No HUD.

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Apr 21, 2003
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Close, ban, kick Harrm... as real as it gets.

The INF HUD have to be as reduced and unnoticeable as possible, at the same time informative and practical.
 

cracwhore

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Actually, the US Military is currently working towards the HUD system.

So - having a compass with waypoints (identifying friendly forces and objectives), current hydration levels, heart rate and a vid-screen for communications (maps, text, picture and video intel) - is compeltely viable and likely.

However, having a little screen showing what weapon you're using, probably isn't.
 

UN17

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"Soldier! You are currently holding the M8 unified weapon system. It is currently in the automatic firing mode. In the event you forget what you are holding, we have provided an icon on your Landwarrior heads-up-display."
 

MP_Lord_Kee

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Personally I don't think removing the HUD would be that good idea. As I see it, there has to be a trade-off between realism and situation awareness.
In real life combat situation, a solder is much more aware of his surroundings and what is going on than what you can depict on a flat monitor and 3d graphics. Field of view, sound cues and so on are things that can't be recreated authenticly and thus a well implemented HUD is IMHO something of a requirement than issue of complete removal.

But it should ofcourse not take the focus of the game or else it would be like flying a plane in a sim or similar. In my opinion crosshairs, identification of friend or foe should not be implemented with a HUD as those can be done well without (ironsights, camoflage) but compass, carret indicating who spoke etc...

//K
 

Vega-don

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i think theire should be a movement indicator in the hud, if something moves that is in the real life FOV (180 deg) but not on the screen (90 deg fov), you see a little icon
 

flamingknives

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Oct 23, 2004
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I must confess, I very rarely look at it other than to work out which weapon I've got up. This is realistic, since if, in real life, I were holding a gun, I might notice the difference between a pistol and a rifle, or which trigger (rifle or grenade launcher) I've got my finger on.

I can also tell if I'm carrying too much kit, a skill notably absent with regards to my little pixeltruppen avatar. The HUD tells you what you'd know in RL anyway.
 

Harrm

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Oct 21, 2001
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Close, ban, kick Harrm... as real as it gets.

Go to hell.

You tell me if you like it

I played the entirety of the ILCR and most of my matches without it. In fact, I even got some of my clanmates to do it and they mentioned how they relied on the HUD so much that turning it off hindered their performance considerably.

Actually, the US Military is currently working towards the HUD system.

Your "average joe" soldier is stil very, very far away from a HUD. Special forces aren't even using them regularly in combat conditions.

Field of view, sound cues and so on are things that can't be recreated authenticly and thus a well implemented HUD is IMHO something of a requirement than issue of complete removal.

Battle is a chaotic and disturbing affair. Anybody who has seen actual combat will attest to this. Humans have 180 degree of vision, but only about 45 degrees in which we can focus on an object, and if you cant focus on it, you sure as hell cant shoot it.

Also, you are either shooting your enemy, or looking at the compass/checking ammo/etc. In no situation is a soldier in combat ever doing both at the same time. Also for checking which trigger you're on, I think there's already plenty visual cue to tell you what you're firing.

--Harrm

EDIT:
By the way Harrm, move to Canada.

...what?
 
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Vega-don

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you can focus at a 45 deg only but you can notice any movement within the 180deg, and under a certain range.

so maybe we need implementation of detection by icon only when theire is a enemy movement and only if the FOV is static (you dont notice something moving when theire is things moving all around).
 

keihaswarrior

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HUD items that could be removed:
1. Stamina bar (breathing, heartbeat tell you)
2. Posture (If using true 1st person, then just glance down at yourself)
3. Current weapons carried (only pops up when switching, dropping, picking up, changing weapons and equipment or when QA menu button is held)
4. Weird little diamond above posture icon
5. Reinforcements left (leave this on the F1 menu)
6. QA button (only show when pressing QA key or opening menu)
7. Compass (just have a real 3d compass to glance at)
8. Text box could be much less obtrusive

--That's everything!

In the future, we will probably need to had a wound icon to the HUD to tell you where you hurt, why you can't use your right arm and such.
 

flamingknives

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Oct 23, 2004
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In real life:
1)I don't need to listen to my breathing to know how knackered I am or if I'm carrying too much stuff
2) I don't need to look at myself to know if i'm standing up, crouching, ready to walk or sprint
3) It's pretty obvious which weapon I'm holding, without needing to look

As for which trigger I'm on, I don't need to look. I know.

Perhaps you could remove what mode of fire the weapon's on, but that can also be checked by brushing the selector switch, which is often placed in a suitable place for doing so.

These tactile clues cannot be passed on directly, so they must be passed on in another way. Listening for breathing and looking to see how you're standing are ridiculous and unrealistic ways of hamstringing a player.
 
Apr 21, 2003
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keihaswarrior said:
HUD items that could be removed:
1. Stamina bar (breathing, heartbeat tell you)
Disagree. You know it without to check the breath, or guess. tzhats why an stamina indication should exist, but it should be a nondominant and abstract info on the screen, that doesn't look like a timer, or battery display, but like something intuitive.

2. Posture (If using true 1st person, then just glance down at yourself)
Nah, you know what you do without the need to check how your legs are, lol. A small and as said above untechnical, but intuitive symbol should tell you in the HUD.

3. Current weapons carried (only pops up when switching, dropping, picking up, changing weapons and equipment or when QA menu button is held)
There I agree. You just know what you have, but they should be a way to check your full gear status, what guns, what ammo. Maybe in the score table at the bottom.

4. Weird little diamond above posture icon
Explain please.

7. Compass (just have a real 3d compass to glance at)
Fully agreed. Also no objective indication in the HUD, it should work somehow more organic (no digital HUD info).

8. Text box could be much less obtrusive
Yes, it should be easy to read (if Team chatting and telling you important stuff), but should be small and at the corner somewhere, not glowing, but unnoticeable letters, that are just easy to read if you look at it.

In the future, we will probably need to had a wound icon to the HUD to tell you where you hurt, why you can't use your right arm and such.
Ansolutely, some games have that allready, but to simple. I would think of a for example green soldier icon at the right bottom (that includes posture indication), which shows in small red points the hits. The red point have an orange aura, the huge it is, the serious the injury is.
Light injury will have an orange point, or small area.
Falling from high stuff and hurt legs would show the feet and knees turn orange.

All that would not look like a HUD system, but with colored fade-ins. The injured legs would be orange colored and the color would fade into the normal (healthy) green color.

Active injury would pulsate (like real pain feels) and change color after time maybe. It should look organic and intuitive.

Small caliber hits on a vest would be marked with a small yellow area, which displays a hard punch into this body area, but

I made a picture just a short example.
 

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Harrm

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Regards to a wounded icon:
I disbelieve you'd need any of this. Getting shot in real life means shock, even with minor injuries; meaning you're out of combat. If you dont believe me, please, blow off your finger and then run 2 miles. And I mean, I think it'd be pretty obvious from the moment you've been shot where you where hit. Moving slow or knocked down? Leg injury. Not aiming right? Arms must be damaged. No stamina? Chest and torso wound. Not alive? Bring a helmet next time.

In real life:
1)I don't need to listen to my breathing to know how knackered I am or if I'm carrying too much stuff
2) I don't need to look at myself to know if i'm standing up, crouching, ready to walk or sprint
3) It's pretty obvious which weapon I'm holding, without needing to look

1-If you cant judge where your stamina is just by the speed at which you're moving in INF, you've got some serious motion issues.
2-Ditto.
3-You're blind.

Psychomorphs ungodly large post.
1-See #1 above.
2-Well, if I'm looking at a perspective about an inch away from the ground, and I'm not holding down my "croutch" key, there's a pretty good chance I'm either prone or dead.
8-Unnoticeable letters are never easy to read.

--Harrm
 
Apr 21, 2003
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Harrm said:
Regards to a wounded icon:
I disbelieve you'd need any of this. Getting shot in real life means shock, even with minor injuries; meaning you're out of combat. If you dont believe me, please, blow off your finger and then run 2 miles. And I mean, I think it'd be pretty obvious from the moment you've been shot where you where hit. Moving slow or knocked down? Leg injury. Not aiming right? Arms must be damaged. No stamina? Chest and torso wound. Not alive? Bring a helmet next time.
You would know when shock is over. You would have more information to know when your're ready to leave cover and run, or when you better stay low.
Starting to run, just to test if you can after the hit and dying cuz your're lame as hell and can't even move back for cover is frustrating. Total information of what you are able of is good.


1-See #1 above.
'1-If you cant judge where your stamina is just by the speed at which you're moving in INF, you've got some serious motion issues'.
At the right time I need to know it by knowing it, not by first testing it with a short run.

2-Well, if I'm looking at a perspective about an inch away from the ground, and I'm not holding down my "croutch" key, there's a pretty good chance I'm either prone or dead.
If I´m looking down a roof, standing on the corner I want to know if I am crouching or not, most important is, I want to know if the run is adjusted or the walk, not to fall down with the intention to make just a step.

8-Unnoticeable letters are never easy to read.
Unnoticeable when you do not look at it, noticeable when you look at it.
INF has unnoticeable letter when you do not look at it, but it's to transparent to read it with some backgrounds.
AA:O, has clear noticeable letters, sadly when you do not look at it they shine green in the HUD to hard, which is not good when you fight in a very dark place.
I would prefer an 'auto adjusting HUD' (if feasable). In a bright place it is normal, in a dark place it turns darker, or a bit transparent, not to disturb your eyes.

Soluton, the letters should be at the corner (not to close to the centre) and should have a color, that is not bright, not glowing, good to be read on most backgrounds at the same time. Light brown, sandy and greyish green colors fit for that.

Psychomorphs ungodly large post.
Because of the ungodly quotes.
 
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