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2.86 Vaporware - Stop patronizing us!

Discussion in 'General Infiltration Discussion' started by Alchymia, Jul 24, 2001.

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  1. Alchymia

    Alchymia New Member

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    I'm sick and tired of looking at the news page and seeing this garbage about the vapor-release of 2.86. All this crap like, "lot's of amazing things coming together" telling us nothing. I want 2.86, and not to be patronized like a 12 year old.

    I think it's insulting to talk about all the work you're doing for weapons model of the Minimi for future versions. ("It's about 85% finshed...". I've worked in the software industry for 10 years, and I can't EVER imagine telling my boss or users that I was working on the next project before finishing the current one. Especialy when it's sooooo behind schedule. Now all this hushed talk and veiled hints about the possibility of 2.85.6? Excuse me if I call bullsh*t and loudly proclaim, "What the fu*k?".

    It's simple: F*ck gamespy. F*ck the CD. F*ck the Minimi model, f*ck all that sh*t. Get the ping down and remove the bugs. How many diehard INF players have to say this before we get 2.86?

    The point of this email? Yeah, I want to vent my frustrations, but I also want to discuss with other users how we can collectively force this team to do a better job of estimating project requirements, prioritizing their tasks, and meeting their critical milestones. Let's hear it folks? Do you feel patronized? Am i the only one that remembers that almost every release has been late and not included all of what was promised? How can they hope to get VC $$$ with such shoddy project management?

    I love INF, and I thank the dev team for spending all this time on it, but I won't tell them that, as a team, they're doing a great job because, frankly, they aren't.

     
  2. RogueLeader

    RogueLeader Tama-chan says, "aurf aurf aurf!"

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    I hope this is a joke...

    You took a wrong turn at www.counter-strike.net
    I suggest that if you think they are doing a bad job with giving you hundreds of hours of free entertainment, then you shut the **** up and go make your own mod. What kind of moron would say something that doesn't even have a schedule is behind schedule?
     
  3. -=-SDS=- Lust

    -=-SDS=- Lust Boo!

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    I hope it's a joke to.....if not just remember....ITS FREE YOU MONKEY....... Thank you.
     
  4. The_Fur

    The_Fur Back in black

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    I find the "Shut up and make your own mod comment" just as idiotic as that which prtomted this thread. Yes it is anoying but show a little respect please. If you think you can force them to do anything you are sadly mistaken, it doesn't work this way and since you have worked in the software industry for 10 years (as if) you should know that.
     
  5. Alchymia

    Alchymia New Member

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    How easily we forget.....

    I'd be happy to pay - stop with the altruism BS. Let's see a better product, not these rationializations. BTW - What is counterstrike? Dick....
     
  6. Draco-1

    Draco-1 I've been to hell, and I spell it DMV.

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    Alchymia.. 5 posts.. hmm.. Lessee.. I'd say.. TROLL.

    Go away. We don't need your flak. If you don't like knowing what's comming up, then just don't come here. It's obvious by your post count (5) that you don't spend a lot of time on the message board. SO why don't you just go find something better to do with your time?

    Personally, I like knowing what's comming up, and where the INF Team plans to go with this mod.

    What erks me is that if the INF team DIDN'T post that update, people would be posting why there ISN'T news.

    Oh, and troll, let's not forget that these people have LIVES. They don't spend all day working on this mod so that you can play it. THey have jobs, school, families and other responsibilities that are FAR more important than slaving away to satisfy someone like you. I've wated over a year, and so far the results have been worth that wait.. I'm willing to wait longer.

    So sit down, shut up, and be a good little boy, because we're not here to take your kind of BS, and thankfully, neither is the INF team.
     
  7. Alpha_9

    Alpha_9 Infiltration lead level designer

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    ROFLMAO!!!

    OK, this has GOT to be a first... Someone complaining about getting too much info in the news updates... Yeah, people always bitch there aren't enough updates & there isn't enough info, but too much??? :D

    Well it goes to show you can't please everyone...

    As for the other complaints, as someone above correctly pointed out, we are not on a set schedule producing this mod. I defy you to find any place where an actual team member, let alone Warren himself, gave a date for the release of 2.86.

    You may have 10 years of experience in the software business, but as of yet, INF is not a retail project. How much experience do you have working on a free mod? This is something that a team of folks are doing in their free time, between their real jobs and real lives. It's something we take pride in, and work at until we get it right. Then we release it. In the mean time we release info to keep all you INF'ers out there updated, so you know it's coming along. And we still get complaints fairly often that it's not enough. And now here there's a complaint that it's too much...

    Well it looks like we've struck some sort of balance at least! ;)
     
  8. Warren

    Warren Infiltration Project Coordinator

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    I was asked to delete this thread, but it wouldn't do any good. What can I tell you? Sorry. Sorry we don't work on this full time. Sorry we don't have enough free time to make you happy. Sorry we can't tell our wives and bosses that real life will have to wait for Infiltration because it's THE most important thing, ya know. Sorry we- or I- don't live up to the standards you've set based on the rules I have to live by. Rules that each member of the team has to abide by. Rules that help pay the rent and put food on the table that give us the free time to do stuff like Infiltration.

    There's no money coming into this project- nothing that's going to change the rules so we can work faster, harder, and more efficiently. But honestly- in all seriousness- I would, no doubt about it, rather my people enjoy themselves and do what they can when they can then overburden them with people who lack enough common sense to see the bigger picture. Nothing any fan says or does is going to change that. Infiltration doesn't dictate our lives, but rather provides a creative output for bigger and better things. Granted, it didn't start that way- originally it was something to do- it evolved into a passion- and now the fun we find in the project has evolved with it. It's a different kind of fun than it was when this all started.

    At any rate, I'm not going to change anyone's minds or opinions on this. Obviously we're the ones living in a vacuum when we consider Infiltration as a project rather than a cultural experience. God help me if I spend 10 years in this business and begin to think otherwise.
     
  9. TinkyWinky

    TinkyWinky New Member

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    Well if your looking to get flamed you posted 1 for the record books. And it is obvious to me that you have no clue about the software industry. Pick up a PC mag or read any of your choice of developer sites and see how they post updates of there up and coming goodies. I'd say you are some 1 this community does NOT need. Good riddins.
     
  10. The_Fur

    The_Fur Back in black

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    Guys I think he got the point.
     
  11. [121st]Burton

    [121st]Burton full-auto SIG abuser

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    There are NO release dates or whatsoever given, so the team cannot be late.

    Doing a new model needs a) modelling b) coding and c) animating. All those steps are done by different people.
    Fixing the bugs needs most of the time pure coding, so Beppo has his hands full of work, while the modellers, animators and texture artists have nothing to do. But because the team is looking into the future, too, and does NOT just do one Patch at a time, the guys without work concetrate on new things.

    I think, everyone has to admit, that after 2.85 the patches have been rushed a little. Bugs were fixed, but others appeared. That was bad, but **** happens. I think, they learned their lesson the hard way, but they learned it. 2.86 will NOT be rushed and beta-tested through out.
    I also want to play INF without bugs, but I happyly wait another 8 weeks to get a bugfree and brilliant V2.86

    EDIT: Damn...5 posts while I wrote all this....
     
  12. Bad.Mojo

    Bad.Mojo Commander in Chief o' the BMA

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    <i>I'm sick and tired of looking at the news page and seeing this garbage about the vapor-release of 2.86. All this crap like, "lot's of amazing things coming together" telling us nothing. I want 2.86, and not to be patronized like a 12 year old.</i>

    It tells us plenty, you troglodytic piece of grab-asstic sludge. It tells us lots of amazing, wonderful things are coming together, which is the exact same thing we knew before all the other versions were released. What those amazing things are is a mystery for sure, but its like Christmas (or Chanukkah for you Jew INF'ers,) its a surprise in every fu<i></i>cking box.

    <i>I think it's insulting to talk about all the work you're doing for weapons model of the Minimi for future versions. ("It's about 85% finshed...". I've worked in the software industry for 10 years, and I can't EVER imagine telling my boss or users that I was working on the next project before finishing the current one. Especialy when it's sooooo behind schedule. Now all this hushed talk and veiled hints about the possibility of 2.85.6? Excuse me if I call bullsh*t and loudly proclaim, "What the fu*k?".</i>

    I think its insulting to claim you worked in the software industry for ten years, when you're obviously a nine year old. I suppose you couldv'e worked in the industry as a feotus... maybe had your father not shoved a keyboard into your mother's cooz hole in the first trimester you wouldn't be so goddamn brain damaged. Here's a newflash for the intelligence impaired. Working on the minimi now is important because it keeps people like you from bitching in the next release that it doesn't work properly and maybe they should fix it before telling us they're adding new models that masturbate as an idle animation or whatever.

    <i>It's simple: F*ck gamespy. F*ck the CD. F*ck the Minimi model, f*ck all that sh*t. Get the ping down and remove the bugs. How many diehard INF players have to say this before we get 2.86?</i>

    You want the ping down, and you obviously, like a petulent child, want it down <i><b>NOW!</i></b>, yet you want to wait longer for 2.86 instead of a 2.85.6 patch... I don't know what kind of magical, "we only fix problems with really large updates" software industry you work in, but this is how its done: First, you fix the problems that <i>need</i> to be fixed with a small patch (like lag and bugs and sh<i></i>it), then you add in all the goodies you wanted. And here's a thought, maybe the team could get it done faster if they didn't have to wipe your snot nose every time you throw a fit because your milk wasn't warm enough or you stepped on your transformer toys or whatever.

    <i>The point of this email? Yeah, I want to vent my frustrations, but I also want to discuss with other users how we can collectively force this team to do a better job of estimating project requirements, prioritizing their tasks, and meeting their critical milestones. Let's hear it folks? Do you feel patronized? Am i the only one that remembers that almost every release has been late and not included all of what was promised? How can they hope to get VC $$$ with such shoddy project management?</i>

    No, I don't feel patronized -- at least not by the team. With thousands of posts and over a year on these boards under my belt, i feel patronized by cum gargling pieces of trash like yourself, pieces of garbage dump refuse who do nothing but whine nonstop from your self-righteous high horse and still think you can do a better job than the people actually working on the mod. Yeah, I remember when releases were late and whatnot, and how stuff was missing out from them -- but guess what, its better to have a late release with less stuff in them that works, than it is to have a forced early release with plenty of goods in them that don't work because instead of developing the codes and functions, they were forced to spend more of what little time they have to put all the crap in that people "who are being patronized" seem to want so bad.

    <i>I love INF, and I thank the dev team for spending all this time on it, but I won't tell them that, as a team, they're doing a great job because, frankly, they aren't.</i>

    You're right, of course. They're doing a damn shi<b></b>tty job of everything. People who are working part time on developing a stand-alone total conversion and not getting paid, who have had tighter deadlines and less late releases than most major full-time, full-salary game companies, are doing a terrible job. Sorry chief, but I'll need a crowbar and some KY jelly to get your head unlodged from your ass.
     
  13. Alpha_9

    Alpha_9 Infiltration lead level designer

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    Mojo!!!

    Hey Bud, good to see you again... :)
     
  14. poaw

    poaw You used to sleep easy at night.

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    To anwser your question; No I do not feel patronized anymore than with any other entertainment software product. The standard with any product on the market these days is hype, even though the INF doesn't have the quanity it does have the quality, the news they post makes us hopeful for future versions of INF.

    I also fail to see why you declare 2.86 as vaporware, when it hasn't even been a good 2 months since 2.85.5 was released. the longer they work on it, the more that comes out of it. I'm sure someone who has been in the software industry as long as you have can understand that.

    The INF team could probably put out an update once a day with 25 lines of code and two frames of animation on it. But it wouldn't be worth it.
     
  15. Alchymia

    Alchymia New Member

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    Draco-1 will settle...

    It seems I've hit a nerve. I'm sick of these sheep like Draco-1who kneel down and suck on this pitifully small and wrinkled dick called INF 2.85.5.

    I will sit down "like a good boy", but first I will say this: I can't wait when Unreal2 comes out around early 2002 ...And you lamers will be riding these message boards every 15 minutes between now and then waiting for 2.85.9....

    Seriously, at what point will the developers cut and run when a more attractive engine becomes available? You don't see many people working on maintaining Quake II mods, these days, do you? This product is missing it's window, and will be remembered as the game that "could have been". Mark my words....

    lol, in your face, obnoxiously, forever...
     
  16. The_Fur

    The_Fur Back in black

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    *sigh*
     
  17. OpFor

    OpFor Feeling suicide, thats O.K.

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    Alcymia did have a bit of a point, about the orginization of the project, It's O.K, but come on, the team is trying to work on EAS, the SAW, inertia sytem, then bugs? I'd personaly prefer that the take it one at a time, 1) bugs from older version 2) any new features 3) fix bugs in the new features, then 3) any extra loose ends to tie up. Currently, their working on a weapon thats probably not even going to be in 2.90? And not consentrating on the current version that they said somewhere, I think, that it'll be out soonish? Sure, INF is great, and free, but that doesn't mean the team is ALWAYS right, and you shouldn't defie them in any way. Err, Alcymia, show some respect next time you post, you'd get ALOT better respones.
     
  18. Bad.Mojo

    Bad.Mojo Commander in Chief o' the BMA

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    <i>It seems I've hit a nerve. I'm sick of these sheep like Draco-1who kneel down and suck on this pitifully small and wrinkled dick called INF 2.85.5.</i>

    Wow, shades of Aussie Joe and Pojo X -- anybody who doesn't agree with you is a sheep, huh? Wow, the wit involved to come up with that. Its almost as clever as you calling things "dick".

    <i>I will sit down "like a good boy", but first I will say this: I can't wait when Unreal2 comes out around early 2002 ...And you lamers will be riding these message boards every 15 minutes between now and then waiting for 2.85.9.... </i>

    Sure thing, Free Willy. We'll ride these message boards every 15 minutes, just like we ride your grandmother every 14. She's wrinkled and sloppy though, and she kinda smells like Ben-Gay. But hey, free sex is free sex, you know.

    <i>Seriously, at what point will the developers cut and run when a more attractive engine becomes available? You don't see many people working on maintaining Quake II mods, these days, do you? This product is missing it's window, and will be remembered as the game that "could have been". Mark my words....</i>

    Wow, we have a regular Nostradamus here. Yeah, sure, Infiltration will evolve -- but hey, if I recall correctly, it went from being for Unreal to being for UT. You don't see people sitting around the forums whining for support for an Unreal version, do you? Yeah, fancy that -- better technology, better graphics, better support... why the hell <i>would</i> the dev team wanna move on? The bastards!

    <i>lol, in your face, obnoxiously, forever...</i>

    Wow, you're laughing out loud at yourself. A sure sign of being unfunny and having no friends. That you're proud you're obnoxious is a doubly good blow to your ego. Let me guess, you're a goofy loser who has wet dreams about shooting up your office cause the last cute intern there snubbed you by laughing in your face and saying she wouldn't fu<i></i>ck you even if she <i>could</i> find your penis with a set of tweezers and a microscope. Therefore, you pretend you're an obnoxious, defiant weasle who's real attitude is actually one of conformity through non-conformity like the other parade of retards that have waltzed through these boards before you. Yeah, you're special kid.
     
  19. -=-SDS=- Lust

    -=-SDS=- Lust Boo!

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    Ya but the quake mod scene was alive for a long time and still is for a great many people. If the UT mods follow the same path there is still a whole lot of life left in this engine.
     
  20. OpFor

    OpFor Feeling suicide, thats O.K.

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    PS: 2.85 was INF made all over again, starting from sctartch, and it took them 4 months, how many full fleged conversions do you know that took 4 months? So go fock your self.
     
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