The point is it's easier to do a Google search for a torrent than it is to get a chip installed on a motherboard, or find some way to install a custom firmware. Most people don't even know what firmware is.
PC Gaming and Piracy: Examined
- Thread starter Jacks:Revenge
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I think you misunderstand, when i talk about "the most hardcore" of pirates, i'm not talking about the people who are downloading the games, anyone can do that, but the people who make it possible for them to do so, the crackers, the hackers that break into comanies FTP's, the insiders who leak the content, that whole network of people who make it all happen.
You will find a similar network on the Console side of the devide, but it seems to me that the most veteran of thease people deal with the PC exclusively, but, if this mythical move to Console where to happen, thease guys would follow suit, and that's a lot of malicious talent that would be bearing down on that platform then, and everyone would be out to make a name for themselves all over again..
Basically, what i'm saying is this: the hurdles that makes Console piracy tricky right now, mostly the fact that MS could sniff you out and disable your account, might not stay the same in my mythical example, if you've got all the crackers of the world working on the issue, then who's to say they wont come up with new solutions to get around the DRM? they have certainly been good at it in the past.
You have to wrap your head around the hypothetical, IF this happened, then is it really safe to assume that things would stay exactly the same? that what we're seeing now is what we'd be seeing then? or would things change? and if so, how? give it a good hard think, it's fun! and if you can't find that fun, then you sir, are worse than Hitler
You will find a similar network on the Console side of the devide, but it seems to me that the most veteran of thease people deal with the PC exclusively, but, if this mythical move to Console where to happen, thease guys would follow suit, and that's a lot of malicious talent that would be bearing down on that platform then, and everyone would be out to make a name for themselves all over again..
Basically, what i'm saying is this: the hurdles that makes Console piracy tricky right now, mostly the fact that MS could sniff you out and disable your account, might not stay the same in my mythical example, if you've got all the crackers of the world working on the issue, then who's to say they wont come up with new solutions to get around the DRM? they have certainly been good at it in the past.
You have to wrap your head around the hypothetical, IF this happened, then is it really safe to assume that things would stay exactly the same? that what we're seeing now is what we'd be seeing then? or would things change? and if so, how? give it a good hard think, it's fun! and if you can't find that fun, then you sir, are worse than Hitler
I haven't been following your discussion but what the hell are you guys talking about? I don't even know what Grobut is arguing FOR. That hypothetical situation sounds pretty stupid and pointless to talk about though, if there were no PC's then there would be NO pirating, because hackers wouldn't be able to... HACK.
Also more hackers working on something doesn't make the hardware modifications needed magically disappear.
Also more hackers working on something doesn't make the hardware modifications needed magically disappear.
You give hackers far, far too much credit. They can beat any system, but not perfectly, and not at all times. With something like XBL, there are intermittent lock-outs and for this reason, most people are afraid to roll the dice. Like I said before, the worst that can happen on the PC is that you get locked out of the game you didn't play until you get another crack. On console, when they lock you out, that's for everything, which turns that $300 console into a brick. For this reason console modding will never be as much as PC modding (and that's only if it's a simply firmware flash/software hack--if you have to rip open your console and physically mod it then even more people are hesitant).
If in some mythical example, MS was no longer spending a great deal of time and effort to combat piracy and lock out modders, etc., then sure, console piracy would certainly be as rampant as PC piracy, but as good as hackers are, it's a tug of war between devs and them and when someone gets the upper hand, it is temporarily before there is another flip. So hackers mod, ms cracks and bans those who aren't paying attention and update with something that bricks them, hackers post warnings to others, crack ms which lasts for a bit, ms does another wave of bans/bricking of systems, etc.
~Jason
If in some mythical example, MS was no longer spending a great deal of time and effort to combat piracy and lock out modders, etc., then sure, console piracy would certainly be as rampant as PC piracy, but as good as hackers are, it's a tug of war between devs and them and when someone gets the upper hand, it is temporarily before there is another flip. So hackers mod, ms cracks and bans those who aren't paying attention and update with something that bricks them, hackers post warnings to others, crack ms which lasts for a bit, ms does another wave of bans/bricking of systems, etc.
~Jason
I really think you're overestimating the power that hackers have on consoles anyway. It's not like every console game makes it's way to PC, so why wouldn't those games be pirated more? They are pirated pretty much the same amount on consoles as any other console game is pirated (presumably).
The risk of hacking a console is MUCH higher than a PC could ever be. There are a variety of ways you can turn your console into a paperweight, by flashing the firmware incorrectly, mis-soldering the mod chip you decided to use, etc. None of these are issues on the PC and will ALWAYS make the pirate crowd on consoles more exclusive and make would-be hackers more hesitant (particularly within the warranty period of the unit they purchased, which gives the manufacturer a huge amount of time to keep them from pirating and soak up their cash coffers).
Like I said before, for the most part anyone who WANTS to pirate on consoles is already doing so. Some of them are being banned from Xbox Live. Some of the units are now bricks and they can't afford a new one. Some of them have probably bought new Xboxes and are not hacking on them. The point being that all the factors that affect why people pirate on consoles now wouldn't change if there were no PC games, and there is no reason to assume that the percentage of people willing to do it would increase whatsoever.
The risk of hacking a console is MUCH higher than a PC could ever be. There are a variety of ways you can turn your console into a paperweight, by flashing the firmware incorrectly, mis-soldering the mod chip you decided to use, etc. None of these are issues on the PC and will ALWAYS make the pirate crowd on consoles more exclusive and make would-be hackers more hesitant (particularly within the warranty period of the unit they purchased, which gives the manufacturer a huge amount of time to keep them from pirating and soak up their cash coffers).
Like I said before, for the most part anyone who WANTS to pirate on consoles is already doing so. Some of them are being banned from Xbox Live. Some of the units are now bricks and they can't afford a new one. Some of them have probably bought new Xboxes and are not hacking on them. The point being that all the factors that affect why people pirate on consoles now wouldn't change if there were no PC games, and there is no reason to assume that the percentage of people willing to do it would increase whatsoever.
Didn't the USA government say fudge you, to a software firm.
Then had some other company crack that software, and used it because it was so good.
Then had some other company crack that software, and used it because it was so good.
Softmods are equally risky to hardware mods. You still run the risk of having a metal paperweight that can't do anything.
SleepyHe4d, whilst he clearly hasen't understood the hypothetical, is right, this is getting way off topic, and more than a little stupid, so lets just wrap this up:
I say that if people coulden't pirate the games on the PC, there would just be more piracy on the Consoles instead, you guys apparently think all thease pirates would just give up piracy because it's slightly more difficult and there could be a minor risk involved, i say that's pap because consoles are sold real cheap, but a good library of games costs a small fortune, even if they where to loose the occational Xbox, it would be cheaper to pirate, and it only gets cheaper the more games they pirate.
The End.
I say that if people coulden't pirate the games on the PC, there would just be more piracy on the Consoles instead, you guys apparently think all thease pirates would just give up piracy because it's slightly more difficult and there could be a minor risk involved, i say that's pap because consoles are sold real cheap, but a good library of games costs a small fortune, even if they where to loose the occational Xbox, it would be cheaper to pirate, and it only gets cheaper the more games they pirate.
The End.
It doesn't matter.
I'm saying in this hypothetical situation, if the number of console gamers now is 30 million and there are 3 million pirates, if there were suddenly 300 million console gamers, the wouldn't be more than 30 million pirates. Nobody is claiming that piracy would or could disappear on consoles.
The point is, 30 million PC gamers = 30 million people who can pirate immediately. 30 million console gamers = 0 people who can pirate immediately.
People pirate because they can.
How do do stop piracy?
Don't make anythig you don't want to be copied.
PS: Piracy started with the caveman.
You need to see the movie "Quest For Fire".
How do do stop piracy?
Don't make anythig you don't want to be copied.
PS: Piracy started with the caveman.
You need to see the movie "Quest For Fire".
"Do not make illegal copies of this fire"
"You wouldn't download fire!"
Neolithic DRM was more effective in scaring potential pirates off though. Getting your console bricked is tough alright, but getting clubbed to death with a mammoth bone is an entirely different beast.
May be something for ubi to think about.
"You wouldn't download fire!"
Neolithic DRM was more effective in scaring potential pirates off though. Getting your console bricked is tough alright, but getting clubbed to death with a mammoth bone is an entirely different beast.
May be something for ubi to think about.
Some companies/publishers really don't do themselves any favours do they.
The release of Metro 2033 here in the U.K. is a joke.
The release of Metro 2033 here in the U.K. is a joke.
I guess I am the odd ball. I really like owning the game itself in all it's glory. I do however agree that if the game is going to be a pain in the ass to get to work because of DRM, or is a pain because it requires internet access at all time, I will usually pirate it, or find a crack to use it without following their stupid B.S.