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A simple observation

Discussion in 'Unreal Tournament 3' started by SealClubber, Mar 13, 2006.

  1. SealClubber

    SealClubber Not biased

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    Unreal Tournament, heck all recent FPS for that matter... Are like supermodels. Sure, they are pretty with the graphics and the technology like the models are with the makeup and the fancy clothing. But deep within the core of the game - down deep where reality sets in and the maps that come out are sub-par and the gameplay just doesnt feel the same as the original, the community doesnt fully engulf the mod and custom map scene, thier PC's cant keep up witht he tech.. In relation to the supermodel = she hasnt eaten a full meal in weeks, she forces herself to throwup to make herself get that edge, blinded by people that tell her she is beautiful at 95 pds... shes on drugs etc etc. Both the game and the supermodel are like of lost, looking great but not feeling so...


    Am I making sense if not just for a little bit? I dunno, it is late here and I have been up since 5am. I would hope to have some of the old guards that have been here from UT to reply here as well.



    :404:
     
  2. zeitgeber

    zeitgeber New Member

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    how do u define sub par? what u dont like others may love. if a game feels like the original y play the new one? just look at Quake4. hell look at ut99 and ut2kx. ppl who didnt like ut2kx stuck to ut99 but 2kx is by no means a bad game with only better graphics. for more recent games like FEAR and CS:S are great games to play and look at. i for one like some eye candy in my games and models :D
     
  3. flo0tz

    flo0tz New Member

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    The same simple observation all of us have already noticed and discussed in countless other threads.

    But yes you are right, at least epic has already said they're not just putting all their time and effort into the pretty graphics.
     
  4. BeMyMonkey

    BeMyMonkey Village Idiot

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    That may be true for a few games, but I can't see how you can say that's true about the UT series...
     
  5. B

    B Bee

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    I don't think you've ever played UT2003....(or 2k4 for that matter)
     
  6. BeMyMonkey

    BeMyMonkey Village Idiot

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    2003 as soon as it came out, 2k4 as soon as it came out... I just don't agree with all the "Meh UT2Kx suxxorz ut99 was da bomb!" people like you... 2k3 and 2k4 are completely different from ut99, but not in a bad way IMO...
     
  7. ExiT

    ExiT hella lurker

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    Agreed for ut2k3 maybe...I never expected gameplay to feel the same as the original, but it just wasn't as fun as ut1. I think they did things a lot better in ut2k4 but it was kind of late. They should have waited the extra year to develop ut2k4 and released as ut2k3.

    Oh well, we've been tallking about this ever since the ut2k3 demo came out. I think they learned a lot in the past couple years, and I am excited for ut2k7. I like what I see from the videos: gameplay seems a lot less bouncy and bloated and more like the high-speed in-your-face ut1 gameplay. I hope they make physics as big a part of the actual gameplay as possible. That'll really put it ahead.
     
  8. Selerox

    Selerox COR AD COR LOQVITVR

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    Klafsky! Gimme a friggen break! </Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back>

    Actually, they've more recently stated that they've taken resources from the games development team and shunted it into the Engine Development side. Hardly gameplay over graphics.

    Also, I'd like to point out that at no point have Epic shut up about how good their engine is. Just about one of the only meaningful article about the gameplay has been the PCZone UK article, and that was 10 months ago.

    That article's worth mentioning actually, because it now looks to be horribly dated due to Epic dropping features, and it's now clear that the game might not show for another year or more, so pretty much anything in the article is totally open to question now.

    Makes me wonder why I bothered to scan it...
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2006
  9. Lopar-XL

    Lopar-XL Currently trying to mend my mind, etc.

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    UT2007 IS NOT OUT YET! GET A FREAKIN' CLUE! :violin: :mad:

    Yes, I will agree that substance is more important than style. It goes without saying that the games after the first UT are different from the original. Would you want the exact same thing over and over again? Anyways, the sequels have recieved a tremendous amount of support from the mod community over the years. Time will tell for Unreal Tournament 2007 and others.
     
  10. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    The problem isn't just that 'recent' games are like supermodels.
    It's also that the first game (whether it be Quake, Doom, Unreal, Halo, etc) was your 'one true love' ... there's a really really small chance a new game can ever re-capture that feeling again.

    By comparing it with that first game (and also by being blind to its flaws) it is next to impossible for anyone to ever like the new one.

    I'd even say that what you are seeing in those new games aren't (new) flaws in those games. In reality they're the flaws that were present in the old one as well. The new games may have crappier maps, but they've got better weapon-balance for example ...

    And as for mods/communities. Part of the problem is that everyone expects mods to deliver quality, while no one wants to take on the (increasing) workload required.

    And to finish it off : there simply are more games to play compared to the "good ol' days". So mods have to compete not just with each other, but also with real (not so buggy and certainly more complete) commercial games while there amount of spare time hasn't increased (in fact it probably has decreased as the average gamer got older ... ).
     
  11. DeathBooger

    DeathBooger Malcolm's Sugar Daddy

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    Prey could be the best FPS game this year, they actually had the balls to try new things. The UT series is fun because when something gets old there are other things to try right in front of you, and when that thing gets old, you can go back to the original thing. I did ONS>CTF>ONS>vCTF>ONS>TAM>BR>TAM for two whole years.
     
  12. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    Prey as the best fps of this year ? excuse me while I laugh ...
    From what I've seen it's nothing more than Doom 3 with new monsters, a semi-original gravity-feature for maps and a new excuse to have monsters spawn behind your back.

    It might have a chance if there were a need to chose 'best fps' even if the overall quality of everything else released in this year sucked and we had to chose one.

    /me I'd prefer waiting for something really new/good before giving it the 'best fps of the year'-tag. And so far I haven't seen or heard of anything that has a chance (altough Oblivion has a chance).
     
  13. DeathBooger

    DeathBooger Malcolm's Sugar Daddy

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    Yeah, you didn't read much then. Oblivion isn't a FPS.
     
  14. Trynant

    Trynant Manic Brawler

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    Seriously, Oblivion is not a shooter.

    It is indeed a simple observation that graphics won't last and that gameplay is what will matter in the end. It's such a simple observation that thousands of other people started thousands of other threads on a thousand different games relating to the exact same point. There is still open room for debate, however, in this dead and beaten horse.

    Will UT2007 have that ever-so-needed gameplay? I think it will. I enjoyed UT2003 for all its quirks and like UT2004 as much as the original (that's right, I said it). I treasure Unreal Tournament in all it's shock combo flavors.

    Reasons why I think it will work?

    1: Epic Games is making it. Their track record speaks for them.

    2: We've seen what it looks like. I saw some good signs showing it'll be better than UT2003 at least!

    3: It's not released yet. Why do I think that's a good sign. It means Epic isn't rushing things. Jeff Morris stated that they were willing to call the game Unreal Tournament 2008 if they had to.

    4: There hasn't been any Nazis so far.

    5: Mark Rein isn't directly involved with the game. No two weeks for you!

    6: If the game doesn't play as great as our high standards will allow, we've still got a very capable engine with a strong mod community (we'd all be fooling ourselves if we think there aren't people that'll make maps/mods/skins/tacos for this game).

    7: We aren't the ones developing the game. That's gotta be a plus! [/jk]

    IMO, if you want to know whether or not this game will be more of a game than graphics, it'll take more than simple observations.
     
  15. DeathBooger

    DeathBooger Malcolm's Sugar Daddy

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    Like I said before, wait until E3 to make more observations about UT2007, we're still arguing about year old pre-alpha stuff for no reason.
     
  16. chillypacman

    chillypacman New Member

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    Though its true, soon after all the polygons bleed into your sub conscience and you realize your not having fun you tend to stop playing. I mean for instance a guy who will play ut 2007 at 60fps everythign maxed out twice over isnt going to enjoy the game anymore than someone playing the game at 800*600 barely at 30fps. However its quite obvious that the better the graphics of a game is the more likely it is to sell (what with the sweet pictures behind the box and all), so yeah it stinks but you have to deal with it.

    thats true, I dont care what anyone says epic is improving graphics and that is their priority all throughout
    http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=58139 this is for all you 'snobs' out there. Yes I put snobs in quotations for a reason...


    Finally let me settle all the brubaha, ut 99 was better than ut 2k3 and 2k4 because 2k3 lacked the originality in terms of map design, I mean good golly in ut 99 I stormed beaches, jumped off a helicopter onto a speeding train and fragged a super monster outside a spaceship flying at lightspeed! Then comes ut 2k3 and none of the maps cut it, 2k4 made up for 2k3's lacking with some great maps which improved the gameplay, and made it more fun to play.

    but I think epic learned one very special thing with 2k3: Gameplay at the end of the day does matter no matter how little or much but if its going to suck then dont bother.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2006
  17. BarneyGumball

    BarneyGumball Just Another User

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    Gameplay is important but would you play a game now days that had the UT1 engine?

    I think not...

    Graphics and Gameplay are both important but i don't want super gameplay with me being able to set it too 1millionx1million resolution and still be able to play fine...
     
  18. JaFO

    JaFO bugs are features too ...

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    which is exactly my point ... as a 'first person based game' it quite easily outclasses anything else planned so far.

    Id-software had the same track record ... they're practically dead now.
    This may very well their last chance to prove they can build decent games, but at least they write good engines.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2006
  19. ShakeZula

    ShakeZula New Member

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  20. Entr0p1cLqd

    Entr0p1cLqd New Member

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    There was an Unreal Engine based game called Devastation that had physics on pretty much everything in network games. No-one ran the physics though because it chewed through too much CPU power.

    As a game, it was OK although pretty buggy. I enjoyed it anyway despite its faults. But the physics features of themselves weren't enough to save the game from oblivion.
     

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