for Inf 2.9? I know Crowze is working on a gametype but not sure if this is it?

Not trying to bug anyone. Just excited to get some 2.9 DTAS going.

Shan

 

[Cleeus[JgKdo]]

isn't that something for the general forum?

 

[Crowze]

Working on it, but I've run into a few problems. Seems there's a bit in the GUI that means the round setting only shows on the main menu if the gametype is TDM. I'll ignore it for now, as you can set it in the ini. As for progress, I've got RandomTeamSpawn TDM gametype working, but converting DTAS is going to take a lot of work (got to rewrite a lot of the code).

EDIT: For those who don't want to read the whole of the thread, the latest DTAS should be avaiable here.

 

[shan]

isn't that something for the general forum?

What? Questions obout Development of a new gametype?

Working on it, but I've run into a few problems. Seems there's a bit in the GUI that means the round setting only shows on the main menu if the gametype is TDM. I'll ignore it for now, as you can set it in the ini. As for progress, I've got RandomTeamSpawn TDM gametype working, but converting DTAS is going to take a lot of work (got to rewrite a lot of the code).

Thanks for working on this Crowze. Nice to know someone is looking at it. I look forward to tossing it on the server. BTW, if you need a server to test it on, let me know and I can set one up.

Shan

 

[ant75]

100% behind you Crowze.
Really really looking forward to it.

 

[ant75]

By the way, what stage of development are you at ? I assume your first priority is to get rid of all the dtas and rts little bugs, but after that will you be open for suggestions ? Cause i have a few ideas to solve some of the small dtas gameplay problems, or better enhance gameplay in general. Some should require few coding, some more, but i don't wanna suggest anything if it's too early, and have my hopes too high about stuff that is gonna be lost in forum history...
Anyway i'm very glad you've taken the development of dats over, cause i was about to make a new thread to plead with anyone to give dtas a new life. It's a shame so few people realise it's one the best thing that happened to inf since the new aiming system. I hope you will get some help with this project.

 

[Crowze]

Suggest away. I've not started rewriting DTAS (I've got a gametype which is basically TDM with RTS and NoSniperClass), so I'll be able to make any changes you can think need doing. I've included RTS as-is, but I could make changes if you feel it's necessary.

 

[(SDS)benmcl]

My only suggestion at this point is have it flexible through ini file is possible. I am sure you thought of that already. Number of attackers to cap, number of defenders in radius to prevent cap, horzontal radius, vertical radius, number players to kick in.

Anyways I'll shutup now before I try to complicate things to much. Really looking forward to this. This is what it will take for me to reinstall.

 

[yurch]

I'd toss out the ol' flag and use the briefcase instead, perhaps.
That is, if you are willing to ditch the 'area' problems and want to use a more intuitive approach. Give it a longish timer combined with perhaps some sort of way to decrease it with additional attackers standing nearby. Maybe they're yelling advice on which key the 'any' key is.

They've got to secure the area to safely play around with the briefcase in the first place.

 

[shan]

Any way to fix RTS with Manor Farm? I really miss that map.

 

[ant75]

I'm not sure about having very flexible ini configuration. In the beggining it might be good, just to figure out which settings are the best, but in the end it could become very confusing if every server has different rules.

 

[(SDS)benmcl]

I agree to that to a point but what will happen is that people will ask can I do such and such. Why did you set it to that? Can you change it? Avoid the hassle from the start. Just tell them to change it and bugger off.

Also varity is good. Advertise how your server is setup. Also use F2 key. People will figure it out. Anyways once an admin has a setup he likes people will get to know it and life will be good. People will know Server 1 is this, Server 2 is usually this etc...

Believe me it will save a lot of headaches later on. Look at the discussion on time and spawns with EAS. Now imagine if the admins could not easily change those settings.

 

[ant75]

Still i'm not sure about that. People usually complain when problems show up. Dtas was a really well balanced mutator and in the end everybody seemed to agree with the way it worked. "It's all about the balance"...

 

[w00p]

Dear god, no laptop. DTAS, flag capping all the way. If not for the gamestyle, do it for the nostalgia.
A laptop would require you to have yet another game where you have to hack a computer.
I'm not saying that you should use that UT red-glow flag, but without a flag and an area capture, its not DTAS.

You could use that flag texture from specialist played in CTF maps (the homebase of attackers).
If it glows red, blue or yellow, I don't give a turd, but atleast try to do something to make the flag stand out...
I mean, after all, its meant to be the glory of the defending army.
Maybe have a big pink flag?
Or anything with bright colours for that matter.

I miss DTAS.
I miss maps like slanska, deserttactics, industrialmayhem etc.
All in all, I miss the rav2 scene.

I feel like some redneck that ended up in the big city and is feeling homesick.

 

[fist_mlrs]

the laptop is ment to be a replacement mesh for the flag, you don't have to use it in this case

 

[w00p]

The laptop is something else that isn't DTAS.
A laptop only gametype? We have specialist. I want DTAS back!
DTAS is about capturing an area objective, marked by a flag.
I restate: I do not suggest to use that UT flag, but a flag. And preferrably a bright one too. (any country with bright colours in its flag, basicly almost every country in the world )

 

[ant75]

suggestions

Small ideas first :
- one of the things i found annoying with dtas is getting killed by nade spamming on open maps as soon as you've planted the flag. A way to limit that (not prevent, though) would be to simply delay the moment the flag is displayed on attackers hud (like a 15 secs delay). This way you could easily plant the flag on open space, and have about 15 second to take cover before the other team starts nading the whole place from the other side of the map.
- i think you should also emphasize the unpredictable aspect of the attackers job by making the command to show the distance to flag much more approximate : instead of giving the exact distance to flag, it would display approximate ranges that become more precise as you get closer to the flag (ie : +200m, 200-100m, 100-50m, 25-15m, and below 15 meters give the exact distance). But to make it up for it, there should be some kind of z-axis indication of the flag location, otherwise it's really a pain to find the flag in building with multiple floors. (on a side note, i don't think blind captures should be prevented, because it's an important tactical aspect of the game IMHO)

Now with the big idea. This is the one i would REALLY like to see implemented :
-->To make gameplay even more dynamic and unpredictable, defenders should able to de-plant and re-plant the flag anywhere they want. At the beginning of the round the flag would be automatically planted, just like it used to be, but after that any defender could grab it and take it someplace else. Of course we don't want dtas to become a game of cat and mouse, so there should be many restrictions to avoid any abuse of this (the purpose here is not to create a whole different gametype, simply bring more variety and randomness to the game without changing what we loved about dtas). Here are what the restrictions could be :
- when the flag is carried by a defender it would be displayed in a different color on the attackers hud, to show them the objective is being displaced
- you would de-plant and re-plant the flag by using the 'grab' key for a fairly large amount of time (like 30 seconds or even more)
- if the flag carrier is killed (suicide or by opposing team), attackers instantly win the round.
- the flag carrier would have very limited movement : he could only walk, and he would not be able to fire any weapon (so basically fleeing all alone with the flag would be suicide).
- there could be a maximum number of times the flag is moved during a round, and if it's not restrictive enough, there also could be a limited amount of time for which the flag could be carried.

(to avoid any confusion : the flag carrier is not a person designated at the beginning of the round, it's just any given defender currently carrying the flag)

This is something i've been thinking about for a while, and if it is ignored, i hope it will be because you think it's crap and not because it's too much work (if so, i will personnally beg on my knees other coders to help you).

 

[w00p]

I agree on the flag thing.
Though you should hurt the carryer's stamina like a spanked monkey. 30 seconds is too much IMO, I would say 10 would be better, since its not really an extremely big/high flag/flagpole. And I also agree that a flag carrier shouldn't be able to shoot.
Well, maybe allow a kabar and maybe a pistol, but basicly the aim of this feature is to make the flag carryer a sitting duck unless he has an extremely good team. I have a feeling that not much players will be all too eager to walk around with the flag.

Great idea though I wouldn't limit how far you can go/how long you can carry, because I guess in some maps that would really be a bummer if you have to do shifts with 3 players, 10 seconds in between, supported by nothing but an entirely wiped out team.

Ooh, and I just thought of something...
You could code something so the flag texture matches the country the defenders camo is based upon.
EG if the defenders where german, the flag would be german, if the defenders where australian, the flag would be australian etc.
All undefined (or unknown) camo's get the regular specialist flag.
This is do-able through a single serverside .ini file and a (series of) texture file(s) in wich the different flags are. So if the server has some pre-2.9 camo like the lebanon one, they could add a texture package to serverpackages and put the lebanon flag in it, and through that serverside .ini define that lebanon camo == lebanon flag.
I doubt it would be intensive to load a different flag texture according to camo's, and anyone who can manage to find himself a flag texture, convert it to a 256*256 .pcx and import and save it into his own custom texture pack, together with a few other flags and edit the ini to set it up, can make this work.

Not too much to ask, unless there's something I am missing out.

Oh, and one more thing: When a flag carryer gets shot, Don't have the attackers instantly win the round please.
Let it drop on the ground (different model) just lieing there untill one of the teams "capture" it. Normally this should be defenders unless the defending team sucks donkeyballs or the flag carryer(who is now dead) decided to run off with the flag without telling anyone.
If attackers capture(walk over) the flag lying on the ground, they win, if defenders capture it, the defender that captured it (walked over it) becomes flag carryer, maybe with a 5 second boost to get the hell out of there.
Now, it is quite balanced, because you could say its an "exploit" when the defenders don't pick up the fallen flag and defend it as it is, being able to pick it up and run away immediately if the situation starts to heat up.
This isn't true, since any attacker that has sneaked up on the flag, and then launches a quick rush to the flag, can win the game instantly, so them defenders better play safe, and replant it, or pay a whole lot of attention with a bigger risk and let it be on the ground.

An alternative posibility: the atackers don't win the round when they walk over a fallen flag, but rather pick it up and run away with the same rules, only less of a stamina downage. Then have to replant it themselves with a different flag texture (eg the exact same texture, but with a red cross through it, or the flag upside-down, or any other signal marking). Offcourse, this alternative, "defeated" flag would have to be in the texture pack of the original flag too.
Only THEN, they win the round.

 

[ant75]

It's probably way too early to discuss about that (since crowze hasn't given his opinion yet), but i still think there should be a lot of restrictions to that feature, and the instant victory for the attackers if flag carrier is killed seems like a really important one. What i don't want above all is dtas becoming a game of hide and seek, where the whole purpose is for the defenders to avoid contact and for the attackers to run after the flag carrier. Moving the flag to another location should only happen when strictly necessary (eg when it has been badly planted or when retreat is the only way out). If the flag gets moved every round then it won't be fun, it shouldn't happen more than 1 out of 3 rounds IMHO : it should remain an option for the defenders, not their main goal.

edit : i forgot the main reason why the attackers should win if flag carrier is killed : imagine if the flag carrier falls into a death zone (eg : fire) or in a deep inaccessible hole (think canyon in chasm) ! We don't want that to become a new tactic in clan matches !

 

[Crowze]

Can someone tell me what the ini setting in TDM is for the number of rounds?

I've almost got this thing working, the flag isn't actually showing up (not sure why) but it's showing on the compass, just want to add the distance to that. Otherwise, it's working fine.