Mark Rein Interview

[EXE-973]

<<BuA>> Lurker_71, thank you... That so needed to be said.

I have to agree with BigDragon on something, I undrestand not wanting to hear the whining and the complaining. But come on... The put out a problematic demo, named it beta so that when we pointed out its flaws they could fall back on the beta tag. Then they proceeded to absolutely ignore all the suggestions we had to improve the beta. Then when the game released in exactly the same shape as the beta, people were pissed and suddenly were labeled as whiners who were supposed to have judged the game from the demo and not bought it. But the demo was a beta... that we gave feedback on... vicious cycle...

 

[Lostsoul]

Uhh I think you have me confused with someone else bud. I have never disliked the Assault gametype ... in fact I tested and made suggestions on many AS maps and I am listed in more than a handful of readme files as a contributing tester. I also don't remember getting into protracted debates about the AS gametype since I hadn't been exposed to it from UT99 at that time so I had nothing to really compare it to. There was some kind of mod or something for UT2k3 and it was cool but nothing like UT2K4's Assault. Actually one of the best levels ever is AS-Confexia ... and also Angel Mapper made one of the best AS levels around ... with the bots able to do all objectives and actually do them well. Anyway I can't remember getting into arguments with folks about Assault but this was years ago so perhaps it is possible. Still I think you are confusing me with Anubis who is another member of the Unreal Community. On the Epic boards and the old Atari boards I go by AnubanUT2K4.

As far as disliking me ... join the club ... If I had a nickel for every time I head that ... I don't even let that bother me ... people disliking people they don't even know except from some threads on the net due to a difference in opinions about a game. Now that is funny .. not that I am not also guilty of the same thing ... being human sometimes is a chore.

You are the right person....
http://epicboards.ign.com/general_discussion/b10667/19636414/p1/?59
And I could say a lot of things about Sub and Confexia, but I have made my opinions well known in other places.

 

[UnrealGrrl]

Well it is a forum, like WarTourist says "then put them ignore". If these comments is offending or breaks the rules, then mods can remove them. But i find your comment rather elitest. You basically say anyone who dislikes it and maybe post something you define as "witty".. is doing that as image and being a "show off". Now if that isent a generalization of xxx users and highorse attitude. I think a majorlity cared for all of ut and several spend countless hours making addon for the previous versions.

I wont post anything more about it, I will just wait and see what comes in the future... but am gonna try hard not to keep looking at this "trainwreck", which I have to admit has been hard not to.

ill forgive the misunderstanding cause it sounds like english is not your native language (but you spell it better than most anyway ) all i was saying - and i know alot of long time UT players/fans agree, is that unfortunately alot of people "try" to be witty and look cool when they really dont have anything constructive to add... im not talking about the many people who do have legitimate comments, suggestions and complaints. i am only pointing out that alot of the negativity comes from the people ("trolls") who jump in and prolong these discussions with needless. insulting and antagonistic comments. those are the ones who ruin the discussion for everyone.

anyway not @ anyone in particular - of course its hard sometimes to keep emotions out of it, especially when you really do care about something (or if youre young and inexperienced about getting your point across without sounding like a jerk)... but believe me, Epic people wouldnt be reading and responding to these forums and their own if they didn't care about the game. yaknow, they dont have to do anything at all, alot of other developers dont. and when all a person does is wisecrack and spout bs then they probably dont desrve anything like a civilized answer, they probably do deserve a nice ban stick tho

 

[Sir_Brizz]

Brizz, you're forgetting the timeline and context of my actions. I only started the snide and cutting remarks after the out of the blue ban.

That's a load of crap. You admitted in an earlier thread that you had made a snide comment about using your UT3 disc as a coaster. That's not professional.

I really don't give two craps about how you feel about any issue. The point is, there are two ways you can approach something, the right way and the wrong way. You have shown that you are more than willing to approach things the wrong way despite getting no results.

Maybe I should put this into terms you will understand.

zomg f u whine ur not gunna gidda resp

u gotta just do da rite tng m8 n stop da whine

 

[fuegerstef]

This has got to be the stupidest thing I've heard all week, honestly.

I must admit, that I fully agree.


But who knows, perhaps Big DrugOn really invested more time and money in UT3 than EPIC.

 

[Grobut]

All this does is get the forumer added to our vbb ignore list.

So basically, what you're saying is that all it takes is one bad day, and one ham fisted reply, and then you can just plain forget about ever giving Epic any usefull feedback in the future?

That doesen't seem very smart to be honest, how can you guys stay in touch with the community if all it takes for you guys to ignore said community is one bad day and one bad reply?


And seeing how readilly you guys will delete threads on your own forum, even though they contain honest and well formulated opinions without trolling, that makes me uneasy, it makes me think it woulden't take much for people to get ignored by you guys either.

 

[BigDragon]

That's a load of crap. You admitted in an earlier thread that you had made a snide comment about using your UT3 disc as a coaster. That's not professional.

Yes, I did say that after asking questions about patch 2 in a thread Epic couldn't be bothered to create so a community member had to make it for them. That same thread featured some of the fastest disappearing posts I've ever seen on any site online. The issues I was posting about were ignored in the first patch and haven't shown up officially on the second patch or are vaguely glossed over (hence the reason to ask questions). Could I have done it without throwing in the coaster part? Sure and in hindsight that would have been a better choice. Did you have to throw in " zomg f u whine ur not gunna gidda resp. u gotta just do da rite tng m8 n stop da whine" at the end of your post? Nope. You just did what I did. The same frustration I had on Epic's forums is like what fueled your post and likewise has fueled you to lock the last thread about all this stuff.

[. . .]That's not professional. [. . .]

Maybe I should put this into terms you will understand.

zomg f u whine ur not gunna gidda resp

u gotta just do da rite tng m8 n stop da whine

Again, this is exactly what I did. You want to chastise me for a snide comment and then turn around and do the same thing. You don't think I'm getting the message and likewise I didn't think Epic was getting my message.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

Did you have to throw in " zomg f u whine ur not gunna gidda resp. u gotta just do da rite tng m8 n stop da whine" at the end of your post? Nope. You just did what I did. The same frustration I had on Epic's forums is like what fueled your post and likewise has fueled you to lock the last thread about all this stuff.

Nothing was fueling my post. Though I probably shouldn't have made a dig like that, there is a very big difference here. You do not work for or represent a company that I have any interest or desire in having a professional relationship with, and your posting history here on the forums tells me that you have no desire to have a professional relationship with anyone on these forums or in this community.

This is part of the problem with Epic running their own forums. Over there you aren't just a community member, you are, basically, a customer "at the office", so to speak. You're NOT free to say whatever you want. You ARE going to get yourself ignored if you act like a tard. It's not a hard concept.

Again, this is exactly what I did. You want to chastise me for a snide comment and then turn around and do the same thing. You don't think I'm getting the message and likewise I didn't think Epic was getting my message.

I know you're getting the message, I just don't know why you blithely ignore it and continue to complain in every thread that pops up like this.

Yes, you feel unjustly punished, but you know what? That's the risk you take. If you went to someone's house and started screaming obscenities at them and any of that sort of thing, do you think they wouldn't eventually call the cops?

It's just a stupid situation. You did something dumb, got punished for it, and now you've taken it as your personal quest to destroy Epic's reputation or something. We get it, now go away.

 

[BigDragon]

Nothing was fueling my post. Though I probably shouldn't have made a dig like that, there is a very big difference here. You do not work for or represent a company that I have any interest or desire in having a professional relationship with, and your posting history here on the forums tells me that you have no desire to have a professional relationship with anyone on these forums or in this community.

Who I work for and what I represent has nothing to do with the underlying motivation for a comment like that. You got frustrated that I won't simply go away and continue to push the issue. I got frustrated that Epic wouldn't address an issue and continued to dodge it. Different situation, different words, different people, but the same kind of frustration motivated the comment you shouldn't have made that what motivated the comment I shouldn't have made.

Yes, you feel unjustly punished, but you know what? That's the risk you take. If you went to someone's house and started screaming obscenities at them and any of that sort of thing, do you think they wouldn't eventually call the cops?

It's just a stupid situation. You did something dumb, got punished for it, and now you've taken it as your personal quest to destroy Epic's reputation or something. We get it, now go away.

Going to someone's house and screaming obscenities is not an apples to apples comparison. What I did was a single comment, not a string of them. Going to someone's house and saying something rudely inappropriate is. We both know that instantly results in some sort of reprimand, correction, evil looks, and the such from your hosts. They normally don't boot you out the door immediately, and in the rare case that they do, a few days later they'll have gotten over it. Vbb is equipped with time-based bans. What Epic/Wartourist did was ban permanently over one comment. Brizz, as a moderator at BU, even you know how ridiculous that is. I've seen you guys temporarily ban people before because they said something "motarded". There's a huge reason why forum software has time-based bans. What Epic did was use one little comment as the justification for a permanent ban, without notice.

 

[BigDragon]

We get it, now go away.

I neglected to mention something earlier. For now this feud has been limited to this site and a couple of others, but it won't stay that way long. It's only a matter of time before it starts popping up on the big sites like IGN, Gamespot, PCGamer, and so on. If you really want this to go away, then you should use your contacts at Epic and implore them to make amends with me. An apology is much easier to swallow than having to respond to articles on the big media sites. Did I make mistakes in the words that I chose to express my points? You bet I did. Did Epic make mistakes in the way they handled this situation? They're trying to ignore it just like everything else they didn't want to hear/read.

 

[«BuA»Lurker_71]

It's just a stupid situation. You did something dumb, got punished for it, and now you've taken it as your personal quest to destroy Epic's reputation or something. We get it, now go away.

An apology is much easier to swallow than having to respond to articles on the big media sites. Did I make mistakes in the words that I chose to express my points? You bet I did. Did Epic make mistakes in the way they handled this situation? They're trying to ignore it just like everything else they didn't want to hear/read.

It seems to me that constant arguing like this only inflames the situation, and it distracts the people who should be answering questions from answering those questions, and making relations better between Epic and their customers.
You both (for your own reasons) have your own personal jihad going on, and to be quite honest; I don't care.
I would like to hear from Wartourist on my previous post, not come back to check on this thread and see 400 new posts of the two of you fighting it out.

Brizz; I realize you work for BU, and you are as inclined to have your opinion known as much as BigDragon is inclined to have his known, but it's not helping this situation, nor is it getting questions with relevance answered.
You are the one pushing professionalism, but you keep falling into the trap BigD is leaving behind for you... so let me settle this for you both, so we can hopefully get some answers from WarTourist:

You are both right, and you are both wrong.

If you would like to continue your debate, please create a new thread where the two of you can duke it out and we don't have to be subjected to post after post of "I'm right and you're wrong".

No matter what either of you think, this feud is not helping the community get the answers it wants and needs... it's just drawing people into taking sides with one of you, and continuing the feud.

BigD: I can understand how you feel, but considering you made the first mistake, perhaps an apology to Epic for your comment is in order, before you ask for an apology for being banned.
Take responsibility for your actions before you expect someone to take responsibility for theirs.

 

[BigDragon]

BigD: I can understand how you feel, but considering you made the first mistake, perhaps an apology to Epic for your comment is in order, before you ask for an apology for being banned.
Take responsibility for your actions before you expect someone to take responsibility for theirs.

I am all for having this whole thing put into the past. I've danced around the issue of apologizing, but since you're trying to get Wartourist's attention I'll say this:

I apologize for my coaster comment and the virulent tone, negative attitude, and excessive impatience I had when commenting on patch 2 at the Epic forums. I made a poor choice of words and let the frustration of my experiences with both UT3 and Gears get the better of me. I made the initial mistake, yes, and I welcome Wartourist/Epic to join me in putting this issue behind us. I offer this comment as a hand out in good faith that we can move on, and I can only hope that the gesture is returned so that we can shake and put this in the past.

 

[«BuA»Lurker_71]

I am all for having this whole thing put into the past. I've danced around the issue of apologizing, but since you're trying to get Wartourist's attention I'll say this:

I apologize for my coaster comment and the virulent tone, negative attitude, and excessive impatience I had when commenting on patch 2 at the Epic forums. I made a poor choice of words and let the frustration of my experiences with both UT3 and Gears get the better of me. I made the initial mistake, yes, and I welcome Wartourist/Epic to join me in putting this issue behind us. I offer this comment as a hand out in good faith that we can move on, and I can only hope that the gesture is returned so that we can shake and put this in the past.

Thanks BigD... and even if WarTourist/Epic don't accept your apology, or this doesn't move any further towards resoultion between you... I hope that my appreciation that you could step aside from your issues and pride to put the community first is enough to help you move forward.
It takes a big man to do what you did... and I really do appreciate it. Thank you.

 

[Sir_Brizz]

I am all for having this whole thing put into the past. I've danced around the issue of apologizing, but since you're trying to get Wartourist's attention I'll say this:

I apologize for my coaster comment and the virulent tone, negative attitude, and excessive impatience I had when commenting on patch 2 at the Epic forums. I made a poor choice of words and let the frustration of my experiences with both UT3 and Gears get the better of me. I made the initial mistake, yes, and I welcome Wartourist/Epic to join me in putting this issue behind us. I offer this comment as a hand out in good faith that we can move on, and I can only hope that the gesture is returned so that we can shake and put this in the past.

I really hope you realize that all I was trying to do is help you see how childish you were acting (and hoping that a fringe benefit might be a post like this).

 

[«BuA»Lurker_71]

Maybe I should put this into terms you will understand.

zomg f u whine ur not gunna gidda resp

u gotta just do da rite tng m8 n stop da whine

It's just a stupid situation. You did something dumb, got punished for it, and now you've taken it as your personal quest to destroy Epic's reputation or something. We get it, now go away.

I really hope you realize that all I was trying to do is help you see how childish you were acting (and hoping that a fringe benefit might be a post like this).

This is what makes me sick when it comes to the high and mighty of the "Unreal Community"...
You're telling me that BigDragon went out of his way to make a public apology on your forums, and this is the best you could come up with?
Where's your professionalism now?
It's not enough that you couldn't set aside your pride and admit you were also wrong, but then you actually have the nerve to say that you were trash talking him for his own good?
This is truly a sad day for BU and it's readers. I expected better out of someone who worked with QAPete.

 

[Noobnugget]

All this does is get the forumer added to our vbb ignore list.

We read virtually everything posted on our forums and BUF, there's no 'obnoxiusness' threshold that must be achieved before we start to notice. I get the impression some folks thinks it's the only way to get heard, when in reality it's the best way to never get heard by Epic again...

Can you really be unheard of again by someone who never heard you in the first place..?

 

[Crotale]

Damn, some of you have proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt that you have been banned from the Epic Forums and why. Post #79 above is a classic example of the current community mentality when it comes to complaints. Here's the way I see it, and I posted something very similar in yet another "whine" thead:

The Epic UT3 General Chat Forums receives at least 50 new threads daily. Out of those, possible as many as 10 are basically the same thread. A single thread can be pushed off the front page in a matter of a few hours. The simple fact that a lot of members are too lazy or ignorant to read through the thread listing or use the search function but are willing to spam it up with new threads makes that forum very difficult for anyone to truly enjoy or find/provide useful info. Topping this off is the fact that a great many users will make complaints in multiple threads. Well, let me ask, is Epic supposed to respond to all 10 threads on the same subject every day and sticky all of them? If so, I can see it now, within a week's time, we will have to sift through 1500 stickies to get to an actual non-stickied thread.

Honestly, I rarely visit the UT3 Forums because of the goings on listed in the paragraph above. It has nothing to do with how I feel or don't feel about UT3 or Epic. And I used to be a very active member there. What does THAT tell you?

 

[Sir_Brizz]

This is what makes me sick when it comes to the high and mighty of the "Unreal Community"...
You're telling me that BigDragon went out of his way to make a public apology on your forums, and this is the best you could come up with?
Where's your professionalism now?
It's not enough that you couldn't set aside your pride and admit you were also wrong, but then you actually have the nerve to say that you were trash talking him for his own good?
This is truly a sad day for BU and it's readers. I expected better out of someone who worked with QAPete.

For what? Did I do something off the wall? Did I offend you or him or something?

I probably let it get a bit out of hand, but my posts weren't that bad, honestly...

 

[Trailboss3]

This is what makes me sick when it comes to the high and mighty of the "Unreal Community"...
You're telling me that BigDragon went out of his way to make a public apology on your forums, and this is the best you could come up with?
Where's your professionalism now?
It's not enough that you couldn't set aside your pride and admit you were also wrong, but then you actually have the nerve to say that you were trash talking him for his own good?
This is truly a sad day for BU and it's readers. I expected better out of someone who worked with QAPete.

I like your sig Lurker :tup:

 

[«BuA»Lurker_71]

For what? Did I do something off the wall? Did I offend you or him or something?

I probably let it get a bit out of hand, but my posts weren't that bad, honestly...

It's easy to jump on the bandwagon and bash people when they do something wrong, or when they screw up... BigD told us how he felt, even though it took him several posts to get past his anger and tell us exactly what happened; he got there, and he rose above his anger to make an apology to the community and Epic about his behavior.
I don't know about you, but that's a big thing to me... and it's not an easy thing to do.
I posted quotes from 2 of your other responses to him that made me feel contrary to this statement;

I really hope you realize that all I was trying to do is help you see how childish you were acting (and hoping that a fringe benefit might be a post like this).

which in itself, sounds like you got in a last dig.

We need people like you to be emissaries, not antagonists.

Even if people "whine" about something, it doesn't mean they don't deserve an answer... even if not directly... and imho, Epic has done poorly to answer any questions regarding the future of UT3 on PC, or to show any kind of interest in letting PC users know that they aren't going to have to take a seat behind PS3 and 360 users because "they're the next big thing".
I understand that listening to people using their mouths instead of their heads gets old, but that shouldn't mean that the people who use their heads get ignored as well.
As long standing fans who have backed Epic since Unreal (or as far back as UT, in my case) I think we should be entitled to some answers which are long overdue.
If we can't get past this lack of communication, we're all going to lose.