Help me steady my aiming mouse cursor

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xMurphyx

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What will that do?

Also xMurphyx, are you absolutely sure it was a 600dpi mouse? I've also had an opposite effect at the other end of the spectrum. I got what could be called "dead space" where there weren't enough pixels on the screen for the mouse and my cursor wouldn't move at all. This happened when I was moving my mouse very slowly.
It's the Neolec Spitfire 4d. The packaging is long gone and on the mouse itself it doesn't say how many dpi it uses. You even have to turn it over to see the name of the model. :)
I still use it on my old pc. Durable son of a mother that mouse. I am not 100% sure about the 600dpi and I couldn't find its stats on google but I'm pretty sure.

Not moving at all at very low speeds sounds like mouse accelleration gone wrong. That's what happens if you set the mouse sensivity sliders to the lowest in Operation Flashpoint, for example. Something is wrong with that game. Maybe the application you experienced this in had the same problem.
Another cause could be that the wireless connection caused this.

I have a razer diamondback set to 1600dpi and I never had it not move when I moved it, no matter the resolution.
 

JohnDoe641

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Yes John that was me. Had my arse handed to me if I recall. You'll see a PM in Crossfire directed to you. Still trying to improve though I was into console gaming for a while until UT3 came out on the XBOX360. Revived my interest in UT2004.
hehe, I now remember showing you a lot of the trick jumps on Antalus for hours. :D

Did you not like UT3? Is that why you've gone back to 2k4?

BTW I read that you use the variable dpi settings, I'd probably recommend that you just use one dpi setting since the point of improving aim is to use muscle memory to aim. Even twitch aim is muscle memory if you think about it.

If you're switching between two settings you're not allowing your muscles to know exactly how to shoot each time since it won't be a 100% constant. I don't know a single person who's any good at the game that uses dpi switching, it's just something that isn't actually useful. I've know people that used to use dpi switching when they used the LtG for sniping, one guy kept asking me if I botted and I told him that obviously I didn't but I kept a single dpi, didn't zoom, and used movement aim/reaction shots instead of relying on mouse aim for hitscan. After I showed him what I was talking about, he improved by at least 30% with his aim over only four maps.

I also think that dpi is just a gimmick to sell mice to silly people. I Tried my old IE3 which is only 400 dpi vs my regular DeathAdder which has a dpi of 1800 and I didn't really notice a difference. I could hit people just as well as I did with the DeathAdder. The only thing I noticed was that the IE3 sometimes was skipping but that could be because it's one of the original IE3's from years ago and in technology terms it's rather ancient. The only reason I have the DeathAdder is because it's an extremely comfortable mouse and it allows me to use the computer far longer than my old 518 would. But the point is that it's not the hardware that determines skill, it's the technique and users ability to do something skillfully. Hardware may sometimes make things easier, but it's never the determining factor of a fragging match. Well, expect for 2 fps vs someone getting 200. :p
 
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jackstere

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Can't run UT3 on my PC so I tried it on the XBOX360. Recreated movement speed pretty well but translocation didn't seem to have the same range or feel. The remake maps seemed smaller and somehow I just felt that me walking around in a huge tripod warmachine should make me hard to bring down with small arms fire from foot soldiers--armor plating here people!! Also can't bind console gamepads so I went back to UT2004.

Agree mostly with your aim philosophy though I would need to spectate you in a match in first person to know exactly what you mean by "movement aim reaction". I am sometimes chagrined to notice while spectating good players that they seem to get a kill even if the mouse cursor just passes through a player before they fire--something console players playing Halo would often bitch about. Is this muscle twitch aiming as you describe it--almost a lucky hitscan shot? And I don't really use the second DPI setting unless sniping at extreme range--you know when you can't hardly see your enemy otherwise. Rarely useful but might as well use it if it doesn't otherwise bother you.

Also I tend to agree with Defeat's view that you should try and match your mouse DPI settings with your screen res. So with that in mind it seems the more capable the monitor you have in so far as screen resolution goes the more capable the mouse should be in taking advantage of it. So unless cost is an issue I see no reason not to take a better DPI rated mouse especially with the newer higher resolution monitors out there. Every little bit helps IMHO.

BTW how does one "bot" one's character which I assume means for aiming purposes? How can one tell if someone is cheating like that--by asking to inspect his ini.?
 
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jackstere

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Okay reading these posts makes me believe that both Defeat and the Iron Knuckle are correct. Therefore I will disable the Logitech game enabled button and set my mouse sensitivity in the user.ini files of UT2004 and see what happens. The game did indeed feel a bit smoother to me with the Logitech setting turned off and my snap turning seemed better as well. I'm just not sure if the mouse sensitivity settings in the ini. refer to DPI as they do in the Logitech program. Anyone know for sure? If this doesn't work for me I'll try Murphy's idea next.
 
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TheIronKnuckle

What the hell is this "ballin" thing?
Well, if you turned off that thing i said earlier (Not the whole program, just one specific checkbox), you can still use "on-the-fly" DPI changing.
By turning it off, you are essentially removing a third layer of mouse settings that just get in the way and are unecessary in most games anyway.

The first layer of mouse settings are controlled by the OS. These are "global" mouse settings
The second layer of mouse settings occur in the applications you are using (In this case, first-person shooters).
Logitech felt the need to stick a third layer of settings on as well. This layer essentially is confined to the mouse itself. It tries to tweak how the mouse behaves depending on what application (Game) is currently running (In a way, it is just hijacking the second layer). It is unecessary because all the settings can be configured in the other two layers and this just adds more work to getting the mouse to feel "just right". It is possible to leave it on, but the benefits are minimal.
 

xMurphyx

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Yep. If you are against mouse accelleration (most gamers are as it messes with muscle memory, even if it may be more comfortable for newcomers) you can disable it in UT2004 as well. Just put the accelleration threshhold to 100.0 (the maximum) so it only kicks in at speeds you won't reach.
 

Defeat

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Are you sure? I just left mine at 0.00

edit: After looking around I think you should put it at 0.00 for no mouse accel.
 
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JohnDoe641

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Agree mostly with your aim philosophy though I would need to spectate you in a match in first person to know exactly what you mean by "movement aim reaction".
Movement aim and reaction aim are two different things.

Movement aim is when you use your movement to align your shots instead of relying on your mouse to go to your opponent. The best players in the game use this technique to get 90% of their hitscan kills, go watch frag vids and you'll see almost all movement aim shots, especially with shock taping.

Reaction aim is when you let the enemy go across your xhair and fire when they are in the middle of it or about to cross it depending on ping. It's best used when someone is dodging or using a jump pad since in 2k4 the players trajectory is really easy to predict. Instead of trying to track the player, aim where they will be and hit them when they get to that point. They can't do anything abut it and it's a guaranteed hit if you're reaction time is good enough.

I don't have many examples of what I'm talking about so these will have to do. D:

marhsgrendelgx2.gif

It's not a very good example like I said, but it does show a bit of how I aim and move. Notice that as soon as I start to go for ]O[ish I'm already moving with him instead of trying to simply aim for him. Notice where my xhair is when he's dead, it's still on him because I'm moving backwards to compensate for where he would be if he were still moving.

kscolawarsod9.gif

This one is really grainy and hard to see but perhaps it'll show a bit more of what I was talking about.

In the first few seconds I was using my mouse to aim because I was trying to get to the flag, obviously my mouse aim isn't the greatest so I missed but after the flak kill I used movement aim instead of aiming with my mouse. See how my mouse barely moves and my movement is carrying my aim for me? The last kill for the Ludicrous, I didn't zoom in, I just waited for the guy to cross my xhair as I jumped with his movement and there ya go, another kill. :p

Sorry I don't have anything actually good to show you but I never really cared for ****scan kills, I just really hate cola wars. :p

Also I tend to agree with Defeat's view that you should try and match your mouse DPI settings with your screen res. So with that in mind it seems the more capable the monitor you have in so far as screen resolution goes the more capable the mouse should be in taking advantage of it. So unless cost is an issue I see no reason not to take a better DPI rated mouse especially with the newer higher resolution monitors out there. Every little bit helps IMHO.
This can b a good thing or a bad thing. If you have a higher dpi mice, the more unsteady your hand is, the more you're going to see that. Just like if you have a 6mp camera and get slightly blurry pictures, with a 12 mp camera those faults in your technique will be even more visible. With a lower dpi mouse there's some give when it comes to mouse shake since the mouse won't track some of those tremors but a high end 1800 dpi mouse will pick up every shake you produce. But if you have a steady hand, a higher dpi mouse can let you do much better as long as you're already good at aiming. A person going from a 400 dpi mouse to a 4000 dpi mouse won't do them any good if they have terrible aim, they'll be just as bad with the new one. :p

BTW how does one "bot" one's character which I assume means for aiming purposes? How can one tell if someone is cheating like that--by asking to inspect his ini.?
lol, you don't ask a botter for their ini's, you report them to an admin of the server so they can be banned. But you'd definitely know a botter when you see one, constant view snapping and quick turns towards the nearest enemy are usually possibly signs of a botter. If you think someone is botting, just spectate them and notice how they are moving. Generally botters are terrible at the game, have horrid movement, and are completely useless with splash weapons.

Though trigger bots can be a bit harder to notice if they turn them off constantly so be careful of that. In all my 10+ years of fps gaming I've only run into two botters and they were really well known cheaters.
 

jackstere

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Well, if you turned off that thing i said earlier (Not the whole program, just one specific checkbox), you can still use "on-the-fly" DPI changing.
By turning it off, you are essentially removing a third layer of mouse settings that just get in the way and are unecessary in most games anyway.

Okay now I am a bit confused again. I did turn off the game detection box under the little Castle icon in the Logitech program. But there is another box here under Speed and Acceleration which allows you to select between mouse OS control or Logitech Setpoint control. If I wish to only use the settings under the UT2004 ini. then I would think I would have to disable this as well. Would not unchecking the "game detection" prohibit me from being able to switch DPI settings?

I still am looking for a response as to whether the ini. mouse sensitivity settings in UT2004 correspond directly to screen resolution DPI. In other words if my screen resolution was 1280x720 on my 1920x1080 LCD should I set these settings...

MouseX=Count bXAxis | Axis aMouseX Speed=1.28
MouseY=Count bYAxis | Axis aMouseY Speed=.720

...as such. And how does this one relate to the above setting...

MouseSensitivity=1.690000

Am I completely wrong making the assumption that the ini. numbers are DPI related?
 

T2A`

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Yes. FOV settings will affect mouse speed, but resolution will not.

DPI is bollocks. I've used mice from 400 to 2000 DPI. Doesn't make a damn bit of difference. In fact, I used a G5 for 2.5 years, and the majority of that I had it set at 1000 DPI (vs. its 2000 maximum).

Zero effect!
 

jackstere

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Sep 2, 2008
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Jack you're putting way to much thought into this, just play and become familiar with your settings.

Yeah I know but every time I think I have the sensitivity right my snap turning is too slow. Can't even think of going against good players until this is ironed out. I think you might have nailed my problem when you pointed out that the higher DPI mouse May be too sensitive for my unsteady hand. Maybe I'll try my old Dell mouse again.
 

TheIronKnuckle

What the hell is this "ballin" thing?
Well, if you turned off that thing i said earlier (Not the whole program, just one specific checkbox), you can still use "on-the-fly" DPI changing.
By turning it off, you are essentially removing a third layer of mouse settings that just get in the way and are unecessary in most games anyway.
Okay now I am a bit confused again. I did turn off the game detection box under the little Castle icon in the Logitech program. But there is another box here under Speed and Acceleration which allows you to select between mouse OS control or Logitech Setpoint control. If I wish to only use the settings under the UT2004 ini. then I would think I would have to disable this as well. Would not unchecking the "game detection" prohibit me from being able to switch DPI settings?
Yeah, i forgot about that..... Well, i don't actually know about what it changes but out of "Setpoint control" and "OS control" I have "OS control" checked. I think that this is a setting that is asking you if you want logitech to hijack the first layer of mouse settings as well. I would put it to "OS control" for a few test runs. It doesn't make your 1337 gaming mouse crappy or anything, it just transfers control of mouse settings over to your OS.

Unchecking "game detection" does not affect the functionality of your mouse at all. All the features of your mouse should still work perfectly, including DPI switching. The only thing that you are turning off by disabling game detection is some background software that is really helpful if you want to take the time to set it up just right but in practice you can do it all much faster from within ut2004 anyway. It is just removing the unecessary third layer of mouse settings.
 

jackstere

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Sep 2, 2008
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Leave those alone at default

Okay. Hey Defeat since you have the MX518 mouse may I ask what type of mouse pad you play with? Is it a cloth textured one without an overlaying sheen? Seems to me I should find one that has a bit more friction resistance. Brand recommedations anyone?
 

jackstere

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Yeah, i forgot about that..... Well, i don't actually know about what it changes but out of "Setpoint control" and "OS control" I have "OS control" checked. I think that this is a setting that is asking you if you want logitech to hijack the first layer of mouse settings as well. I would put it to "OS control" for a few test runs. It doesn't make your 1337 gaming mouse crappy or anything, it just transfers control of mouse settings over to your OS.
QUOTE]

Very well I will eschew to your advice. If I so desire is it possible to totally disable OS control of the mouse and then check Setpoint control? How?
 

T2A`

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I've messed with that before. Didn't make a difference. I mean, the speeds and sensitivities will all be different, but once you dial them back in it doesn't matter.

Ultimately, all the settings hackery won't make a difference. All these mice and settings make so small a difference that it's hard to even notice a change that will have lasting effect.

The placebo effect is huge when it comes to these matters. Even something as simple as changing your crosshair can do it. You try something new, and if it's not something that's completely wrong for you, you end up doing a little better initially.

The trick, however, is that it has little or nothing to do with the setting change and more to do with a boost in confidence, even if it's subconscious. You think it's going to work better so it does. When you go back the next day the change you made the previous day feels wrong, so you switch back, and do a little better initially.

This can go on forever, and it's pointless. Trust me, I tried enough crap during my peak UT2004 days to last a lifetime. None of it made any difference. I still lost to Raffi in 1v1 most days because in the end it's not the settings or the mouse that makes you good. Practicing and learning with the same consistent setup is what makes you good. Not playing -- practicing.

So, to get better, it's actually quite simple.

Get a good optical mouse that can handle fast movements without trouble. Doesn't matter what the DPI is or how many buttons it has or any of that other marketing bullsh*t.

Get a cloth mousepad. Doesn't matter what kind so long as it's big enough and it won't wear out on you after two months. I've used a Supermat for years and I'm on an Xtrac Ripper right now. Both are fantastic.

Disable all acceleration on your O/S. This is basically the only setting that matters. Acceleration f**ks with your body's ability to develop muscle memory.

Then just find a comfortable sensitivity and stick with it. Minor adjustments are fine for awhile, but once you settle in on one that feels good, stick with it. I set my CoD4 sensitivity on day one, toned it down by 0.1 a week or two later, and I haven't touched it since.

Now I go 70-20 on pubs. :p