American Politics

[MP*Beretta]

This is a little off topic, but I think it can be justified as it relates specifically to the mindset of Infiltration players.

I was hanging out on the #infiltration channel the other day, and noticed a conversation heavily biased against Bush & the Republican party. This made me curious:

The Republicans are generally pro gun ownership, whereas the Democrats are extremely anti gun ownership, and this coming election is slated to be crucial to the continuing ability of Americans to maintain their 2nd Amendment rights - the Democrat agenda is to pursue the registration of firearms, which many believe will lead to licensing and then confiscation (as it did in England and Australia).

How can you vote anything other than Republican, regardless of other issues, if you are in favour of keeping your 2nd Amendment rights (as I'm going to assume most Infiltration players are)?

Moderators: feel free to move/delete this thread in a while, but a day or so of it being here would be interesting...

 

[Zundfolge]

frankly I think there are plenty of non gun related reasons to vote Republican too. (yeah, I'm votin for GW, I voted for his Dad, and I voted for Regan too, so sue me).

I think the 2nd amendment is a much missunderstood issue, and to defend it is to defe nd all of the 1st 10 (the bill of rights) believe me if the government succesfully takes out guns, our freedom of speech, religion, freedom from unreasonable search & siezure, all of them will be taken 1 by 1 (and us 'mericans will just have to stand ther e, unarmed, unable to fight back)


As to why so many INF players are pro-democrat? well it's cause they're young.

To Quote Otto Von Bismark..
"If you're not a socialist by the time you're 20 you have no heart, if you're still a socialist when you're 30 you have no brain."

(sorry for the edit, had to fix some stupid spelling errors)

[This message was edited by Zundfolge on Sep 14, 2000 at 23:26.]

[This message was edited by Zundfolge on Sep 14, 2000 at 23:27.]

 

[Katton]

3 words.

Move.To.Canada


'Nuff said.

<img src="http://www.angelfire.com/pop/katton/Katton.gif" height="30" width="81" border="0">

"You can run, but you'll only die tired."

 

[KillDawg]

Does his coke addiction bother you any?

 

[Zundfolge]

Yeah, lets all move to Canada. The land of socalized medicine and opressive gun registration (registration always leads to confiscation, just ask the aussies).

I think I'll stay here on my sinking ship, thank you. Hell in a few years we'll be just like Canada, oh well at least you all got good beer and you had the sense to run off that Michael J. Fox character (I still haven't forgiven Canada for him).


Although I'd love to visit Canada someday, my wife went to Vancover years ago and it sounds beautiful /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Disclaimer: this is all in good fun; no Canadians were harmed in the typing of this post.

 

[Alpha_9]

I support a lot of what Gov. G.W. Bush proposes, but my problem is I just don't trust him to stand up for the environment. Especially living in Wash State, I don't want to see logging companies being invited to go back to looting our old growth forests. Or oil companies being allowed to ruin our last, great pristine wilderness area in Alaska. Or land developers being allowed to drain wetlands which are crucial to maintaining clean water, not to mention many endangered species.

I can't imagine the damage a Rupublican trifecta in Wash D.C. would do to the environment & our natural heritage. I'm all for free enterprise. I usually favor free-market solutions to problems. But I don't want America in 20 years to be made up of nothing but cities, suburbs, golf courses and ranches.

As far as gun ownership rights are concerned, given the fact that it's a right coded into the Constitution itself, it would take another amendment for the feds to outlaw guns here in the states. That's the difference between us and the British, Aussies, or Canadians. They have no constitutional right to bear arms. We do. And I'm certain such an amendment to repeal it could never pass, no matter who was President. I certainly wouldn't support it. And I highly doubt mainstream Democrats would either for that matter.

So that's why I'm voting for Gore/Leiberman.
<h2><font face="symbol">
a 1001</font></h2>
"Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee."

John Donne

 

[jaunty]

ok ok ok hold up usin my country as an example without knowing the truth

i've seen the ads that the NRA run, murders and crime didn't go up after the gun buyback, they actually went down, but as a counter, knife related murders/crimes went up, so then we banned anyuone under 16 buying knives

and our guns were'nt confiscated until a skitzophrenic (literally shitzophrenic)went on a rampage with "a semi automatic weapon of large caliber" and slaughtered 21 people

and even then the only reason the scheme was brought into place was because elections were looming and the hippies were starting to get violent

the regestrations actually worked quite well in terms of preserving owner's rights but still having some sort of control, well unti the port athur massacre anyway

if it's alcoholics ANONYMOUS, why do they always stand up and tell u their name ??? <img src=http://geocities.com/r337m0nk3y/cwm/killtard.gif>

 

[MP*Beretta]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>As far as gun ownership rights are concerned, given the fact that it's a right coded into the Constitution itself, it would take another amendment for the feds to outlaw guns here in the states.[/quote]

However, just how that right could be defined is questionable. Perhaps magazine capacity, now limited to 10 rounds, will decrease to 5 or even a single shot. Perhaps a semi-auto pistol will be defined as an `assault weapon', and will be banned in some/all states. They're already calling the SKS an assault weapon, and it hasn't even got a selector.

Perhaps .22 will be deemed `enough'. Perhaps we'll be only be allowed to buy black powder rifles. The number of `perhapses' is terrifying.

 

[MiscMan]

Well, i dont like George W. Bush. I hate him, and i dont give a crap that he's pro gun. He'd make a weak president. He's also offensive, an alchoholic, angry, inept to be president, crack addict, unstable, rude, and many other things that i cant remember. Gore is intelligent, gets into the issues, cares about what he does, almost as good a politician as clinton, cares about the environment, cares about popular opinion, and the list goes on. As far as i can tell the only way Bush could get into office is due to either party voting, name recognition, ignorance to the issues and politics, or possibly better advertisement.

See, what it seems to me(and someone who works for a congressmen) is that the Republicans WANT bush to be weak. Bush is aided by the fact that he haded the weakest Governership(texas) before, and also that he doesnt really care about other people. Though i refrained from attacking Bush personally before, i am doing it now. He is unfit to be a president of even moderate influence. The Republicans would probably just have fewer roadblocks to get their bills, laws, whatever passed.

Im not saying im a democrat, i would have voted for McCain if he had stayed in the race, but i just dont like Bush. I hate bush, would be a better way of saying it. He cant even answer simple questions. Damnit, i cant believe someone said they would vote for bush, then back it up by saying the voted for his father and then reagen. /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

----

-MiscMan

Everyone is a hypocrite, except me.

 

[T101]

Well, believe it or not, I'm a pretty peaceful man.
I don't like weapons, except in games. In my country - Holland - there hasn't been much need for guns, and there seems to be less violent crime.

Thing with banning weapons (I'm not just talking guns here) is that in theory, you could prevent violent crime by arresting illegal gun owners, before they commit the actual crime.

With respect to the other rights: we still have all of them. (Well, last time I counted, anyway /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

But realistically, I don't think it is even possible to get the gun out of the American home - there are just too many of them. Also, distances in Holland are much smaller, meaning the police are probably close-by.

An interesting thought, though: Almost all Americans seem to vote for either the Republicans or the Democrats, and after that, they still feel the need to defend themselves against their elected government...

All things considered, I'm glad that there are Americans - without them, the Dutch would be speaking German now - but I'm also glad that I don't have to live in America

Earth, Soul, Rock 'n Roll

 

[Warren]

::takes off gold stars::

Well first off, I want to say I'm not voting this year. I think both candidates have portrayed themselves as the perfect example to the future of our political system, and it ain't pretty. Now I seriously doubt Bush is a crack addict or unstable. If he's an alcoholic, well, even recovering alchoholics are still considered to be an alcoholic, and frankly, if he's sober now, that's his business. I still don't care for his personna nor do I agree with him on everything, and I also think McCain should be in his spot- one thing's for sure, there would be no dead heat reflected in the polls. I was raised Republican.. I was also raised Catholic, but that doesn't mean I'm practicing.. I don't believe in voting Republican because Reagan and the first Bush were good prez's. I think they were, in that order, but them'z some serious shoes to fill.

On the other hand, I hardly think Gore is that much better. From what I've seen in the news every day and read in the paper, I'm not impressed. As an ex-military member, Gore hasn't a fucking clue what he's talking about. Cheney was right about what he said about the military, and I'll easily have words with anyone who thinks otherwise. I also don't think he's as good a politician as Clinton is. I didn't vote for Clinton and don't think his work as president deserves the credit for America's "prosperity." But he's a damn fine politician. I remember listening to an interview between two newspaper editors and one said it best- he said that the American people will have a hard time going from Clinton, who really is quite saavy and good at being political, to either of the other two candidates who just don't have that winning personality.

Nope, I'm not voting this year. Either candidate will fill the gap for the next 4 years. The country will still continue on the same path it was before. Unless either one fails miserably at foriegn policy, I don't see imminent demise coming any sooner than it would have. Pretty depressing- I think McCain could have at least added that excitement people my age need to keep us interested in our government. I would have gladly served - and died - for my country, but it has nothing to do with Republican or Democrat.

::tacks on gold stars::

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[DeadeyeDan[ToA]]

"Gore is intelligent"

Uh...

Oh, yea of course, he invented the internet, right? /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Both he and Clinton are complete morons, IMHO. I honestly don't know how they can just spout some buzz-words and make empty promises, then take credit for things they had nothing to do with, and flat out lie in Reader's Digest interviews (or courtrooms in Clinton's case), and somehow make the American public like them.

Granted, Bush has some big problems too, and if I could decide who would be president it wouldn't be either of them... but unfortunately one or the other is going to win and there's no way around it, so I'd vote for the son of the drug lord just to do what I can to prevent Gore from winning. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif (And that's my response to T101's comment, unfortunately this godddamn 2 party system is forcing us to pick the lesser of 2 evils instead of who we really want.)

As for gun control... yes, we do have 2nd amendment to protect us a bit. Unfortunately the meaning of the amendment has been badly misconstrued, and we now have several, enforced laws on the books that are in violation of the 2nd amendment. All they have to do is do what they have done on a larger scale, and our gun rights are practically abolished. What good is a single shot, no magazine (just one in the chamber and then reload), .22 short rifle with no aiming devices that must be under lock and key 95% of the time?

"Thing with banning weapons (I'm not just talking guns here) is that in theory, you could prevent violent crime by arresting illegal gun owners, before they commit the actual crime."

The thing is gun smuggling and black market buying attract very little attention from the police. For every 1 druggie caught here in the US because he got strung out, ran through traffic, and bit a cop, there's god knows how many illegal drug transactions that the cops are oblivious to. Same deal with illegal guns, they don't attract attention before anything really bad happens. And there's people out there that would never hurt anyone but own illegal weapons (and I say more power to them).

_______________________
Shot four puppet governors in a line,
Shook all tha world bankers, who think they can rhyme,
Shot the landlords, who knew it was mine,
Yes, its a war from the depth of time!

[This message was edited by DeadeyeDan[ToA] on Sep 15, 2000 at 17:54.]

 

[Zundfolge]

Before being poisoned by his association with Clinton, Gore was actualy an honerable man. He used to be pro-gun, pro-life and anti big-government (and pro-tobacco). But he has learned from Billie boy, that if you sell out to the left you get elected as a democrat.

If Gore had never been a part of the Clinton administration, I wouldn't feel too bad if he wins (I still wouldn't vote for him). But I think the old adage "If you sleep with the dogs, you wake up with fleas." holds true here, he's picked up too many of "Slick Willie's" methods, and I don't trust him.

As for Bush, He's not the best possible Republican we could have picked (but the best ones aren't running) I'd really like to see JC Watts up there, or Liddy Dole (if you can run the Red Cross, and put up with Bob now that he's on Viagra, you should be able to handle the whitehouse). I could come up with a long list of republicans I'd rather have in the white house then GW, but I don't want Gore there. And it's not so much Al Gore that I don't like, it's the cavalcade of dumbasses he'll bring on board, people like Barbera Boxer, and Queasy Enfume (no I don't know how to spell his name).

On a side note I'm real glad Pat Buchanen left the party (now if we can just get rid of Jessie Helms maybe we can get something done.)


Hey, maybe we can get Charlton Hesston to run.