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Old 27th May 2005, 01:06 PM   #1
DeathAdder
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Gravitational pull

I haven't seen, but could only imagine that for ut2007 that the maps will be capable of being even larger than ut2k4. Also, I don't think it is possible to do this in ut2k4.

It would be cool if orientation on a surface is based on gravitional pull no matter if in the x,y,or z direction or a combination of all three. I'm thinking like a point source that radiates its mass to create a gravitational pull upon itself, or a mechanical tractor beam. This pull obviously detiorates functionally with distance. I think it would be cool to actually create orbiting masses and so forth in ut. And be able to create your direction of view based on the gravitational pull. Also, would be cool to make masses very extra dense so it doesn't have to be huge to have a gravitational pull.

Is it possible in ut2k4? I'm thinking mostly of a spherical surface like a planet.
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Old 27th May 2005, 08:57 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathAdder
It would be cool if orientation on a surface is based on gravitional pull no matter if in the x,y,or z direction or a combination of all three. I'm thinking like a point source that radiates its mass to create a gravitational pull upon itself, or a mechanical tractor beam.
I think it would be cool to actually create orbiting masses and so forth in ut. And be able to create your direction of view based on the gravitational pull. Also, would be cool to make masses very extra dense so it doesn't have to be huge to have a gravitational pull.
Ah ha! Fun and games with quantum black holes!

Moving masses might be quite difficult although I would have thought it possible to fake different gravitational orientations statically using zones (lots of zones) of some sort - having said that, the physics of the space craft in the Skarj assault level seem to work well enough but I don't know if that is simply an absence of gravity.

Gravity is quite a weak force and the inverse square nature of the decay is a killer when it comes to having any *significant* effect. To really notice an effect in gameplay with any sensible size of map the masses would have to be truely enormous and incredibly dense. So enormous that it is difficult to imagine plausable (note, I did not write realistic - verisimilitude is all that is required) scenarios where one could envisage players interacting with such masses and not getting squelched or ripped apart by tidal forces.

If one takes for example two small asteroids in very close orbit around each other (and somehow not within a Roache limit but hey, it's a game) then an ill-timed jump could leave a player waiting minutes if not hours to return to the (either) surface as a result of gravitational forces.

I'm intrigued to know what sort of gameplay scenario you envisage such effects being used in.

The only place that I can recall offhand where differing gravitational orientation within a single map was used successfully was one of the deathmatch maps for SiN where the map was based (loosely) on a MC Escher painting. It was quite good fun but murder on my motion sickness.
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Old 27th May 2005, 11:26 PM   #3
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That could work. If we could just get the physics engine to get the player standing direction to radiate outward from a one central point. But, as IronMonkey said, they're going to have to be some pretty huge maps. The planet will have to be all static meshes also. The terrain function is only meant to go one one plane.

My take: It's just not practical yet. The engine couldn't handle such a large map.
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Old 28th May 2005, 04:47 PM   #4
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Quote:
It would be cool if orientation on a surface is based on gravitional pull no matter if in the x,y,or z direction or a combination of all three.
http://chimeric.beyondunreal.com/tutorials/tut27.php mentions the following enumeration:

Quote:
PHYS_Spider - if your first impression is to think of things walking on walls and ceilings, you'd be partially right. This physics was intended to allow objects to treat any level geometry surface as the 'ground'. This physics type is rarely used, and even more rarely experimented with.
I don't think it would allow you to vary gravitational vectors dynamically but it might allow static variation throughout a level.

This thread here also discusses differing gravitational vectors within a level:

http://www.vanguardsoh.com/forums/ar...dex.php/t-6520

If memory serves, one of the Serious Sam levels had rotating cylinders where the player's perception of vertical was tied to the surface that the player was on.

My guess is that any implementation of an n-body problem is going to grossly simplify for performance reasons. Think of the current "approximations" used for lighting.
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Old 28th May 2005, 09:55 PM   #5
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Yes, that's the problem. The terrain function is made in one plane. There's no way to make the terrain bend into a sphere which is unfortunate.

I might experiment with the PHY_Spider, but wonder what happens when you jump.


No doubt, as computers get faster, the maps should easily get larger.

It would be cool to create a simplistic gravitational pull with a less realistic deterioration of the pull of gravity to make it more noticable.

Oh well, things to come in the future. can't wait.
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Old 30th May 2005, 04:29 PM   #6
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Quote:
one of the deathmatch maps for SiN where the map was based (loosely) on a MC Escher painting.
The level was called paradox.

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Old 3rd Jun 2005, 10:32 AM   #7
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I know of one such instance where this would be usable. Eventually the Gundam Universe Mod will finish R1 on Quake3. They have said they will move to a new engine after that. I could easily see this type of gameplay being tested within a space like map with asteroids or a colony. With Boosters you wouldn't have to worry about getting caught inbetween two masses gravitational pull. Looking at this I find it fascinating with the possibilities.

Could something like this really be implemented a space map with Asteroids that give off their own gravity and as you get close can land and walk on them with your sense of "ground" shifting and up being opposite of looking down at the asteroid?

I know hardly anything to nil about the unreal engine. But if the team does make the shift in that direction over the SOURCE engine I'd definately be interested in attempting to learn map making.

Sorry for this being in another mod teams thread. I just found this topic to be info I was looking for.

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Old 4th Jun 2005, 06:29 AM   #8
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there's been plenty of maps where you can 'fall' of the edge of the map - that would be the entire size limit of a map. Use that space up, and the map will be a lot bigger!

I was thinking TowerofBabel map meets one of the really BIG maps in Invasion, then perhaps that could work?
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Old 17th Jun 2005, 07:21 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathAdder
I might experiment with the PHY_Spider, but wonder what happens when you jump.
Although I haven't seen the source anywhere, wouldn't the electromagnet from druids rpg provide an example of PHY_Spider use?
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Old 25th Oct 2005, 01:42 PM   #10
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Gravitational Orientation

I have a very similar problem, but I was wondering if it could be done on a much smaller scale, i.e. Halo. A ring where depending on which section of ring you're standing on, your player is oriented as to appear to be walking correctly on the surface. Not a huge map, but just a small ring that you can actually see other players walking upside-down directly above your head. I've played around with the gravity volume, and couldn't get it to work. I looked on UW as well as Mastering Unreal Technology and this site. If there is an easy way to change the player's orientation then many other things would be very easy to implement, such as gravity boots. If not, then, I guess I'll have to hard-code it. I just thought I'd ask in case someone knew something that I was unable to find.
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Old 14th Feb 2006, 08:33 AM   #11
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It seems that people have been working at this

This thread here:

http://www.ina-community.com/forums/...d.php?t=499488

mentions a map/gravity mutator that is downloadable from here:

http://www.mapraider.com/maps/index.asp?fileid=3414

This thread:

http://www.ataricommunity.com/forums...hreadid=483059 also has a discussion and some sample maps (attached).
Attached Files
File Type: zip miniplanet_test2_odl2.zip (63.5 KB, 7 views)
File Type: zip miniplanet_test1.zip (16.9 KB, 16 views)
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Old 3rd Mar 2006, 04:13 PM   #12
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nice thanks for finding this and remembering this thread.
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Old 2nd Apr 2006, 12:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathAdder
I haven't seen, but could only imagine that for ut2007 that the maps will be capable of being even larger than ut2k4. Also, I don't think it is possible to do this in ut2k4.

It would be cool if orientation on a surface is based on gravitional pull no matter if in the x,y,or z direction or a combination of all three. I'm thinking like a point source that radiates its mass to create a gravitational pull upon itself, or a mechanical tractor beam. This pull obviously detiorates functionally with distance. I think it would be cool to actually create orbiting masses and so forth in ut. And be able to create your direction of view based on the gravitational pull. Also, would be cool to make masses very extra dense so it doesn't have to be huge to have a gravitational pull.

Is it possible in ut2k4? I'm thinking mostly of a spherical surface like a planet.


*Stares at Idea for an hour*
*Understands it*

Methinks you could do it. Honestly, there are PS2 games that do this, so why not this game?
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Old 2nd Apr 2006, 12:40 AM   #14
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If you guys wanna know about PHYS_Spider, talk to Rachel
She got it somewhat working in an old Tamaeria demo
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Old 18th Jul 2008, 03:30 PM   #15
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Thumbs up

Ive seen a map like this. its called CTF4-Ecsher and its for ut99 the maker is DR. evil
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