Why can't Epic fix the Bot Selection Team Based Game Modes UI

[Anuban]

I just do not understand how it is that we are at patch 1.3 on the PC and yet you still can't set up teams easily like you were able to do in ALL previous versions of UT. Why do I still have to put them all in one list and remind myself that the first two characters are on the blue team and then it is alternating after that but also impossible for me to make a teams like they have during the campaign ... you know the missions where Epic limits your team to 4 players and the opposition has 6 team players but no where in the game is it possible for me to easily recreate that scenario.

I hate this ... I used to do lopsided teams all the time in ONS. I loved doing a REAL Onslaught with 11 players and storming an enemy team with only 7 or 8 players. It was a lot of fun massacring a whole team while learning to become a better ONS player at higher skill settings without frustration. Now of course NONE of this is doable and I am baffled why it remains this way. I know I cannot be alone in my frustration and bewilderment as to why this is taking Epic so long to resolve.

[Vitamin-Carrot]

1.3 is out?

[Dark Pulse]

No, it's not.

[Vitamin-Carrot]

hes trying to trick old carrot isnt he ...

[Dark Pulse]

No, he's just wondering how we're up to the third patch (soon) and we don't have a feature he thinks is really needed isn't in.

[Anuban]

Yep this is based on the first beta of patch 1.3. And I am not the only person who thinks it would be nice if it was easy to set up teams of any size ... I've seen other people asking about this in the early days of UT3's release. I just wonder how any Epic employee who plays the game can overlook this (as well as having to choose mutators you use every time you start the game instead of the game using the last used mutators by default). Anyway I'm not looking for any agreement ... just like other people do when they start threads I am just thinking out loud.

[Sir_Brizz]

Join the club of people who think their favorite feature is the most important thing to add to the game right now. Fact is, I will guarantee that the best UT3 patch will be the first patch after the 360 version of the game comes out (or the patch after 1.3, whichever comes last ).

[Sijik]

...because you touch yourself at night.

[pinnacle]

There are tons of things that Epic should have done but they didn't, including things that were in previous incarnations of UT but aren't in UT3. So let's all stop picking out individual things that they missed and just admit that Epic f***ed up.

[Benfica]

Originally Posted by Sir_Brizz

Fact is, I will guarantee that the best UT3 patch will be the first patch after the 360 version of the game comes out (or the patch after 1.3, whichever comes last ).

Go on ...

[elmuerte]

what is actually the whole use of that feature?
it's not like the AI is different depending on the characters

[Interbellum]

Yeah, what's up with the accelerated reverse evolution? First you could no longer change bot's names (UT2KX), now you can't really do anything. No voice pack selection, no individual skill settings, no uneven teams, not even avatar-based drag & drop bot selection. For us offline players (and let's face it, we are, and always have been, the majority) this is annoying as hell. At the very least they should have fixed it in one of the first patches, but no, not even that. Guess user-unfriendliness has become a 'feature' now.

[boogler]

epic failure

[Draco73]

take a number and get in line LOL, UT3 is missing 80% of the "standard" features we have come to know, love, and use on a daily basis...to be quite honest i have almost all but given up hope on ut3 (except for some sweet mods like DOM, which i also might add YOU KNOW ITS SAD, WHEN A MOD TEAM CAN CREATE SOMETHING BETTER THAN EPIC...lol but thats a little off topic) I'm at the point where i am just trying to enjoy ut3 for what it is, all the while waiting for a *fixed* version aka UT4...but even with that i find my self launching and playing previous versions of unreal much more often than UT3.

[Anuban]

I just can't believe this particular thing is still not resolved seven months later. And I guess I am really worried that this is one of those things Epic will never fix and I know it will prevent me (just talking about myself here ... I can't speak for others although it would seem logical that I am not alone on this) from playing team based Warfare as much as I would have otherwise. The great thing about UT2K4 (sorry just let me get this out please) is that once you set up a match you can just go to a map you want to play and just launch it and the game will start and use the last settings for team, mutators, game settings, etc. that you had the last time the game shut down and its just one of those areas that was so perfect you just don't think a company with as much experience as Epic would just rip it away and replace it with the crap they did.

It just doesn't make sense to give users who have been playing your games for 5 or more years such a negative shock to the system. I guess that is why I hold out hope that this is one of those areas that Epic will eventually address. But every once in a while it is probably a good thing to mention it ... just to let it be known that those of us who are Instant Action players have not forgotten these types of omissions. I understand that people who play the game mostly online don't see the problem but it does affect at least 40% of people who bought the game so it is definitely still an issue. I just really thought that after three patches it would be resolved and I am 100% stunned to see that it has not been addressed or even mentioned by Epic. And again we are talking about a radical departure from how this particular feature has worked before (and even UC2 has a better system for choosing teammates in team based games ... why not borrow elements of that game?).

Anyway this is the only topic of this sort I plan on making and again just as a way of saying "Hey don't forget about this when you get the chance" ... for at least the next two patches I will just wait and see. And then if we get to a 6th patch and this is still not resolved I may just mention it again (or really just accept it is not something that will ever be changed in this version ... that would bite though).

[Grobut]

Originally Posted by elmuerte

what is actually the whole use of that feature?
it's not like the AI is different depending on the characters

First of all, the whole point of offline play (for many of us, i suspect most) is that you can play the game the way you want to play it, there's no server to tell you what the next map will be, or what mutators or players you play with and against, you got to decide thease things for yourself, you played what you wanted, how you wanted, when you wanted, and this is where UT3 lets us down, you can start a match and play it, sure, but you don't have alot of control over how, when, where or why.. if you get my drift.

The whole point of of this feature in particular is setting things up to your liking, for instance, i've allways loved playing on a small human team against a large Skaarj/Alien enemy team (it plays a bit like Invasion, but with smarter enemies with better weapons), and letting my own skill be the thing that made my team win matches against overwhelming odds, but i can't do that in UT3, teams will allways be the same size, and that really spoils that fun for me.
Also, since bots are added now by name only (no Avatar pic's), remembering who's who is a real pain..

There is a very big difference between allways playing 6v6 or 12v12 etc, and playing 3v7 or 5v16 etc.

Also, here's a similar thing we are missing now, default orders and favorite weapons! if you ever went to the trouble of setting up propper teams, you would also understand why it was really nice that you could make the bots start with certain orders and make them favour weapons that went well with thouse orders, options like thouse made bot play alot more interesting than just starting a match with a bunch of mismatched bots, for instance, in CTF i allways liked to make the bots more agressive then the default orders, so the play would not be as sluggish, but in ONS i liked more defensive bots, so you had more of a tactical feel to the gametype, that's just not possible now, it allways plays the same.

[Mr. UglyPants]

Why can't they make UT3 save the options you chose, not only for mutators, but for bots and skill level and goals/kills to win... that is the only thing i am really infuriated by with UT3.

[Anuban]

Originally Posted by Grobut

... and letting my own skill be the thing that made my team win matches against overwhelming odds, but i can't do that in UT3, teams will allways be the same size, and that really spoils that fun for me.
Also, since bots are added now by name only (no Avatar pic's), remembering who's who is a real pain..

Originally Posted by Mr. UglyPants

Why can't they make UT3 save the options you chose, not only for mutators, but for bots and skill level and goals/kills to win... that is the only thing i am really infuriated by with UT3.

Exactly ... I just wonder how they could play the game offline and then think "hey lets just leave this the way it is and not make it user friendly like it has been" ... that is what has me puzzled.

[Grobut]

Originally Posted by Anuban

Exactly ... I just wonder how they could play the game offline and then think "hey lets just leave this the way it is and not make it user friendly like it has been" ... that is what has me puzzled.

Seems pretty obvious to me, we all know UT3 could have used another houer or two in the oven, and was shipped before "when its done", hence thease options are missing.
And they haven't been patched back in yet because they have a skeleton crew working on post release support (apparently the Xbox version and GOW2 is what all their manpower is working on, leaving table scraps to make patches for the PC and PS3 versions), and they have decided to focus on fixing the MP portion of the game first, no doubt because the Online players are thouse most vocal on the internet, and keeping them happy will yield better word of mouth for the game, and possibly get it played in more official tourneys.

Epic knows that about half of their customer base is made up of Offline players, but i am unsure if they really understand what we find important in an UT game anymore.. i am also unsure if UT3 will ever see the needed Offline fixes, there are just so many other things UT3 also needs, that the vocal majority is screaming for, that i have my doubts they will get around to all the Offline stuff before support is terminated or put on extended leave.. or they make an UT3½, whatever.

[MonsOlympus]

Hmmz interesting, I could have sworn there was a multiplier in there when playing players vs bots. Maybe its not in the ini, wait a sec...

var bool				bPlayersVsBots;
var globalconfig	float	BotRatio;			// only used when bPlayersVsBots is true

Okies so unless the gamemode is bPlayersVsBots this ratio wont work, strange it doesnt seem to be set in the defaults anywhere maybe thats a commandline option you can get at. Hopefully this helps alittle, Epic might not have made an easy way to use it but that doesnt mean its not there. We've heard the screams about the UI so yeah, instead of complaining about missing features because you cant see them perhaps do alittle research and you'll find out its in there. Ofcoarse being in there and usable are two different things I guess clicking submit post is easier then checking out server admin and code info

Originally Posted by elmuerte

what is actually the whole use of that feature?
it's not like the AI is different depending on the characters

Actually it is to some extent, sure they all use the same AI class but there are settings in there which set them apart like aggressiveness, combat style etc. Compare akasha to reaper and grobar and you'll see what I mean